Great points Baseballinmyblood!

I agree about not blowing money completely...

But, as you said, kids have to reach out to college coaches. They like getting an email or a phone call from a kid. They're much more interested in hearing from the player than the parent.

 

Also, I like for these kids to join teams that do a lot for little money... Like Midland for example.

And, someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I was under the impression that PBR is not all that expensive...

Anyway, we agree on principal... I've never been interested in egos but I'm very interested in work ethic..

And I think kids involved in PBR for example, they're working hard to see where they stack up with their peers... And hopefully identify strengths and weaknesses in their game.

 

Unfortunately now in most situations you'll have to pay something. I even know high school summer teams that want to keep their high school squad playing together will charge them something, which is crazy to me. There are several high school coaches that know of his players playing for other summer teams but will still make them play for their high school summer teams. Then you get into a situation where a kid hypothetically pitches seven innings for his summer team tuesday and then on Wednesday catches seven innings for his high school team, never communicates with his high school coach and ends up pitching again in a couple days for his high school team also. Neither coach knows so the kid ends up pitching twice a week and participates in showcases and events all summer and fall. By the time January comes around his arm is completely dead and now he has to start preparing for another high school season to start.

 

The system is flawed and I wish there was a way to protect the player more. He's a young kid that thinks he's invincible. Majority of kids will not turn down a game they can play in. So the adults need to do a better job policing these situations. If not, its going to go from 1-5 pitchers getting tommy john surgery to 1-3 very quickly.

The system is flawed and I wish there was a way to protect the player more. He's a young kid that thinks he's invincible. Majority of kids will not turn down a game they can play in. So the adults need to do a better job policing these situations. If not, its going to go from 1-5 pitchers getting tommy john surgery to 1-3 very quickly.

 

Hopefully kids and their parents are starting to learn to be smarter about this stuff. Although, it sounded like the one pitcher from SK just about threw his arm off in the State Tourney this year. I wasn't there, but heard that from several reliable sources.

Hopefully kids and their parents are starting to learn to be smarter about this stuff. Although, it sounded like the one pitcher from SK just about threw his arm off in the State Tourney this year. I wasn't there, but heard that from several reliable sources.

 

Little League got it right by going by pitch count. Idk y some still go by innings? Kid throws 60+ pitches in three innings and has the same rest as a kid that throws 20 pitches in three innings. Not sure where the logic is with that?

Little League got it right by going by pitch count. Idk y some still go by innings? Kid throws 60+ pitches in three innings and has the same rest as a kid that throws 20 pitches in three innings. Not sure where the logic is with that?

 

Little League "got it right"? You must be kidding? 12 year olds throwing 40% curve balls just to win a game? I know many former Hamilton West Side LL pitchers, their arms are rags now. You have posted a lot of stuff off base in this thread, that one may be the topper.

Little League "got it right"? You must be kidding? 12 year olds throwing 40% curve balls just to win a game? I know many former Hamilton West Side LL pitchers, their arms are rags now. You have posted a lot of stuff off base in this thread, that one may be the topper.

 

Read more carefully before you shoot off. I'm referring to pitch counts. Those kids should only be throwing change ups at that age when it comes to off-speed. I'm talking about high school regarding their rest system for pitchers.

 

Nothing is off-base that I've said. It may be different from your opinion, but its an observation I've spent over 25 years in baseball developing.

Read more carefully before you shoot off. I'm referring to pitch counts. Those kids should only be throwing change ups at that age when it comes to off-speed. I'm talking about high school regarding their rest system for pitchers.

 

Nothing is off-base that I've said. It may be different from your opinion, but its an observation I've spent over 25 years in baseball developing.

 

Congrats on your tenure, I am sure it's well deserved. I simply disagree with just about everything you are pushing here. Go pull a college roster, at least a D1 or D2 one. You will be hard pressed to find a kid that has any kids that did not play some type of travel ball or select. Don't mean to be harsh, but legion ball is dead. Thing of the past. My team played three of them this summer, we threw kids that dont even pitch and run ruled them all. In the 80s legion was all there was. It's changed.

Congrats on your tenure, I am sure it's well deserved. I simply disagree with just about everything you are pushing here. Go pull a college roster, at least a D1 or D2 one. You will be hard pressed to find a kid that has any kids that did not play some type of travel ball or select. Don't mean to be harsh, but legion ball is dead. Thing of the past. My team played three of them this summer, we threw kids that dont even pitch and run ruled them all. In the 80s legion was all there was. It's changed.

 

I used legion as an example. Also, if you go back and reread my posts I was very clear about the importance of kids playing throughout the summer. It is a must in terms of preparing them for a gruelling college season. The only summer teams I am talking about are the ones that charge an ungodly amount of money with no real promise of anything. And if that is like how your team is then I would expect you to disagree with it. There are great summer programs and their are some that have no business being around the sport. The latter is who I am referring to.

Which Midland team? Not sure Skins/Braves set yet, with exception of a few returners and a couple THawks.

 

Anyone have any information on what the Midland rosters look like for the T-Hawks, Braves and/or Skins?

Go pull a college roster, at least a D1 or D2 one. .

This D1 and D2 talk has always baffled me when it comes to college baseball. It isn't the same thing as basketball or football... Meaning, the best players are not always choosing to play at the D1 level. The reason is simple: look at MLB rosters and you'll see D1, D2, D3, NAIA, Juco and drafted straight from high school players all over the place. Albert Puljos and Bryce Harper played at Junior Colleges... Why? So they could get to the majors quicker.

When you understand that D1 only has like 11 scholarships to give on a 35 man roster... You can see why so many kids choose D3 (which only gives academic money) and NAIA schools (which tend to stack athletic and academic money).

Anyway, not trying to start an argument with anyone at all...

I just wanted to point out to parents and even kids that may read this stuff... It's not like you aren't a great player or have no chance to play pro baseball someday if you don't play D1. That's all... Sorry to ramble.

This D1 and D2 talk has always baffled me when it comes to college baseball. It isn't the same thing as basketball or football... Meaning, the best players are not always choosing to play at the D1 level. The reason is simple: look at MLB rosters and you'll see D1, D2, D3, NAIA, Juco and drafted straight from high school players all over the place. Albert Puljos and Bryce Harper played at Junior Colleges... Why? So they could get to the majors quicker.

When you understand that D1 only has like 11 scholarships to give on a 35 man roster... You can see why so many kids choose D3 (which only gives academic money) and NAIA schools (which tend to stack athletic and academic money).

Anyway, not trying to start an argument with anyone at all...

I just wanted to point out to parents and even kids that may read this stuff... It's not like you aren't a great player or have no chance to play pro baseball someday if you don't play D1. That's all... Sorry to ramble.

 

 

I agree. Bryce Harper is a pretty crazy story. He quit Las Vegas High School after his sophomore year and got his GED which made him eligible for the 2010 draft. The main reason he chose that JUCO school to play at is because they use wooden bats during their conference games. Wilson Ramos better be glad the Nationals decided to make him an outfielder because he is probably one of the best catchers in the league and Ramos would have been sent down if Harper decided to stay as a catcher. He also pitched a couple games while he was in junior college. He is freakishly good and a pure five tool player. Not many have that label. He plays like his pants are on fire.

 

I never realized Pujols was primarily a shortstop? He played shortstop for one season at a community college after he finished high school in December of his senior. The only difference in the two really is Pujols had enough credits to where he didn't have to get his GED. That is pretty amazing when you're that confident in your skills you can do things like that.

 

JUCO schools are used a lot for major D1 prospects when their grades are not up to snuff. Several universities have relationships with JUCOs in which they use them kind of like a minor league. Just as an example, Potomac State Junior College and WVU have that kind of relationship. 90% of Potomac players attend WVU after their two years is up. Kind of makes you wonder when Bluegrass Technical School is going to start a team? Might as well.

Edited September 5, 201412 yr by Baseballinmyblood

JUCO schools are used a lot for major D1 prospects when their grades are not up to snuff.

Absolutely. But also, many D1 prospects choose D2, D3 or NAIA because of the scholarship money. If a D1 program has a full roster of 35 players...it means at least 8 of them must be walk-ons by NCAA rule. They are only allowed 11.7 scholarships to use however they choose between 27 players.

That's why many great "D1 talent" players will go D3 or NAIA.... Because in many cases, they will receive much more scholarship money... Not too mention, their chances of getting playing time are better as freshman. D1 schools are not allowed to have JV squads for instance. Sometimes it's just a numbers game and D1 schools are not always the best choice for the player. I just wanted to discuss some of these issues, because for months I've read tons of posts saying "D1 this and D1 that". Again, nothing wrong with D1 schools... But I believe many people are uninformed when it comes to the other options out there.

There are highly competitive D3 and NAIA schools out there. Many are better "baseball programs" than several D1 schools.

Baseball is weird that way, because baseball is not a money making sport like basketball or football.

It gets confusing, I know. Lol!

This D1 and D2 talk has always baffled me when it comes to college baseball. It isn't the same thing as basketball or football... Meaning, the best players are not always choosing to play at the D1 level. The reason is simple: look at MLB rosters and you'll see D1, D2, D3, NAIA, Juco and drafted straight from high school players all over the place. Albert Puljos and Bryce Harper played at Junior Colleges... Why? So they could get to the majors quicker.

When you understand that D1 only has like 11 scholarships to give on a 35 man roster... You can see why so many kids choose D3 (which only gives academic money) and NAIA schools (which tend to stack athletic and academic money).

Anyway, not trying to start an argument with anyone at all...

I just wanted to point out to parents and even kids that may read this stuff... It's not like you aren't a great player or have no chance to play pro baseball someday if you don't play D1. That's all... Sorry to ramble.

 

I can only partially agree. Yes, players from all levels do get drafted and play in the major leagues. But just in terms of sheer numbers, your likelihood of getting drafted goes down significantly the lower the level you play in college. Exactly 15 D3 players got drafted in 2014. About 50-60 D2 players get drafted, and on average, 20-30 NAIA get picked. Compare that to the 700 or so D1 athletes that get drafted every year. If the pro's are your dream, you're much better off playing D1 baseball if you have the ability and an offer. Of course, as you mentioned, those offers are not only few and far between, but are rarely for a full ride. The other thing that doesn't get mentioned, is that these are year to year scholly's, and at many D1 schools, your scholly will get reassigned after your junior year, or even sooner if you're not playing much.

True there are more D1 players drafted.. That's because D1 highly values the "measurables" which can equate to MLB talent in the future. My point being, there are still very few D1 players that will make it to MLB. And as you said, the yearly scholarship carousel can be crazy at D1.

The odds of making it in pro ball are so small... It's hardly worth discussing.

Just saying, most players are a step or several steps below MLB... So, in many cases, it's better to play everyday at a lower level and have more school paid for...than it is to go D1, hardly play and have more school debt.

So, in a long winded reply, I think we mostly agree. MLB will find you if you have the talent much more easily than college coaches find talent. Colleges have smaller staffs and less time to recruit than MLB.

True there are more D1 players drafted.. That's because D1 highly values the "measurables" which can equate to MLB talent in the future. My point being, there are still very few D1 players that will make it to MLB. And as you said, the yearly scholarship carousel can be crazy at D1.

The odds of making it in pro ball are so small... It's hardly worth discussing.

Just saying, most players are a step or several steps below MLB... So, in many cases, it's better to play everyday at a lower level and have more school paid for...than it is to go D1, hardly play and have more school debt.

So, in a long winded reply, I think we mostly agree. MLB will find you if you have the talent much more easily than college coaches find talent. Colleges have smaller staffs and less time to recruit than MLB.

 

One thing about your previous post, D1 schools are allowed to have JV programs unless things have changed in the past few years? Financially it doesn't make sense because the money they have they normally will feed it back into their varsity program.

 

Division 2 is still at 9 with scholarships, which is almost three less than D1. Obviously D3 has no scholarships, but most are very cheap. NAIA schools can give 12 scholarships and then JUCO is basically a free for all with 24. However, that doesn't mean that all of these schools are fully funded? For example, a NAIA program may not be fully funded, so their school only gives them 10 of the 12 scholarships. This happens a lot in the NAIA. Only nine scholarships for D2 is a big reason why competitively there isn't a difference in D2 and NAIA or JUCO. I know several JUCO programs that could play on the D1 level, but you can give every single player money though. Good coaches will always find a way to make 12 scholarships cover the majority of your team. There are lots and lots of money out there and other financial aid programs that coaches can add to a partial scholarship and get most of their school paid for.

 

I think it would be a great experiment if we threw several D1 teams in a tournament with say Faulkner, Lewis-Clark State, and maybe Walters State and made them all switch jerseys out, and see who won? I think it'd be more interesting than people realize.

Totally agree with you... Many JUCO programs can compete with and even handily beat many D1 programs... And it has changed. D1 is not allowed to have Junior Varsity programs, they are allowed to play 56 varsity games...and that's it.