My experience with my son's dog being hit by the car (see GD Forum) has inspired the following queries: Do animals have souls? Are there animals in Heaven? I pose the questions for scriptural review and research. Heretofore, I did not think so, but Genesis 2 says that God breathed into the animals nostrils similar to the way He did with Adam. You also have animals around after the New Heaven and Earth are created in Revelation, you have horses coming with the armies of Heaven in Revelation and you have 'ol Elijah and two horses going on up to Heaven in a chariot. Discuss amongst yourselves.

I do not think Animals have eternal souls that will pass from this life to the next. Animals are not in need of salvation (from what?) and they are not capable of understanding having a relationship with God. Although they are definitley capable of love and devotion.

 

Whether there will be animals in Heaven, I can't say. What other things will we have in heaven that we have on Earth? Mansions is one. Maybe pets are another. I don't know.

 

If animals are in Heaven, they will be there on a free pass, for our benefit, and not because of any righteousness on their part.

Thought provoking Hearsay. I guess one of the best answers to that for me came from Billy Graham.

Q: Will there be animals in heaven?

 

A: God has a special reason and place for each of His created beings. Animals, too, are a part of an orderly creation by God. Man, as the highest order of creation, has been given dominion over the animal kingdom (Genesis 1:26-28). We believe that animals were intended for man's enjoyment and use. The Bible itself does not indicate that there is life after death for animals. It may be that God's purpose for animals is fulfilled on this earth. However, if animals would make us happier in heaven, surely there will be a place for them there. Some Bible interpreters have called attention to Isaiah's description of the peace of God's future kingdom where he says that "the wolf and the lamb will feed together, and the lion will eat straw like the ox" (Isaiah 65:25). Heaven will lack nothing that is good and that will bring glory to God.

http://www.billygraham.org/LFA_Article.asp?ArticleID=26

What Does Billy Graham

Say About Pets?

 

Mr. Graham, you probably get this question a lot, but do you think we will be reunited with our pets in Heaven? Our dog died recently after almost 15 years, and I just can't imagine being happy in Heaven unless he is with us. - Mrs. S.J.

 

Dear Mrs. S. J., God will provide us with everything we need to be happy in Heaven -- and if animals are necessary to make us completely happy there, then you can be confident He will arrange for them to be with us.

 

Some Bible scholars have pointed out that the Bible suggests that there may be animals in Heaven -- but without the aggressiveness and dangers that are part of their lives now. The prophet Isaiah saw God's coming Kingdom as a place of absolute peace, where even animals that had once been enemies will be friends. He wrote: "The wolf will live with the lamb, the leopard will lie down with the goat, the calf and the lion and the yearling together; and a little child will lead them." (Isaiah 11:6)

 

Over the years, my wife and I have had many pets, and I understand your grief; we are always sad when they die. I sometimes wonder, however, if God isn't using them to remind us of our own deaths. Life is brief, and it can end in an instant. The Bible says there is "a time to be born, and a time to die." (Ecclesiastes 3:2)

 

http://www.turn-lane.com/billygrahamspeaksaboutpets

I do not think Animals have eternal souls that will pass from this life to the next. Animals are not in need of salvation (from what?) and they are not capable of understanding having a relationship with God. Although they are definitley capable of love and devotion.

 

Whether there will be animals in Heaven, I can't say. What other things will we have in heaven that we have on Earth? Mansions is one. Maybe pets are another. I don't know.

 

If animals are in Heaven, they will be there on a free pass, for our benefit, and not because of any righteousness on their part.

I agree with Watusi. Our pets aren't going to be in heaven. But there may be animals and creatures we haven't even imagined in heaven.

I do not think Animals have eternal souls that will pass from this life to the next. Animals are not in need of salvation (from what?) and they are not capable of understanding having a relationship with God. Although they are definitley capable of love and devotion.

 

Whether there will be animals in Heaven, I can't say. What other things will we have in heaven that we have on Earth? Mansions is one. Maybe pets are another. I don't know.

 

If animals are in Heaven, they will be there on a free pass, for our benefit, and not because of any righteousness on their part.

Not sure the bolded is accurate. Several times in the Bible, it mentions that every creature brings glory and praise to God. They might not have a relationship as humans do, but I think there is some sort of relationship there.

 

Randy Alcorn's book Heaven has a very good section on this. He believes yes there is. Again, something about the use of the word creatures in heaven. I can't exactly remember and do not have the book handy.

 

I believe that there will be.

 

On the second bolded part, it will be because of the righteousness of Jesus Christ and for the benefit of God, not us. Somewhere, again can't remember where, Scripture indicates that Jesus' sacrifice was for MORE than just us. It was a sacrifice to bring the Earth back into where it was supposed to be.

 

I think that Jesus' sacrifice was for more and is a bigger thing than even we realize.

 

Eternal life could be on this planet, but a planet that is brought back into alignment with the way God created it. Think Garden of Eden. But once sin was introduced into this world, Earth changed.

 

Jesus was the sacrifice that not only allows us to have an eternal relationship with God in Heaven but also a sacrifice to allow this planet to be returned to the way it was supposed to be before we messed it up. (Al Gore would love that, wouldn't he. Biblical proof that man messed up this planet.)

I normally fall down with Watusi on almost every issue that arises, but I've got some serious questions about this one.

 

First, check out Isaiah 65:17-25. Seems pretty clear to me that God has said that He will have animals (specifically wolf, lamb, and lion among them) in the millenium and the New Earth.

 

Second, and more importantly in my mind, I found last night Romans 8:18-22, which claims that "the whole of Creation" is subject to suffering and "groaning" because of Man's Fall; and further that that creation is "longing" to be redeemed. If everybody got stuck with it because we plucked the apple from the tree, I cannot see any reason why when He returns, that all of His Creation might not be redeemed.

 

Now, that brings up somewhat of a paradox: if animals can be redeemed, should we not also be evangelizing to animals? My response to that would be that the scriptures continue to talk about our dominion over the animals - since they suffer because of our mistake, so too will they be redeemed because of our acceptance of the New Covenant.

 

Another paradox posed by that: does it then matter to a dog who his owner is?

 

This is good stuff. See if any of the other of you can find anything in scripture.

I do not think Animals have eternal souls that will pass from this life to the next. Animals are not in need of salvation (from what?) and they are not capable of understanding having a relationship with God. Although they are definitley capable of love and devotion.

 

Whether there will be animals in Heaven, I can't say. What other things will we have in heaven that we have on Earth? Mansions is one. Maybe pets are another. I don't know.

 

If animals are in Heaven, they will be there on a free pass, for our benefit, and not because of any righteousness on their part.

 

While I probably agree on your conclusion the bolded part bothers me for one reason. There are many people I have met that are not capable of such. For whatever mental problem they have inherited, there are great men and women who can not comprehend but I have a firm belief that they are included in God's grace. Then again I believe in the vast mystery of God's love and grace that I really wonder how much I really understand myself.

 

Not many to nitpick with you Watusi because I've always liked your posts and thoughts but I'm not sold on the mansion idea. That is a KJV creation out of the word monai which really means " a place where we live, dwell or abide." Grammatically it always was a problem as well in English. Why would Jesus say: " In my Fathers house are many other houses."? The message is that Jesus prepares a place for his own.

 

 

 

And now back to our regularly scheduled thread. :lol:

 

I am not too concerned about animals in heaven or not. I would say they won't be there but not upset if they are. Unless allergies come with us and then I hope the cats and horses are not anywhere near my lot.

I normally fall down with Watusi on almost every issue that arises, but I've got some serious questions about this one.

 

First, check out Isaiah 65:17-25. Seems pretty clear to me that God has said that He will have animals (specifically wolf, lamb, and lion among them) in the millenium and the New Earth.

 

Second, and more importantly in my mind, I found last night Romans 8:18-22, which claims that "the whole of Creation" is subject to suffering and "groaning" because of Man's Fall; and further that that creation is "longing" to be redeemed. If everybody got stuck with it because we plucked the apple from the tree, I cannot see any reason why when He returns, that all of His Creation might not be redeemed.

 

Now, that brings up somewhat of a paradox: if animals can be redeemed, should we not also be evangelizing to animals? My response to that would be that the scriptures continue to talk about our dominion over the animals - since they suffer because of our mistake, so too will they be redeemed because of our acceptance of the New Covenant.

 

Another paradox posed by that: does it then matter to a dog who his owner is?

 

This is good stuff. See if any of the other of you can find anything in scripture.

 

The bolded is the Scripture I was referring to in my post on Jesus sacrifice may have been for more than just us.

I normally fall down with Watusi on almost every issue that arises, but I've got some serious questions about this one.

 

First, check out Isaiah 65:17-25. Seems pretty clear to me that God has said that He will have animals (specifically wolf, lamb, and lion among them) in the millenium and the New Earth.

 

Second, and more importantly in my mind, I found last night Romans 8:18-22, which claims that "the whole of Creation" is subject to suffering and "groaning" because of Man's Fall; and further that that creation is "longing" to be redeemed. If everybody got stuck with it because we plucked the apple from the tree, I cannot see any reason why when He returns, that all of His Creation might not be redeemed.

 

Now, that brings up somewhat of a paradox: if animals can be redeemed, should we not also be evangelizing to animals? My response to that would be that the scriptures continue to talk about our dominion over the animals - since they suffer because of our mistake, so too will they be redeemed because of our acceptance of the New Covenant.

 

Another paradox posed by that: does it then matter to a dog who his owner is?

 

This is good stuff. See if any of the other of you can find anything in scripture.

First off, the millenium and new earth is not heaven.

 

Second, redemption doesn't always mean salvation. Many things can be redeemed without it meaning that they are going to heaven. I read that word "redeemed" in this verse as "restored", as in to restore the creation to its original design.

I normally fall down with Watusi on almost every issue that arises, but I've got some serious questions about this one.

 

First, check out Isaiah 65:17-25. Seems pretty clear to me that God has said that He will have animals (specifically wolf, lamb, and lion among them) in the millenium and the New Earth.

 

Second, and more importantly in my mind, I found last night Romans 8:18-22, which claims that "the whole of Creation" is subject to suffering and "groaning" because of Man's Fall; and further that that creation is "longing" to be redeemed. If everybody got stuck with it because we plucked the apple from the tree, I cannot see any reason why when He returns, that all of His Creation might not be redeemed.

 

Now, that brings up somewhat of a paradox: if animals can be redeemed, should we not also be evangelizing to animals? My response to that would be that the scriptures continue to talk about our dominion over the animals - since they suffer because of our mistake, so too will they be redeemed because of our acceptance of the New Covenant.

 

Another paradox posed by that: does it then matter to a dog who his owner is?

 

This is good stuff. See if any of the other of you can find anything in scripture.

 

 

:eek:

 

One of the issues I have with looking for prooftexts in this manner is are we taking something out of context? When the Bible says, "And the lamb will lie down with the lion," is that to be taken literally or a metaphor describing the era of the kingdom of God?

 

When Paul speaks about creation's groaning is he speaking of trees, animals, humans, et al specifically or describing the weight of sin on all of creation?

 

If we take it all literally, then will actual locusts with stings in their tails fly out of the smoking pit as is described in Revelation? Will four horsemen ride actual horses from the heavens into the world?

 

As far as evangelizing animals, there are some churches (In Martinsville the Catholic and Episcopal church) that hold an annual "blessing" service for your pets. This is from the story of Francis of Assissi and his activities. I don't know that they baptize them but they are blessed in some places. :thumb:

:confused::confused:

:eek:

 

One of the issues I have with looking for prooftexts in this manner is are we taking something out of context. When the Bible says, "And the lamb will lie down with the lion," is that to be taken literally or a metaphor describing the era of the kingdom of God?

 

When Paul speaks about creation's groaning is he speaking of trees, animals, humans, et al specifically or describing the weight of sin on all of creation?

 

If we take it all literally, then will actual locusts with stings in their tails fly out of the smoking pit as is described in Revelation? Will four horsemen ride actual horses from the heavens into the world?

 

As far as evangelizing animals, there are some churches (In Martinsville the Catholic and Episcopal church) that hold an annual "blessing" service for your pets. This is from the story of Francis of Assissi and his activities. I don't know that they baptize them but they are blessed in some places. :thumb:

 

Here is my problem with the bolded. Who decides whether we should take something as literal or not? Was Jesus temptation a literal supernatural story or not? I don't think I have the authority to take parts of the Bible and say this is fine, this is not and not literal.

Here is my problem with the bolded. Who decides whether we should take something as literal or not? Was Jesus temptation a literal supernatural story or not? I don't think I have the authority to take parts of the Bible and say this is fine, this is not and not literal.

 

But if we take it ALL literally then you haven't answered my locusts question yet from Revelation or the horses of the Apocalypse.

 

Sometimes it is decided by the genre of literature in which the scripture is written. For example, the Psalms are songs. Do you always take the literal words of a song or see sometimes the imagery involved?

 

When you read apocalyptic literature (i.e. Daniel, Revelation, parts of Ezekiel) you need to recognize that apocalyptic literature deals in hidden imagery and symbols. Hence the nature of the type of writing and its purpose.

 

When Jesus says, "Tear this temple down and in three days I will raise it back up again," did he mean the actual temple? No, It was a symbol of himself.

 

When Paul says "you are the body of Christ" is he talking about Jesus' actual ears, eyes, gut? Yes and no. Symbolically yes. Literally, I don't think so.

 

When Jesus says, "If your eye offends you, pluck it out," is he really saying to emasculate yourself? That literalism led to the "flagelance" of the Dark Ages and to an extreme rendering of that passage.

 

When Jesus said, "It's easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than a rich man to get into heaven," is this literal or figurative? If literal then it is absolutely impossible. If figurative then we begin to understand that such an act is impossible for the world but not for God. (See previous verses in that section and how that thought ties in.)

 

The truth is we all seek to decide what is meant literally and symbolically within scripture. Even those who say they take it literally (Tim Lahaye and such) pick and choose what is literal and what is figurative.

 

In my opinion Just because it is symbol does not rob it's meaning in the least. In my opinion it sheds even greater light on the eternal truth beyond the imagery nor does it take away from the authority and sacred nature of scripture for me.

But if we take it ALL literally then you haven't answered my locusts question yet from Revelation or the horses of the Apocalypse.

 

Sometimes it is decided by the genre of literature in which the scripture is written. For example, the Psalms are songs. Do you always take the literal words of a song or see sometimes the imagery involved?

 

When you read apocalyptic literature (i.e. Daniel, Revelation, parts of Ezekiel) you need to recognize that apocalyptic literature deals in hidden imagery and symbols. Hence the nature of the type of writing and its purpose.

 

When Jesus says, "Tear this temple down and in three days I will raise it back up again," did he mean the actual temple? No, It was a symbol of himself.

 

When Paul says "you are the body of Christ" is he talking about Jesus' actual ears, eyes, gut? Yes and no. Symbolically yes. Literally, I don't think so.

 

When Jesus says, "If your eye offends you, pluck it out," is he really saying to emasculate yourself? That literalism led to the "flagelance" of the Dark Ages and to an extreme rendering of that passage.

 

When Jesus said, "It's easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than a rich man to get into heaven," is this literal or figurative? If literal then it is absolutely impossible. If figurative then we begin to understand that such an act is impossible for the world but not for God. (See previous verses in that section and how that thought ties in.)

 

The truth is we all seek to decide what is meant literally and symbolically within scripture. Even those who say they take it literally (Tim Lahaye and such) pick and choose what is literal and what is figurative.

 

In my opinion Just because it is symbol does not rob it's meaning in the least. In my opinion it sheds even greater light on the eternal truth beyond the imagery nor does it take away from the authority and sacred nature of scripture for me.

 

Good post and helps me a lot on a subject that I am honestly confused about.

"The wolf will live with the lamb, the leopard will lie down with the goat, the calf and the lion and the yearling together; and a little child will lead them." (Isaiah 11:6)

kygirl quoted the exact verse that leapt to my mind when I opened this thread. LBBC makes excellent points as well.

 

Let me ask all of you. What exactly leaps to mind when you envision Heaven?

 

200 foot gates carved from a single enormous pearl... streets paved with gold... no darkness, sickness, sadness, or loss ever again... people dressed in white robes wafting blissfully about... sitting on a cloud plucking a harp... reuniting with loved ones... crystal rivers... street after street of immaculate mansions?

 

I hope it's not 72 virgins awaiting to fulfill your every whim. :eek:

 

I mean really... when you think about it we have a lot of stereotypes programmed into our heads from TV commercials for cream cheese to movies to old Bugs Bunny cartoons to... well you get the point. We’ve already been brainwashed by our culture, but are those images accurate?

 

The KJV of the Bible contains over 550 specific mentions of the word “heaven.” Now admittedly, many of these refer to the sky or atmosphere surrounding the earth. Others refer to the broader created space beyond earth, (i.e.- solar system, planets, galaxies and universe itself.) Others refer to the actual spiritual/physical place inhabited by God Himself. This is confusing to us reading English only… but a perusal of the original Hebrew and Greek texts reveals specific words that distinguish each as separate and unique created spaces.

 

I would love to spend the day digging out actual Bible verses that provide us a glimpse of what awaits those who accept Jesus Christ as our Savior and make Him our Lord. Unfortunately, I just don’t have that luxury at this time. I can however, positively state that our limited four dimensional (height, width, depth and time) human minds can only begin to imagine the very real place that actually awaits us.

 

A good illustration of this is to find a quiet spot and try to imagine infinity. You can’t do it. Your brain takes you so far and either hits a wall or reboots. (I refer to this as the CTRL/ALT/DEL phenomenon.) If our minds cannot fully grasp infinity, eternity, forever, endlessness… we cannot begin to comprehend God. God exists beyond time. Heaven is not bound to clocks or calendars.

 

Jesus tells us in John 14:1-3 “Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me. In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.”

 

Paul tells us in 1 Corinthians 2:9 “However, as it is written: "No eye has seen, no ear has heard, no mind has conceived what God has prepared for those who love him"—“

 

We’re told earlier in John 1:1-3 “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.”

 

The point I’d like to make from my literalist POV that genuinely believes that the Bible is the revealed and accurate Word of God to us is:

 

• If Jesus was/is the Creator of all that exists. (John 1:1-3, Genesis 1:1, etc.)
  
• And He did His original work in six days. (Genesis 1:1, 1:31, 2:1, Exodus 20:11, etc.)
  
• And He tells us he’s going away to prepare a place for us.
  
• And He’s had over 718,000 literal days of our time to do His work. (For all you sophisticated non-literalists… as God, He’s not constrained by our accounting of time anyway... so lighten up... :lol:)
  

 

-- Result --

• WOW! We cannot imagine what awaits us.
  

 

Heaven is going to be the most fun place you’ve ever been. There will be shouting, dancing and rejoicing. (Even for Baptists… :lol: ) There will be "fullness of joy."

 

I have no doubts that Heaven will be populated by more animals than we can ever know or imagine. I can’t say whether Ginger or Flippy or Corky or Poppin or Snickerdoodle or Butch or Leo or Miss Kitty or any of our family pets will make the journey, but I can state without a doubt that Heaven will not be a boring place.