So the work they do here has no value?? What do you think happens to produce and food prices if we yank all of them out?? How do you think some of these constructions businesses stay in business without the cheap labor?? What about the goods and services they need while living here...how do those businesses replace those sales?? You are ignoring over half of the equation by focusing on the money they send out of the country. And since that's such a big focus let's crack down on all the companies that have shifted production overseas. Or the US citizens that spend billions every year in foreign countries on travel, or that buy prescription drugs from Canada. Ours is a global economy, and billion and billions of our dollars leave this country every year. But we want to seek out and destroy the immigrant who sends $500 a month back home to support his family...money paid to him by a lawbreaking employer, to provide cheaper goods and services we demand. There's so much more to this then building a wall and rounding 'em all up.

No, I'm not ignoring that fact. But are you forgetting that the true unemployment numbers and America is coming close to 10% and while those jobs may not be sustainable Breadwinners job, I'd rather see legal Americans have to do those jobs and get benefits to supplement their income. I would rather spend the welfare Budget on people that are legally in this country rather than illegally.

No, I'm not ignoring that fact. But are you forgetting that the true unemployment numbers and America is coming close to 10% and while those jobs may not be sustainable Breadwinners job, I'd rather see legal Americans have to do those jobs and get benefits to supplement their income. I would rather spend the welfare Budget on people that are legally in this country rather than illegally.

 

And I don't disagree with that statement. But there are reasons why the business owners in those industries turned to an immigrant labor force in the first place. They'll work cheaper and are willing to do jobs many if most Americans are unwilling to do. Had Americans been willing to work those jobs at those wages, those businesses wouldn't have needed to fill those jobs with immigrants. And as our workforce gets more and more educated...2/3 of our high school students go to college......the less people we will have that will be willing to fill these entry level, hard labor type jobs., and the greater need businesses will have for cheap labor.

I don't know anyone who thinks illegal immigration isn't an issue. It's a major issue. As others have said, the areas we need to focus on are both the why and the how of them getting over here. If we address the why, and not the how, they'll still come. If we address the how, and not the why, they'll still come. It has to be a two-pronged effort.

 

We also need to abandon the fairy tale of deporting and sending away all the illegals that are here currently...It's not only not feasible, it'd be an astronomical cost that we frankly can't afford.

 

Instead, we need to focus on getting them documented, have them pay fines, and allow those with clean records and jobs to become contributing members of society, ones that pay their share of taxes.

So the work they do here has no value?? What do you think happens to produce and food prices if we yank all of them out?? How do you think some of these constructions businesses stay in business without the cheap labor?? What about the goods and services they need while living here...how do those businesses replace those sales?? You are ignoring over half of the equation by focusing on the money they send out of the country. And since that's such a big focus let's crack down on all the companies that have shifted production overseas. Or the US citizens that spend billions every year in foreign countries on travel, or that buy prescription drugs from Canada. Ours is a global economy, and billion and billions of our dollars leave this country every year. But we want to seek out and destroy the immigrant who sends $500 a month back home to support his family...money paid to him by a lawbreaking employer, to provide cheaper goods and services we demand. There's so much more to this then building a wall and rounding 'em all up.

 

It's a global economy that only wallstreet and owners, execs get to participate in. We need those jobs back to have a middle class vs have's and have nots.

I agree it'd be nice if we could have our own unemployed citizens or legal immigrants doing those jobs, but do you really think Americans would take those jobs? It's hard, tiring work that most are too lazy to do in all honesty.

I don't know anyone who thinks illegal immigration isn't an issue. It's a major issue. As others have said, the areas we need to focus on are both the why and the how of them getting over here. If we address the why, and not the how, they'll still come. If we address the how, and not the why, they'll still come. It has to be a two-pronged effort.

 

We also need to abandon the fairy tale of deporting and sending away all the illegals that are here currently...It's not only not feasible, it'd be an astronomical cost that we frankly can't afford.

 

Instead, we need to focus on getting them documented, have them pay fines, and allow those with clean records and jobs to become contributing members of society, ones that pay their share of taxes.

 

This!!!

It's a global economy that only wallstreet and owners, execs get to participate in. We need those jobs back to have a middle class vs have's and have nots.

 

The jobs these illegal immigrants are holding are not middle class jobs. None of the roughly 3 million college graduates this year will be taking these jobs. Nor will the displaced white collar workers approaching middle age. Working in a field or an entry level construction job is not going to build the middle class.

My family raised tobacco all my life until the buyout. For years we were able to find locals and teenagers to help with the harvest. Our town began to grow, a couple of factories and fast food restaurants opened up, and suddenly it was near impossible to get help. We spent nearly double our budget that year on labor. Not to mention the long days and nights. (It was that year that made me celebrate the buyout!)

 

The remaining years we used migrant workers. They would travel from farm to farm up and down the Midwest and southeast during harvest season. We had a few of the same fellas for several years. These were great people who helped several farmers with tasks that would have been impossible without them.

 

The idea Americans will fill this vacuum is ludicrous. They wouldn't 25 years ago and to say they will today with technology and education advances is a complete fantasy.

It comes down to this. They come here for an opportunity to make money. Cut that out and they go back home. BUT I don't think we will like this: food products will skyrocket and that will affect EVERYONE. Pay $3 bucks for a tomato and we may change our tune.

The jobs these illegal immigrants are holding are not middle class jobs. None of the roughly 3 million college graduates this year will be taking these jobs. Nor will the displaced white collar workers approaching middle age. Working in a field or an entry level construction job is not going to build the middle class.

 

True, I was refering to the global economy Part. But I've talked to many tradesman, being one myself, who now command 1/2 of what they use to since illegals will do it for less and under the table. They have crashed the labor market and businesses are taking advantage to drive their profit margins higher. So we reward illegals with benefits and jobs and push Americans out. The illegals just are not on our farms doing manual labor.

I agree it'd be nice if we could have our own unemployed citizens or legal immigrants doing those jobs, but do you really think Americans would take those jobs? It's hard, tiring work that most are too lazy to do in all honesty.

 

Right. And it really has very little to do with lazy. Nearly 70% of our high s hookers go to college....do you think college grads or people that are smart enough to attend college will take those jobs?? You think displaced white collar workers (which make up a good chunk of the unemployed) are jump into one of those jobs after holding white collar positions most of their life?? And the fact that you can't really build or maintain any kind of a lifestyle with those jobs make them unappealing to the vast majority of the country. Their are plenty who are willing to work hard...there are few that want to work hard for very little.

 

And these jobs are viewed as awful by Americans, they are much better than what immigrants have available in their home country..which is why so many end up here...

True, I was refering to the global economy Part. But I've talked to many tradesman, being one myself, who now command 1/2 of what they use to since illegals will do it for less and under the table. They have crashed the labor market and businesses are taking advantage to drive their profit margins higher. So we reward illegals with benefits and jobs and push Americans out. The illegals just are not on our farms doing manual labor.

 

Correct. But much of that is based on business owners greed coupled with our consumers demand for lower prices. Many people complain about folks being here illegally. But those same people look the other way when they need work done cheaply. Anybody ever check to make sure the companies we hire to do work only employ US citizens or those here legally?? We've created the system that encourages the very problem we are complaining about.

Correct. But much of that is based on business owners greed coupled with our consumers demand for lower prices. Many people complain about folks being here illegally. But those same people look the other way when they need work done cheaply. Anybody ever check to make sure the companies we hire to do work only employ US citizens or those here legally?? We've created the system that encourages the very problem we are complaining about.

 

I don't know about we, I view myself have been affected by this and will argue and elect those who are against it to the end.

You guys on the left always miss the points because you care, or want to help or feel sorry or guilt, whatever it is. The point is we are rewarding illegal activity from immigration to tax evasion, fraud with American taxpayer money in the form of benefits and dumping the payscale down the toilet costing Americans jobs and income. If people come legally and assimilate and our country allows that, that's fine. No matter what you identify your political beliefs as this is an American problem. Rewarding illegal activity to gain political favor at the cost of your own country is deplorable and treasonous.

I don't think anyone's missed the point. We all agree the issue is serious and needs to be addressed. Addressing it involves a hell of a lot more than just "build a wall". There's many layers to the problem, and it needs to addressed at each of them.

I don't know about we, I view myself have been affected by this and will argue and elect those who are against it to the end.

 

Obviously, when I say "we", I mean the country as a whole, not you and I specifically.

 

Again, I have no issues with someone fixing or trying to fix the problem. The issue I have is we are hyper focused on just one piece of the puzzle...the immigrants. And that people are demonizing and painting them as villains to support their argument. The reality though, is that these people provide a significant benefit to our economy, and are doing so because business owners continue to hire and employ them...illegally. They are just as, if not more culpable in this problem. And they never get mentioned or demonized.