I think because non union employees don't have that union protection that sometimes their rights that are protected by labor laws aren't as easily known like they are in a union setting.

 

Goes back to my belief that all my core beliefs are based on. Being responsible for ones self. Anyone who doesn't understand their own rights only has themself to blame.

 

But I agree that is an issue PP. It is why I don't have a problem with private sector unions. If I as a worker find a benefit in paying a union to protect my rights then more power to them. Like I said above my two younger brothers are union steel workers they love it. I personally don't find value in it for myself.

I think because non union employees don't have that union protection that sometimes their rights that are protected by labor laws aren't as easily known like they are in a union setting.

 

You may well be correct about that. However, when it comes to criminal law, ignorance is not an excuse. I don't see employment law being much different. If you don't learn that stuff on your own, shame on you.

Let's turn the tables on this. What if the City passed a law that stated that no company with an apprenticeship program could bid on jobs?

Not true again showing your lack of understanding on Federal law. Is it easier to get fired from Non-Union job, yep. But with the amount of labor laws and protections even non-union workers have a lot of protection. I can go down the list if you like?

You're naive if you think non-union companies are afraid of violating federal labor law when it comes to firing people. If Joe Non-Union Worker is fired without just cause, he's not likely to fight the dismissal because of the time and legal expense involved. If Joe Union Worker is fired without just cause, he has an appeal process that's written into the contract.

 

The key term is "written contract." One worker has one, the other doesn't. Huge difference.

Let's turn the tables on this. What if the City passed a law that stated that no company with an apprenticeship program could bid on jobs?

If that happened, then buildings would start collapsing like in Bangladesh.

If that happened, then buildings would start collapsing like in Bangladesh.

 

So building inspectors and architects don't inspect or review the construction of buildings built by firms without apprenticeship programs?

I think there's a lot of water being muddied here. But, I think most rational people out there would agree to the following...

 

Are there good union shops? Yes

Are there good non-union shops? Yes

Are there some benefits associated with union shops? Yes

Are there some benefits associated with non-union shops? Yes

Are there some negatives associated with union shops? Yes

Are there some negatives associated with non-union shops? Yes

 

But, to get down to the bottom line...does this particular piece of legislation favor a union shop setup over a traditional non-union setup? And, again...I think most rational people would have to say...YES!

 

So, now the question is WHY? And I'm not going to deal with any other business, other than the one presented in this case. This is a company that has apparently done work for the city for quite awhile. And satisfactory enough work, that they have been repeatedly used for many projects. So, why would elected officials decide to enact legislation that would specifically exclude this company from working for them again? It makes no logical sense.

If that happened, then buildings would start collapsing like in Bangladesh.

 

Do you really believe the idiocy you spout?

 

Talk about painting with a broad brush.

You're naive if you think non-union companies are afraid of violating federal labor law when it comes to firing people. If Joe Non-Union Worker is fired without just cause, he's not likely to fight the dismissal because of the time and legal expense involved. If Joe Union Worker is fired without just cause, he has an appeal process that's written into the contract.

 

The key term is "written contract." One worker has one, the other doesn't. Huge difference.

 

I've worked with many, many companies over the past 30 plus years and it's my experience that you couldn't be more wrong.

If that happened, then buildings would start collapsing like in Bangladesh.

 

What color's the sky in your world?

I think there's a lot of water being muddied here. But, I think most rational people out there would agree to the following...

 

Are there good union shops? Yes

Are there good non-union shops? Yes

Are there some benefits associated with union shops? Yes

Are there some benefits associated with non-union shops? Yes

Are there some negatives associated with union shops? Yes

Are there some negatives associated with non-union shops? Yes

 

But, to get down to the bottom line...does this particular piece of legislation favor a union shop setup over a traditional non-union setup? And, again...I think most rational people would have to say...YES!

 

So, now the question is WHY? And I'm not going to deal with any other business, other than the one presented in this case. This is a company that has apparently done work for the city for quite awhile. And satisfactory enough work, that they have been repeatedly used for many projects. So, why would elected officials decide to enact legislation that would specifically exclude this company from working for them again? It makes no logical sense.

Thoughtful post, but remember, we only got one side of the story here. I reviewed the e-mail in post No. 1 again. Rather than explain the apprenticeship issue, the writer chose to be disingenuous and cast his argument in broad-brush terms. I suspect there's more to this story than what we're being told.

Thoughtful post, but remember, we only got one side of the story here. I reviewed the e-mail in post No. 1 again. Rather than explain the apprenticeship issue, the writer chose to be disingenuous and cast his argument in broad-brush terms. I suspect there's more to this story than what we're being told.

 

On that we can agree. However, you have to be open to the fact that what's not being told could be something that union supporters don't want to hear. To blindly show allegiance to either side in all cases is silly. That's why I may not always agree with PP92, but I at least respect him for acknowledging both sides positives/negatives.

On that we can agree. However, you have to be open to the fact that what's not being told could be something that union supporters don't want to hear. To blindly show allegiance to either side in all cases is silly. That's why I may not always agree with PP92, but I at least respect him for acknowledging both sides positives/negatives.

 

And the same goes for CWB, too!

I've worked with many, many companies over the past 30 plus years and it's my experience that you couldn't be more wrong.

So I guess it comes down to my anecdotal accounts vs. yours. I also have 30 plus years in "the system." Here's how the system works: Some mid-level flunky manager in corporate or the company's HR person says Joe Worker needs to be fired because of his high health-care costs. Management invents a bogus reason for firing said person. Usually a bad performance review will suffice. If Joe Worker has a union at his back, he's got a solid chance of winning in an arbitration hearing. Or this gets headed off before it gathers any steam. That's the more likely scenario. If he doesn't, he's fried. Even if he does find a lawyer to take his case on commission, the company's lackey lawyers will start a series of never-ending delaying tactics to force Joe Worker to settle for 10 cents on the buck. If by chance the case even ends up in court, then the company will try to steer the case to a pro big-business Republican judge, which around here isn't too hard to find.

 

It's a rigged system. Get your head out of the sand. This is why we have unions.

If that happened, then buildings would start collapsing like in Bangladesh.

Way to have a reasonable and intelligent conversation about this. You want to actually add something of value or just keep reciting your Pro Union posters?