I'm so tired of politics.

 

Screw up and blame someone else.

 

Instead of invoking the vast right wing conspiracy, Mr. Kerry's team would have exhibited sheer brilliance to have issued two simple words, with just a tiny bit of genuine humility... "I'm sorry." Kerry could have added something along the lines of, “I misspoke, and would in no way intentionally impugn the character or intellects of the fine men and women serving our nation in our military.” He then could have followed this with his typical diatribe against Bush and been right back on track.

 

Unfortunately, Mr. Kerry is so full of himself and his own importance, this did not happen.

 

Everyone has been so eager to point out how GWB would be more respected if he would simply say he's made some mistakes. It's interesting to hear those same (national) figures now defend the indefensible with Kerry.

 

Frances, I misspeak on a regular basis. I have found (through often painful personal experience) that it is good to realize when a faux pas has occurred, to take ownership of the words that came from my own mouth, and to sincerely apologize in a timely manner. This goes a long way toward healing.

Refresh my memory...exactly what is the Republican strategy with regard to Iraq?

 

Heck Teddy Bear - that's easy. The Republicans strategy with regard to Iraq is captured nicely, in their Eight Point Plan:

1) Start with an overly arrogant, poorly thought out strategy.

2) Accuse anyone that doesn't agree with your strategy of being unpatriotic.

3) When the political fallout from the quagmire starts to really heat up, recite the "Stay the Course" mantra until you are blue in the face.

4) Openly mock anyone that challenges the "Stay the Course" soundbite as being a "Cut and Run" gutless liberal that hates America. Important note - this includes shouting down anyone that wants to develop a timeline for a phased withdrawal.

5) When the polls show that 60% of the populace think the war is a disaster, continue to claim that if everyone would unconditionally back your plan, no changes would really need to be made.

6) When some of the members of your own party finally realize that their jobs in Congress are in serious jeopardy (due to those pesky voters that have the temerity to question the original plan), announce that it's time to review the "tactics" - but not the strategy - of the war.

7) As the possibility of losing control of Congress becomes a reality, begin to announce that a timeline for a phased withdrawal is in the offing.

8) And for the coup de grace - remind everyone that the Democrats don't have a plan, and hope like heck that the voters weren't paying attention, and don't notice that your new plan is exactly what those "Cut and Run" spineless liberals have been espousing for over a year and a half now. :thumb:

Kerry needs to stop running a negative campaign against somebody who is not eligible for another term. [/Quote] WOW!! That statement absolutely drips with irony. For anyone backing the Bush/Rove combination to say that they should not be the target of a negative campaign is off the charts.

 

 

An apology at this point, especially the kind of non-apology that you suggest in which the offender apologizes if his words were misinterpretted by somebody whose feelings were hurt, would not accomplish much. It's a little like when your mother makes you tell your brother that you are sorry for doing something that you believed that he had coming to him. When somebody has to force you to apologize for something that you have maintained requires no apology...well most people are not so intellectually lazy to recognize such apologies for what they are.

We all understand your description of a half hearted apology. My question still stands. If you aren't willing to accept the apology (if it is extended), then why demand it?

 

 

Frances

Help me out here. How does a lower SAT score, or a lower GPA make someone less prone to "botching a joke"? If anything, it would seem that it would make them more likely to make the mistake - not less.

 

 

Frances

 

I'd love to have seen Richard Pryor's SAT scores. Harvard must have been all over him.

It does not matter if he misspoke or not. It is completely inappropriate and stupid to make a joke about anything involving our troops. I do not care who it is aimed at. Especially at a time of war. Shows the utter lack of judgement he has.

 

That's fair.

... Mr. Kerry's team would have exhibited sheer brilliance to have issued two simple words, with just a tiny bit of genuine humility... "I'm sorry." Kerry could have added something along the lines of, “I misspoke, and would in no way intentionally impugn the character or intellects of the fine men and women serving our nation in our military.” He then could have followed this with his typical diatribe against Bush and been right back on track.[/Quote] I agree completely. That would have been the correct (and smart) thing to do.

 

Unfortunately, Mr. Kerry is so full of himself and his own importance, this did not happen.

 

Everyone has been so eager to point out how GWB would be more respected if he would simply say he's made some mistakes. It's interesting to hear those same (national) figures now defend the indefensible with Kerry.

 

Frances, I misspeak on a regular basis. I have found (through often painful personal experience) that it is good to realize when a faux pas has occurred, to take ownership of the words that came from my own mouth, and to sincerely apologize in a timely manner. This goes a long way toward healing.

 

I think this is probably the best post in this entire thread. The sad truth is that in this era of attack ads, and negative campaigning, we are usually faced with a slate of men and women that are almost afraid to admit a mistake, much less apologize for it and ask for forgiveness. It would be portrayed as a sign of weakness, and exploited for even further gain.

 

I know that I couldn't support you on all the planks in your platform, FB, but I'd be more than happy to speak well of you if you ran for office. Just don't quote me on that.

 

Frances

It does not matter if he misspoke or not. It is completely inappropriate and stupid to make a joke about anything involving our troops. I do not care who it is aimed at. Especially at a time of war. Shows the utter lack of judgement he has.

 

You are exactly right.

 

While we are condemning Kerry for his lack of judgement and good taste, let's keep in mind that the Bush himself committed this same egregiou error: http://politicalhumor.about.com/b/a/074838.htm

 

Not that it lessens the stupidity of what Kerry has done, but keep in mind that Bush is the person that put our servicemen and women in harm's way. To then attempt to joke about it is both "inappropriate and stupid" - as you have pointed out. Also, bear in mind that in the case of Bush's attempt at humor, there is absolutely no doubt about what he is saying, or who he is addressing. It was simply a case of bad timing, and inappropriate material. Without a doubt, he did NOT intend to make light of the plight of the people serving in Iraq - but that is effectively what he did.

 

Bottom line - both parties can lay claim to having made some incredibly stupid, inappropriate, and terribly misguided jokes about something that the vast majority of Americans find to be no laughing matter.

 

 

Frances

So, basically, what you are saying is that he should apologize, but even if he does, it is meaningless. If you are going to demand the apology, at least be gracious enough to accept it, if it comes.

That depends upon the nature of the apology. I don't know if you have children or not, but if you do then you also know how to discern a sincere apology from a non-apology. If someone says "I'm sorry, but...;" that is not a true apology, either.

 

I will withhold judgement until I hear an actual apology from Mr. Kerry (if there is one at all).

I'd love to have seen Richard Pryor's SAT scores. Harvard must have been all over him.

I'm afraid that Pryor wasn't born with a silver spoon in his mouth. Rather, he had a silver spoon in his nose as he aged.

 

 

Frances

That depends upon the nature of the apology. I don't know if you have children or not, but if you do then you also know how to discern a sincere apology from a non-apology. If someone says "I'm sorry, but...;" that is not a true apology, either.

 

I will withhold judgement until I hear an actual apology from Mr. Kerry (if there is one at all).

We all understand the idea of a half hearted apology. We just saw Limbaugh issue one to Michael J. Fox.

 

As for the possibility of Kerry issuing an apology, I doubt that his ego will allow him to extend one. That is why I keep saying "if it is extended".

 

Frances

Kerry is an idiot. And not even the loveable kind, the despicable kind. I hope the Dems have to keep making excuses for him for the next 50 years. Every time I see his face, or hear his words, I feel all warm and fuzzy inside.

We all understand the idea of a half hearted apology. We just saw Limbaugh issue one to Michael J. Fox.

 

As for the possibility of Kerry issuing an apology, I doubt that his ego will allow him to extend one. That is why I keep saying "if it is extended".

 

Frances

Pointing fingers elsewhere when one of your own is under attack is a typical and predicable ploy. Having said that, I'll bite:

 

I didn't think an apology was necessary, and never heard or read about one. Got a link???

Heck Teddy Bear - that's easy. The Republicans strategy with regard to Iraq is captured nicely, in their Eight Point Plan:

1) Start with an overly arrogant, poorly thought out strategy.

 

For Real -

 

Pretty much right on the head there.

I hated the idea then and absolutely KNEW it would be bad for us all.

Its like i'm pyschic! :thumb:

 

I didn't vote for Bush the first time.

When you hear the full clip he mentions the president several times. It is only when you cut it and islolate the line that it sounds so bad. When I first heard the clip I jumped to the same conclusion as everyone else. I thought, "What was that idiot thinking". Later, when I heard the longer version, it was very obvious what he was saying. It was still stupid to say it because he had to know that the Republcan lie machine would use ANY distortion they could. If Kerry could figure out how to engage his brain before he opens his mouth he would be president today.

Was it obvious he was talking about Bush a year ago when he called our troops terrorists going door to door in Iraq?

This fool has a history of saying negative things about our military and feels no remorse for it. Buy into his spin all you want, but I won't.

He was speaking to a group of college kids at a college about education, why would he refer to Bush as stupid when Bush actually scored higher than Kerry did in College?

Heck Teddy Bear - that's easy. The Republicans strategy with regard to Iraq is captured nicely, in their Eight Point Plan:

1) Start with an overly arrogant, poorly thought out strategy.

2) Accuse anyone that doesn't agree with your strategy of being unpatriotic.

3) When the political fallout from the quagmire starts to really heat up, recite the "Stay the Course" mantra until you are blue in the face.

4) Openly mock anyone that challenges the "Stay the Course" soundbite as being a "Cut and Run" gutless liberal that hates America. Important note - this includes shouting down anyone that wants to develop a timeline for a phased withdrawal.

5) When the polls show that 60% of the populace think the war is a disaster, continue to claim that if everyone would unconditionally back your plan, no changes would really need to be made.

6) When some of the members of your own party finally realize that their jobs in Congress are in serious jeopardy (due to those pesky voters that have the temerity to question the original plan), announce that it's time to review the "tactics" - but not the strategy - of the war.

7) As the possibility of losing control of Congress becomes a reality, begin to announce that a timeline for a phased withdrawal is in the offing.

8) And for the coup de grace - remind everyone that the Democrats don't have a plan, and hope like heck that the voters weren't paying attention, and don't notice that your new plan is exactly what those "Cut and Run" spineless liberals have been espousing for over a year and a half now. :thumb:

 

 

You're so good at coming up with the Republican plan, why can't you (or any other Dem) come up with a Dem plan?