Just curious on whether there was any talk about Mariano Rivera being a starter or being wasted by the Yankees as a closer?

Wow. So now you are dissecting why we didn't have a deep playoff run. Stellar work. Look at the #'s put up by the pitching staff in the series they played against Philly. Next.

 

And look on the bright side, the username made sense last year.

 

I'm not dissecting anything. I look at teams with success in the playoffs and see what they do. They have elite starters and the Reds don't. And you are looking at 3 games in the playoffs. If you are using that logic then the Reds need to rebuild their whole line up because they had 3 bad games offensively. You have to look at variance and use some common sense when looking at how a series turns out.

 

My only point in all of this is...the Reds need a shut down/top tier starter. Chapman could be that, and if he's not then he has proved that he could be in pen. A lot are acting like that if he fails as a starter then we have no use for him which isn't true. WORSE case scenario is he struggles starting and he is back in the pen lighting up the radar gun. But noooooo let's not even give the guy with the ability to throw 105 mph a chance to start.

So, your contention is that Chapman could be an elite starter? Based on what? Stuff? On his large body of work? I think Volquez or Cueto are more reasonable options at this point to become "elite". And only Colin Cowherd said they didn't have an elite guy that I know of. He was fed that info, let's not pretend that he has a clue about sports, let alone baseball.

 

Am I misunderstanding your post or are you one of those hellbent on him being a starter?

 

I am not hellbent on Chapman being a starter. I think he'll get an opportunity to crack the rotation. A 6'4'' lefty with a 100+ mph fastball deserves a shot to crack the rotation. I'm not suggesting that he should be handed the spot, because it's very possible (if not likely) that he's our 6th or 7th best starter. But he should get an opportunity to earn the spot. When you factor in his contract, it seems even more likely that he'll get a shot at cracking the rotation. Like I said, I am not hellbent on Chapman being a starter NEXT SEASON, but I am hellbent on him getting an opportunity to earn a spot in the rotation. If Wood, Bailey and/or Leake beat him out, then so be it. Chapman has proven that he can be effective out of the bullpen, but I'll take a starter with his type of stuff over a reliever any day of the week. Both have great value, but it'd be awesome knowing that he's taking the hump every 5th day (assuming he can earn the spot). It would sell tickets, too.

 

I agree that Volquez is a better choice to be an elite starter, at least for next season. But, could you imagine a 1-2 punch of Volquez & Chapman? And then bring Arroyo back for Game 3? That would be tough to beat.

 

It was pretty clear all along that the Reds lacked the top flight starter necessary to make a deep playoff push. When Volquez returned, I stated that, if this team were to advance past the NLDS, they'd need Volquez to carry them as the #1 starter. That's why I was pleased with Dusty's choice to throw Volquez in game 1. Looking back, our pitching performed well in the playoffs. But, I still stand by my comment that Volquez was the best choice as our #1 starter.

I am not hellbent on Chapman being a starter. I think he'll get an opportunity to crack the rotation. A 6'4'' lefty with a 100+ mph fastball deserves a shot to crack the rotation. I'm not suggesting that he should be handed the spot, because it's very possible (if not likely) that he's our 6th or 7th best starter. But he should get an opportunity to earn the spot. When you factor in his contract, it seems even more likely that he'll get a shot at cracking the rotation. Like I said, I am not hellbent on Chapman being a starter NEXT SEASON, but I am hellbent on him getting an opportunity to earn a spot in the rotation. If Wood, Bailey and/or Leake beat him out, then so be it. Chapman has proven that he can be effective out of the bullpen, but I'll take a starter with his type of stuff over a reliever any day of the week. Both have great value, but it'd be awesome knowing that he's taking the hump every 5th day (assuming he can earn the spot). It would sell tickets, too.

 

I agree that Volquez is a better choice to be an elite starter, at least for next season. But, could you imagine a 1-2 punch of Volquez & Chapman? And then bring Arroyo back for Game 3? That would be tough to beat.

 

It was pretty clear all along that the Reds lacked the top flight starter necessary to make a deep playoff push. When Volquez returned, I stated that, if this team were to advance past the NLDS, they'd need Volquez to carry them as the #1 starter. That's why I was pleased with Dusty's choice to throw Volquez in game 1. Looking back, our pitching performed well in the playoffs. But, I still stand by my comment that Volquez was the best choice as our #1 starter.

 

:thumb::thumb::thumb::thumb::thumb:

 

 

I don't disagree with one thing you said

:banana::ylsuper::banana::ylsuper:

Just curious on whether there was any talk about Mariano Rivera being a starter or being wasted by the Yankees as a closer?

He was fairly ineffective as a starter for the Yanks and they moved him to the pen.

Just curious on whether there was any talk about Mariano Rivera being a starter or being wasted by the Yankees as a closer?

 

Rivera made 10 starts for the Yankees in 1995 (at the age of 25). He went 5-3, with 5.51 ERA. 67 innings, 71 hits, 41 earned runs, 30 BB & 51 K. 1.507 Whip.

 

The year Rivera was called up, he went 2-2 in AAA. 2.10 ERA in 7 starts (30 innings) with 30 K & only 3 BB. Very impressive numbers.

 

The year before he was called up (2004 - age 24) he went 10-2 with 3.09 ERA in 22 starts (131 innings, 1 CG) with 89 K & 30 BB. Looks like he pitched on all 3 levels (A, AA, & AAA) during '94.

From looking at Rivera's stats (on both minor & major leagues) it seems he had a great year in '94 when he stormed through the system. In '95 he had a good start to the year in AAA. He likely came up and made a few starts, struggled a bit, and moved to the bullpen.

 

I think Chapman could be on a similar path. I just hope he gets an opportunity to start.

 

Think about it this way. Mariano Rivera has thrown 1,150 innings during throughout his 16 season MLB career. He has only thrown 100+ innings ONCE in his major league career (1996 - his 1st full year in the bigs). Since then, he has only thrown 80+ in 1 season (80 2/3 in '01).

 

Do you want Chapman on the mound for 170 innings or 75 - 90 per year? Take into account that Chapman, unless he's a bust, won't be a Cincinnati Red when his current contract expires. In other words, if Chapman lives up to the hype, he'll be too expensive for the Reds to keep. Because of that, I am not too concerned with his long-term future as a starter. I say ride him while we've got him & the easiest way to do that is as a starter...if he earns it.

Because you don't have the guy with the best stuff as a set up man. There isn't another team in the majors that does that. I would be much happier if he were to close this year, but that isn't going to happen. Like I said, but you failed to respond to...You need top tier pitchers to make it deep into the postseason. The Reds have one of the deepest staffs, if not the deepest, in the league. That will probably get them to the playoffs again, but then we are back to flipping coins for who to start and there isn't going to be one guy who other teams dread seeing on the mound.

 

And I made this name last year...but thanks for pointing out the obvious

 

Good luck making that name work 95 out of the next 100 years.

I have no real opinion on where to use Chapman this year (as I am not paid to make such opinions like Walt Jocketty, Dusty Baker, and Bryan Price are) but I do have this question to pose.

 

For all of you that say we start him and if it doesn't work out move him to the pen, have you thought about what a bad stint as a starter can do to his psyche? A bad stint as starter could leave him in no place mentally to be solid out of the 'pen.

What if Coco is gone and Chapman has 50 saves?

 

The Red's would probably be in the playoffs again!

I went to a NKY Chamber of Commerce breakfast a couple of weeks back and Phil Castellini (Reds COO) and Dick Williams (VP of Baseball Operations) both spoke there. I spoke with Williams briefly beforehand, and he said the plan is to have Chapman starting eventually. To paraphrase, he said something along the lines of "You can't rely on a kid having a 3-digit arm forever. We're gonna slow him down a little and get him starting games eventually. Might not be for a while though."