It was a foul ball caught for an out.

 

Here's an interesting tidbit. What do you put in the book if the LF drops this foul ball?

 

Normally, I would put E7, strike (depending on the strike count). The catch is an out, if caught. So, if not caught it's an error.

Here are a few more:

 

1. 1-2 count. 0 out. Runners on 1st(R1) and 3rd(R3). Pitcher delivers the ball to the plate legally, but the pitch is in the dirt and is taken by the batter. The catcher jumps up and starts looking around for the ball. Upon seeing this R3 breaks for home. The catcher finds the ball behind his chest protector and quickly pulls it out and tags R3. What is the call?

 

Dead ball, all runners advance one base.

Runner at 3rd and a squeeze play is on. The batter bunts the ball in fair territory but it stays close to home plate (in fact bounces on home plate). The runner slides home and hits the ball. What's the call?

Dead ball, all runners advance one base.

 

Per 5.09(g): "Ball is dead . . . when, a pitched ball lodges in the umpire's or catcher's mask or paraphenalia, and remains out of play, runners advance one base."

 

I just don't see how a ball that gets behind a catcher's protector for a few brief seconds puts this ball out of play. This rule seems to imply that the ball is genuinely "lodged" (i.e. stuck) in part of the catcher/umpire's gear and can't be quickly removed, thereby making it "out of play."

Runner at 3rd and a squeeze play is on. The batter bunts the ball in fair territory but it stays close to home plate (in fact bounces on home plate). The runner slides home and hits the ball. What's the call?

 

I'd say runner out, dead ball, batter awarded first base.

I'd say runner out, dead ball, batter awarded first base.

Correct.

Per 5.09(g): "Ball is dead . . . when, a pitched ball lodges in the umpire's or catcher's mask or paraphenalia, and remains out of play, runners advance one base."

 

I just don't see how a ball that gets behind a catcher's protector for a few brief seconds puts this ball out of play. This rule seems to imply that the ball is genuinely "lodged" (i.e. stuck) in part of the catcher/umpire's gear and can't be quickly removed, thereby making it "out of play."

 

Ump's decision, I guess. The ump would have to determine if the ball is, indeed, out of play.

Per 5.09(g): "Ball is dead . . . when, a pitched ball lodges in the umpire's or catcher's mask or paraphenalia, and remains out of play, runners advance one base."

 

I just don't see how a ball that gets behind a catcher's protector for a few brief seconds puts this ball out of play. This rule seems to imply that the ball is genuinely "lodged" (i.e. stuck) in part of the catcher/umpire's gear and can't be quickly removed, thereby making it "out of play."

 

For the record I'm using NFHS rules:

 

As per the "dead ball" and "delayed dead ball" table, under the "dead ball" heading:

 

5-1-1: "Ball dead immediately when a pitch or ball thrown by pitcher from plate goes into stand, bench, over or through fence, backstop, or touches a spectator (in live ball area) or lodges in umpire's or catcher's equipment."

 

I define "lodged" as not coming out in a natural course of events. So in the example I cited, the player had to get the ball out of his catching gear. That would be lodged in my book.

 

Correct on #3. Many people don't realize the 'ol 1 from the mound, 2 from the field applies to this situation as well.

Per 5.09(g): "Ball is dead . . . when, a pitched ball lodges in the umpire's or catcher's mask or paraphenalia, and remains out of play, runners advance one base."

 

I just don't see how a ball that gets behind a catcher's protector for a few brief seconds puts this ball out of play. This rule seems to imply that the ball is genuinely "lodged" (i.e. stuck) in part of the catcher/umpire's gear and can't be quickly removed, thereby making it "out of play."

 

I assume your using MLB rules?? I'm very interested, as I never knew there was a difference(or at the very least a different wording) in this case.

 

To clarify the ball being "stuck": A ball that goes behind the catchers gear and falls out when he stands up isn't stuck or lodged IMO. Now, if he has to do the shimmy shimmy to get it to fall out or reach in and get it, then it is stuck. I'd also cite safety issues at the HS level, as we use the same "quick kill" for balls that get stuck in between a poorly sealed backstop or loose nets on the backstop.

Happen to be home today, so I checked my books. At this point, I'm not sure where I erred on #1, so I'll have to wait to see what you say. It would seem that the ball remained in play (no different than ball getting stuff in webbing of a player's glove) and no penalties. For #3, I'll try again and say to put the batter-runner on second base and move all other runners accordingly. The ball is clearly out of play, thus a two-base award. I should have said this originally - wasn't thinking.

 

There is a clear distinction made(at least at the HS level, I'll check my NCAA and MLB books) in between the webbing of a fielders glove and issues involving the catcher's or umpire's equipment. I'm about 95% certain that the same distinction is made at the NCAA level.

 

For the record I've probably watched or witnessed this (lodged pitch) called a half dozen times. In those half dozen times I have seen:

 

A) A one base award

B) A two base award

C) Nothing......just let the runners run :jump:

D) A balk. Yes, a balk. The umpire equated it to the "hidden ball trick". At least he got the award right.

I assume your using MLB rules?? I'm very interested, as I never knew there was a difference(or at the very least a different wording) in this case.

 

To clarify the ball being "stuck": A ball that goes behind the catchers gear and falls out when he stands up isn't stuck or lodged IMO. Now, if he has to do the shimmy shimmy to get it to fall out or reach in and get it, then it is stuck. I'd also cite safety issues at the HS level, as we use the same "quick kill" for balls that get stuck in between a poorly sealed backstop or loose nets on the backstop.

 

Yes, I tend to know MLB rules better since I coach a SWOL team and that league uses MLB rules. I'm trying to learn the differences between MLB and NFHS rules, as I know there are quite a few, and really need to get myself an NFHS rulebook if I'm going to accomplish this.

 

I can already tell there is a big difference in wording on the play we're discussing involving the catcher. MLB 5.09(g) discusses a "pitched" ball lodging in the equipment and "remaining out of play", but does not make any mention of a thrown ball. I am just taking a leap to assume the thrown ball would be included in this definition. I also could find no clear definition of "lodged" or "remains out of play" in either the MLB rulebook or the MLB casebook I have. So I guess, per MLB, this would fall under 9.01© that the umpire has authority to rule of anything not specifically covered in the rulebook (assuming, of course, this is is not in fact in there somewhere!). If you find anything more definitive on this please let me know, as I enjoy this type of stuff. :jump:

Yes, I tend to know MLB rules better since I coach a SWOL team and that league uses MLB rules. I'm trying to learn the differences between MLB and NFHS rules, as I know there are quite a few, and really need to get myself an NFHS rulebook if I'm going to accomplish this.

 

I can already tell there is a big difference in wording on the play we're discussing involving the catcher. MLB 5.09(g) discusses a "pitched" ball lodging in the equipment and "remaining out of play", but does not make any mention of a thrown ball. I am just taking a leap to assume the thrown ball would be included in this definition. I also could find no clear definition of "lodged" or "remains out of play" in either the MLB rulebook or the MLB casebook I have. So I guess, per MLB, this would fall under 9.01© that the umpire has authority to rule of anything not specifically covered in the rulebook (assuming, of course, this is is not in fact in there somewhere!). If you find anything more definitive on this please let me know, as I enjoy this type of stuff. :jump:

 

Actually, the SWOL rules are more like NFHS (especially below 18) than MLB. Add to that the fact that many of the umpires incorrectly apply, or revert back to HS rules, and the end result is much the same as a HS game. For instance, most SWOL games do not include major rules differences such as: the slide rule(including the wide slide and oversliding), malicious contact, substitution/re-entry, live/dead ball balk, etc.

 

If you need a NFHS rule book I have way too many from years past lying around here that the wife would love to see go. Or you can email Julian Tackett at the KHSAA and I'm sure he'd be happy to help you out.

Actually, the SWOL rules are more like NFHS (especially below 18) than MLB. Add to that the fact that many of the umpires incorrectly apply, or revert back to HS rules, and the end result is much the same as a HS game. For instance, most SWOL games do not include major rules differences such as: the slide rule(including the wide slide and oversliding), malicious contact, substitution/re-entry, live/dead ball balk, etc.

If you need a NFHS rule book I have way too many from years past lying around here that the wife would love to see go. Or you can email Julian Tackett at the KHSAA and I'm sure he'd be happy to help you out.

 

We play at the 16U level and use MLB rules on sliding into the bases, as well as the delayed dead ball on balks (the mechanics that the umps use when they call this tend to immediately stop the pitcher and results in no pitch being thrown anyway). The re-entry rule for starters is obviously different, as is the avoidance of contact at the plate. Otherwise, however, it should be MLB rules. As I understand it, there is a big difference in balks between NFHS and MLB (a lot more instances of balks in NFHS). The tournaments we play in usually go by straight NFHS, though.

We play at the 16U level and use MLB rules on sliding into the bases, as well as the delayed dead ball on balks (the mechanics that the umps use when they call this tend to immediately stop the pitcher and results in no pitch being thrown anyway). The re-entry rule for starters is obviously different, as is the avoidance of contact at the plate. Otherwise, however, it should be MLB rules. As I understand it, there is a big difference in balks between NFHS and MLB (a lot more instances of balks in NFHS). The tournaments we play in usually go by straight NFHS, though.

 

Is the "gorilla stance" a balk in the summer?

Is the "gorilla stance" a balk in the summer?

 

Guess I'd have to know what a "gorilla stance" is to answer that!! :lol: