I wonder how Obama or Hillary would feel is some drunk or criminal illegal immigrant killed their daughter or grandkid

 

Maybe they should see it the way others have who have lost loved ones to someone who had no business being here to begin with.

 

Am I supposed to feel better if a native born Anerican were responsible for the death of a loved one?? That's the far more likely scenario, and it's not even close. I get it...illegal immigration is a problem. But it's not a problem because they are evil, murdering criminals. The vast majority are good hard working people who hold jobs, and contribute significantly to our economy. They need to stop being painted as evil villains.

And as long as small business owners continue to hire and pay illegal immigrants so they can provide their product/service at a competitive price, the illegal immigrants will continue to keep coming in. Wall or no wall. The risk is worth the reward for both the immigrant and the business owners. To stop the problem, we need to focus on why they are coming here...not how they are getting here.

 

This!

 

No jobs when they get here then no trips over the border.

I think what Mt Ref was getting at is the feeling that had the illegal immigrant not been here the death would not have occurred so there might be more of an "if only" factor. Of course there will always be those thoughts no matter who is involved, it just adds one more to the equation.

Am I supposed to feel better if a native born Anerican were responsible for the death of a loved one?? That's the far more likely scenario, and it's not even close. I get it...illegal immigration is a problem. But it's not a problem because they are evil, murdering criminals. The vast majority are good hard working people who hold jobs, and contribute significantly to our economy. They need to stop being painted as evil villains.

 

This doesn't matter.

 

How are they contributing to our economy when they are sending most of the money they make back to their home country to their family?

 

Your narrative is ridiculous. Whether they be good or bad people, they are ILLEGAL!!

 

I will never understand the mindset you and others have that it is OK to break the law and receive no consequences.

This!

 

No jobs when they get here then no trips over the border.

 

False. They will still come.

This doesn't matter.

 

How are they contributing to our economy when they are sending most of the money they make back to their home country to their family?

 

Your narrative is ridiculous. Whether they be good or bad people, they are ILLEGAL!!

 

I will never understand the mindset you and others have that it is OK to break the law and receive no consequences.

 

I managed a pawn shop in Bradenton Florida where there was a tomato plant and we had a very large immigrant Workforce. We had a check-cashing window and we also did Western Union. Every Friday the line would be out the door solid for a couple hours for people to cash their checks and Western Union most of their check off to Mexico. Witnessed it myself so what you said is very true.

Am I supposed to feel better if a native born Anerican were responsible for the death of a loved one?? That's the far more likely scenario, and it's not even close. I get it...illegal immigration is a problem. But it's not a problem because they are evil, murdering criminals. The vast majority are good hard working people who hold jobs, and contribute significantly to our economy. They need to stop being painted as evil villains.

 

There was already an official report by the US government that was posted in earlier a thread that disprove the theory that they contribute. Because of all the benefits that they reap by being undocumented and coming over without work or working under the table and having children they are taking out twice what is being put back in the system. That is a fact and it will only get worse by allowing more and more people to continually come across the border.

MEXICO VS. UNITED STATES: MEXICAN IMMIGRATION LAWS ARE TOUGHER

 

How about Mexico's laws are even tougher than ours when it comes to immigration we're idiots.

This doesn't matter.

 

How are they contributing to our economy when they are sending most of the money they make back to their home country to their family?

 

Your narrative is ridiculous. Whether they be good or bad people, they are ILLEGAL!!

 

I will never understand the mindset you and others have that it is OK to break the law and receive no consequences.

 

I never said it was ok to break the law. But we should be just as willing and barking just as loudly to prosecute the business owners that hire these folks, which is the main attraction for them wanting to be here in the first place. I get that they are here illegally. But the narrative that these are horrible people who are raping, murdering etc, is equally ridiculous.

 

And if you don't believe they are contributing to the economy you have your head in the sand. They are a massive, cheap form of labor (albeit illegal) that has a significant impact on two supremely important industries...agriculture and construction. Pull those folks out and I'm betting most of us wouldn't be happy with the consequences.

 

Again, I realize they are here illegally. We need to change that, especially for the folks already here. Provide a path to citizenship that isn't overly punitive or super difficult so those that are here can stay and continue to contribute. And ferret out those who don't take the opportunity to do so, while enforcing labor laws with the business owners that continue to thumb their noses at the law.

There was already an official report by the US government that was posted in earlier a thread that disprove the theory that they contribute. Because of all the benefits that they reap by being undocumented and coming over without work or working under the table and having children they are taking out twice what is being put back in the system. That is a fact and it will only get worse by allowing more and more people to continually come across the border.

 

The part about their contribution to the economy that everyone ignores is what they produce, and the overall capacity they provide. You're ignoring the fact that you cannot pull millions out of the labor force without a serious negative impact. Not to mention they DO spend significant amounts of money in our economy...they have to eat, clothe themselves and live somewhere, which means paying utilities and rent. Again, significant $'s.

False. They will still come.

 

That's why people have ultimately always come here. Yes it's a great place to live, and you can't beat the freedoms we enjoy. But it's always come down to opportunity. You can come here, work hard for someone else or start your own business and live out the dream. People would not come here if that were that easy to do in their home countries.

This!

 

No jobs when they get here then no trips over the border.

Wrong.. They will keep coming for the benefits..

The part about their contribution to the economy that everyone ignores is what they produce, and the overall capacity they provide. You're ignoring the fact that you cannot pull millions out of the labor force without a serious negative impact. Not to mention they DO spend significant amounts of money in our economy...they have to eat, clothe themselves and live somewhere, which means paying utilities and rent. Again, significant $'s.

 

You are right their contributions are very significant ............to Mexico.

The part about their contribution to the economy that everyone ignores is what they produce, and the overall capacity they provide. You're ignoring the fact that you cannot pull millions out of the labor force without a serious negative impact. Not to mention they DO spend significant amounts of money in our economy...they have to eat, clothe themselves and live somewhere, which means paying utilities and rent. Again, significant $'s.

 

So you're okay with coming here and working under the table not paying any taxes. Sending their wives down to sign up for food stamps. Section 8, and then having children without insurance. And all this thing taken care of by the American taxpayers. So while they may buy some clothes they are not paying for their rent, they are not paying for their food they are probably getting assistance with their electric and water since they're on Section 8. Then on top of that they're sending a large amount of their income home to relatives or other family members. So while you say they may be large contributors to the economy they're doing most of the contributing with our own money, while providing a welfare service to Mexico. We're talking Millions vs. Billions it's not even in the same ballpark. Not to mention one little tidbit if they're here illegally, can you tell me the legal term of the word illegally? Where people get confused is there is legal immigration which most of us are in favor for and understand that you're going to have to help people out to get established. But then there's the illegal part of the equation which is" illegal."

You are right their contributions are very significant ............to Mexico.

 

So the work they do here has no value?? What do you think happens to produce and food prices if we yank all of them out?? How do you think some of these constructions businesses stay in business without the cheap labor?? What about the goods and services they need while living here...how do those businesses replace those sales?? You are ignoring over half of the equation by focusing on the money they send out of the country. And since that's such a big focus let's crack down on all the companies that have shifted production overseas. Or the US citizens that spend billions every year in foreign countries on travel, or that buy prescription drugs from Canada. Ours is a global economy, and billion and billions of our dollars leave this country every year. But we want to seek out and destroy the immigrant who sends $500 a month back home to support his family...money paid to him by a lawbreaking employer, to provide cheaper goods and services we demand. There's so much more to this then building a wall and rounding 'em all up.