I know, things are so bad! The economy is doing great, remember in '92 when Clinton said "its the economy stupid"? I guess that doesn't count when its doing good. Unemployment is at record lows, but that does not count either. More people are homeowners than ever before, but once again that does not matter.

Rush is a moron; but there aren't any real answers coming from either side of the extremes. They're real good at describing how bad the other side is; but come up short in the solution department!

I think you are exactly right, Wild West. I think that the extremes of both parties are more interested in getting (and retaining) political power than they are in fixing the problems that we have in this country.

 

Moderates are our only hope.

 

 

Frances

What is a moderate? What beliefs does a moderate hold? Why are moderate beliefs better than liberal beliefs or conservative beliefs?

A fair question, shooter.

 

When I say "moderate" I am referring to someone that doesn't represent either extreme. There are moderates in both parties.

 

I think one of the easiest way to spot a moderate is that he (she) is occasionally frowned upon by their own party.

 

As for your question "what beliefs does a moderate hold", I would say that they are quite varied. One moderate (from either party) might be Pro-Life, while another might be Pro-Choice. One moderate might be a fiscal conservative, while another might be more willing to support a given program that requires federal funding.

 

I guess the bottom line (for me, at least) is that moderates may fall on either side of a given issue, but that stance is usually offset by their position on other core issues.

 

As for the "why are they better", I think they are better because they tend to be able to move important legislation through the process, by making deals on other issues. If the only choice we had were extremists (either party), the only thing we would do is alternate between the two extremes, with a very divided culture.

 

 

Frances

Let's be clear on one thing. A moderate Democrat is still much more liberal than a moderate Republican. For some reason, you won't hear that on TV.

Let's be clear on one thing. A moderate Democrat is still much more liberal than a moderate Republican. For some reason, you won't hear that on TV.

 

 

I heard Howard Dean on TV claim that "all Democrats are moderates". I sure hope Dean is around for a long time if for no other reason than his entertainment value.:lol:

Let's be clear on one thing. A moderate Democrat is still much more liberal than a moderate Republican. For some reason, you won't hear that on TV.

I agree with your point, in general terms.

 

But I also think a lot of that is also due to how one breaks down the two parties. I know that there are fiscal conservatives, and social conservatives. There can be (but is not always) a big difference in what they want, in terms of political representation.

 

Same thing for Democrats. I know Democrats that are fiscally conservative, and socially liberal. I also know Democrats that are fiscally liberal and socially conservative.

 

Personally, in terms of fiscal responsibility, I am fairly conservative (but not to an extreme). On social issues, I'm pretty eclectic. It is not possible to be more conservative than I am when it comes to the death penalty, yet I beleive we have an obligation to help those that cannot help themselves. Like Fastbreak, I think there quickly comes a time where a person should be told to fish or cut bait. The "Welfare to Workfare" program was a stroke of genius, in my book (side note - I don't know who came up with the plan, but whoever it was, they have my backing).

 

I think that most people are some mix of conservative and liberal, depending on what issue is being discussed. I don't know many people that I've met in my life that are what I would call purely liberal or conservative, across all issues.

 

 

Frances

I agree with your point, in general terms.

 

But I also think a lot of that is also due to how one breaks down the two parties. I know that there are fiscal conservatives, and social conservatives. There can be (but is not always) a big difference in what they want, in terms of political representation.

 

Same thing for Democrats. I know Democrats that are fiscally conservative, and socially liberal. I also know Democrats that are fiscally liberal and socially conservative.

 

Personally, in terms of fiscal responsibility, I am fairly conservative (but not to an extreme). On social issues, I'm pretty eclectic. It is not possible to be more conservative than I am when it comes to the death penalty, yet I beleive we have an obligation to help those that cannot help themselves. Like Fastbreak, I think there quickly comes a time where a person should be told to fish or cut bait. The "Welfare to Workfare" program was a stroke of genius, in my book (side note - I don't know who came up with the plan, but whoever it was, they have my backing).

 

I think that most people are some mix of conservative and liberal, depending on what issue is being discussed. I don't know many people that I've met in my life that are what I would call purely liberal or conservative, across all issues.

 

 

Frances

 

I know what you mean. Democrats in Congress are very conservative with their own money, but when it comes to my money they are extremely liberal.

 

Seriously, I agree somewhat with what you are saying. Most Democrats in Kentucky, especially Eastern Kentucky (or at least the part I live in) are more conservative than nearly all Democrats and a lot of Republicans.

 

However, when all is said and done, although Democrats nationally want to be considered moderate (like there's not much difference in a Dem moderate and a Repub moderate), the Democratic party is overall much more liberal than the Republicans.

 

:bunny:

When I say "moderate" I am referring to someone that doesn't represent either extreme. There are moderates in both parties.

 

I think one of the easiest way to spot a moderate is that he (she) is occasionally frowned upon by their own party.

Excellent description Frances. I consider myself to be one of those frowned-upon moderates. Sometimes it feels like being the umpire at a little league game.

Excellent description Frances. I consider myself to be one of those frowned-upon moderates. Sometimes it feels like being the umpire at a little league game.

 

Been there, done that. Got a T-shirt, no tan. :cry:

 

 

Frances

Excellent description Frances. I consider myself to be one of those frowned-upon moderates. Sometimes it feels like being the umpire at a little league game.

How about a name for those of us in both parties who have minds of their own? I may be a conservative and a Republican, but I certainly don't agree with everything that other conservatives and Republicans agree with. I'd be willing to bet others feel similarly about their party.

How about a name for those of us in both parties who have minds of their own? I may be a conservative and a Republican, but I certainly don't agree with everything that other conservatives and Republicans agree with. I'd be willing to bet others feel similarly about their party.

Well, that's pretty much where I'm at. I don't want to go through issue by issue; but I'm a Republican. It's just that, like you, I don't follow a strict party line, leaning just right of center.

Well, that's pretty much where I'm at. I don't want to go through issue by issue; but I'm a Republican. It's just that, like you, I don't follow a strict party line, leaning just right of center.

I could join that party.:thumb: