There has been a lot of chatter in various threads about this issue most recently in the Will Rolen Return As Regular 3rd Baseman thread and I thought it may need it's own thread...Anyone that follows the Reds knows that if it wasn't for the Stubbs injury that Heisey would have never received regular at bats to prove himself in LF...As long as Dusty has Ludwick, Heisey will be in a platoon position out there in LF...However with Stubbs hurt Heisey has received regular at bats playing CF and IMO has looked better hitting 2nd and playing the field than Stubbs...

 

My question is which player Heisey or Stubbs improves the Reds as a team most by playing everyday in CF?...When Stubbs comes back it's almost a guarantee that Heisey will go back to platooning in LF...Would trying to trade Stubbs and leaving Heisey in CF and giving Ludwick/a possible new LF via trade the everyday at bats in LF be worth it even though you are losing Stubbs speed in the lineup...As a Reds fan I know that if Stubbs is on this team Heisey will not play everyday and Stubbs will also bat 2nd probably the rest of the year just like if Rolen comes back Frazier will no longer play everyday...With Dusty and his stubbornness the only way to get Heisey everyday at bats hitting 2nd is if Stubbs is injured or traded...You pretty much have to give Dusty no choice basically by a guy either being traded or injured for Dusty to play what is probably the better player...

 

Now I wouldn't mind having both Stubbs and Heisey play at the same time so much but I'm also smart enough to know that probably won't happen...I am willing to sacrifice Stubbs speed by having Ludwick or someone else in LF and Heisey in CF everyday because I think Heisey looks like a better option at the top of the order and in the field...Heisey is not nearly as painful to watch for me and Ludwick and Stubbs are equally painful...Stubbs might still have some trade value, while Ludwick probably has none at all...

 

Both Heisey and Stubbs are also the same exact age...

 

This article although a little old now is exactly how I feel about Heisey vs Stubbs...

Chris Heisey or Drew Stubbs: Who Is Better in CF for the Cincinnati Reds? | Bleacher Report

Edited June 12, 201214 yr by nkufan23

Heisey has a .296 OBP overall and a .258 OBP hitting second. Why on earth would you want him regularly hitting in front of Votto?

Heisey has a .296 OBP overall and a .258 OBP hitting second. Why on earth would you want him regularly hitting in front of Votto?

 

How many at bats has Heisey had hitting second my guess is not many maybe a few weeks worth...Heisey also owns a better AVG, SLG Percentage in his career than Stubbs and his OBP isn't so much worse than Stubbs that you would lose sleep over it...He also strikes out 4% less than Stubbs...

 

If I had my choice it would probably be BP but Im not dumb enough to think Dusty will move him out of the cleanup spot...And it's pretty obvious that as long as Cozart is in the Lineup the CF either Stubbs or Heisey is going to hit second...Heisey is a better hitter and a gives a better at bat each time out than Stubbs which isn't saying much because Stubbs is terrible...I do however feel that nobody has seen the best from Heisey due to him coming off the bench almost his entire career while Stubbs has had chances and nothing says he is going to be any better than he has been...I'm not scared that Stubbs will go to another team and become Josh Hamilton...

 

At worse you lose nothing with Heisey over Stubbs and a lot of teams may still value Stubbs as a trade chip due to his speed and once top prospect status, he could use a change of scenery while potentially him packaged with a Reds prospect could bring the Reds a LFer...

Really, not making the votes public?

 

I'd really like to know which posters to ignore when it comes to baseball topics. :lol:

Stubbs easily.

Really, not making the votes public?

 

I'd really like to know which posters to ignore when it comes to baseball topics. :lol:

 

First poll ever I didn't even see an option

Stubbs easily.

 

Care to explain

^He's better defensively, offensively, and is a much more capable baserunner. That was easy.

^He's better defensively, offensively, and is a much more capable baserunner. That was easy.

He's absolutely not better definitively offensively. I wonder how many of those ABs considered in the above numbers for Heisey were pinch hit appearances.

Stubbs obviously will eek out several infield hits and put way more pressure on a defense than Heisey. But dude has some serious holes in his swing.

^He's better defensively, offensively, and is a much more capable baserunner. That was easy.

 

Numbers have proven that Heisey produces even better when he plays in CF...They have also shown that he is just as good if not better in the field...Lets not forget that a number of his at bats in his career have been when he is ice cold straight off the bench...Heisey has upside IMO, with Stubbs what you see is what you get...From the link...

 

"Drew Stubbs is the starting point for many fan conversations himself. The 6'4" gazelle, with his blinding speed and seemingly unlimited range in the outfield, is offensively a Dave Kingman wannabe. He has already surpassed him in terms of strikeouts, but hasn't risen to the expected level of power yet. Back to the Heisey-Stubbs comparison, let us start at the dish. Their career batting averages are both pitiful and are within three points of each other—Heisey ahead in that race with a .254 average. Stubbs leads in OBP at .325 to .316, again, both very close. Stubbs has only been used as a center fielder while Heisey has played all three outfield positions. There is method to my madness for bringing this up."

 

"Stubbs can't blame his positioning on his dismal average and strikeout rate. Heisey has some room to use as leverage here. In both corner positions, he is batting below the Mendoza line and only has six home runs in left field and three in right field. In center field, he has a career line of .333/.396/.626/1.022 with 11 HR and 23 RBI in only 39 games. You may say that is a small sampling, but I say that is going at nearly a 45 HR rate for a season.Why am I saying all of this? Perhaps Heisey is cut out to be a center fielder and not a corner man. Let's face it, when he plays in the middle, you are not giving up a considerable amount defensively. A cursory look in that direction for the 2011 season shows us that, in center field, Heisey had a UZR of -1.5 while surprisingly Stubbs was worse at -2.5. Obviously, in that particular metric, both are underwater in terms of what normalcy should be."

 

"If you glance at their range, Heisey wins in the RngR category as well in center field. And again, both are subpar."

 

"So, what good does it do to trot the fastest man in the National League out every day when his strikeout rate is obscene and his power performance is lacking?"

 

"Stubbs' speed is diminished, if not negated, by his anemic OBP and failure as a bunter. Most speedsters can lay down a pretty good bunt. Stubbs looks like a American League middle reliever trying to bunt, or a deer caught in someone's headlights."

Stubbs can cover a lot of ground in center, but he needs to be batting 7th or 8th. I like Heisey better at the top of the order if they won't put Hanigan there or won't acquire a true top of the order guy.

Heisey has upside and Stubbs doesn't???? I stopped reading after that one. :lol:

 

Stubbs is 27, has no upside.

 

Heisey is 27, yet has upside.

 

Things that make ya go...."hmmm"

Heisey has upside and Stubbs doesn't???? I stopped reading after that one. :lol:

 

Stubbs is 27, has no upside.

 

Heisey is 27, yet has upside.

 

Things that make ya go...."hmmm"

 

I have already said they were the same age nice try man...Heisey has upside because he has hit close to .350 in his career as a pinch hitter which is the hardest job in baseball and has never had much of a chance to play everyday, the guy was the Reds Minor League player of the year...Stubbs not so much upside you know what your going to get with him, a lot of strikeouts and a lot of lackadaisical plays out in CF with the occasional HR that he will run into...Stubbs has Speed and I don't think he even has much potential for anything else at this point, I don't consider his power a tool because he swings for the fence every at bat...Heisey has shown flashes of ability and is the true definition of a baseball player...

 

Is it not possible that 2 guys of the same age have different upsides...Stubbs lost his prospect status a long time ago...While Heisey has also lost this status due to age he never was hyped up to the levels of the first Round pick Stubbs and has never had the opportunity that Stubbs has had even though he has performed better at every level...Have you seen Stubbs swing the bat, he swings in the same spot everytime, he is what he is a guy with leadoff speed that loves to try to hit HR's...Heisey at least has some ability to adjust his swing to the location of the pitch...

Stubbs can cover a lot of ground in center, but he needs to be batting 7th or 8th. I like Heisey better at the top of the order if they won't put Hanigan there or won't acquire a true top of the order guy.

 

Totally agree.