October 9, 200917 yr Author Randy, very nice points. We all have heard someone in Anger tell the other..."you go to Hell". Well I'm telling everyone who reads this..."you all go to heaven". I can't wait to get there, but I'm in no hurry". I've read/heard that there is no Sadness in heaven and we will know each other there, but what if we get there and a family member isn't there who we thought would be there? How did people in the Old Testament get to heaven?
October 9, 200917 yr Randy, very nice points. We all have heard someone in Anger tell the other..."you go to Hell". Well I'm telling everyone who reads this..."you all go to heaven". I can't wait to get there, but I'm in no hurry". I've read/heard that there is no Sadness in heaven and we will know each other there, but what if we get there and a family member isn't there who we thought would be there? How did people in the Old Testament get to heaven? What do you do with Jesus' words when he says that God's kingdom is here now
October 10, 200917 yr What do you do with Jesus' words when he says that God's kingdom is here now The church is God's kingdom here. The "new heaven & new earth" (see Revelation 21) is God's eternal kingdom that is to come.
October 10, 200917 yr Randy, very nice points. We all have heard someone in Anger tell the other..."you go to Hell". Well I'm telling everyone who reads this..."you all go to heaven". I can't wait to get there, but I'm in no hurry". I've read/heard that there is no Sadness in heaven and we will know each other there, but what if we get there and a family member isn't there who we thought would be there? How did people in the Old Testament get to heaven? On your first point, my interpretation of this is probably not going to be popular, but I feel like people in heaven WILL be aware of people being in hell. Instinctively, someone will say, "How can we be happy in heaven with knowledge that loved ones are in hell?" But I refer to the parable Jesus told in Luke 16 (the rich man & Lazarus). The rich man was tormented in hell, and Lazarus was at Abraham's side (a Jewish phrase likely referring to Paradise). The rich man & Abraham are described as being in two distinctly different places--a great gulf/chasm was fixed in between them that could not be crossed. And yet, in the parable, the rich man & Abraham are both able to see one another--even carrying on conversation. The rich man asked Abraham to dip his finger in water to cool his tongue, because he was experiencing agony. And Abraham explained to him that no one could cross the gulf, but they could still see each other. My belief is this: when people get to heaven, we will have a full understanding/comprehension of the severity of sin & God's justice. We'll be fully aware that people in hell had countless opportunities to come to Christ, but did not take advantage of them. I am the first to admit that I cannot possibly begin to comprehend how that can be, but I believe it to be true. Again, this is my opinion, although it is based on Scriptural evidence. As for your second question, I believe the Bible indicates that the faithful of the Old Testament were justified by faith. Much of this is written in the book of Hebrews (I believe).
October 11, 200917 yr Author What are your thought on Acts 7? This is a story of Stephen one of the first deacons one of the seven. He was speaking to a group who got angry with him. While they were getting ready to stone him in verse 55 he said "look, I see Heaven and the Glory of God with Jesus at his right hand". During the stoning Stephen prayed..."LORD do not hold this sin against them". He did not see Hell at any time. This is a sad story. Saul witness this and approved of it.
October 13, 200917 yr Just curious with this being a Heaven and Hell discussion, what others thoughts are on predestination. I'm very torn by it, there are some verses that hint at it, then others that hint against it. And in my very core I can't imagine the God I serving creating people that from day 1 have no chance of knowing him and that their whole purpose of existence will be to suffer in Hell.
October 13, 200917 yr The purpose of Stephen seeing Jesus in Acts 7, in my opinion, is not to focus on the afterlife, whereas in Luke 16, that is the focus. Even then, just because Hell is not mentioned as being witnessed by Stephen, doesn't mean that he couldn't see it. The major point is that Stephen was welcomed into heaven upon his death. And the interesting thing is that he saw Jesus standing at the right hand of God, not sitting. This is the only time where Jesus is referred to in such a way--as standing instead of being seated at the Father's right hand. As for predestination, I think God sometimes predetermines the actions in others for His purposes (see Pharaoh's hardened heart). I don't think that God predetermines where each of us spend eternity. He predestines the plan; not the person.
October 13, 200917 yr Author HT, I agree with Randy a little. From memeory check out Romans 8:29. There are about 5 different verses on Predestined. I also have some same thoughts if God knows whether a person will make a choice and picked him to do so, very few Preachers will discuss this topic. On Stephen I was showing how he looked UP and saw Jesus with the Father. Jesus also looked up toward the Heaven on the nite before he died when he prayed to the Father. Why do we BOW our head when we pray?
October 14, 200917 yr Author Peter writes in his second book about fallen Angels who have sinned and were sent to Hell. It says.."they were put into gloomy dungeons to be held for judgement". He also tells how Noah was spared and the ungodly wasn't. There is also the mention of Sodom and Gomorrah being burnt to ashes and using them to show what happens to the unGodly. God saved Lot which allows Godly men to be saved. This could be referred to the act of the Homosexual, but that might be a different thread. The Bible says the sexual imorral will not see Heaven. I have several verses to this point.
October 14, 200917 yr Just curious with this being a Heaven and Hell discussion, what others thoughts are on predestination. I'm very torn by it, there are some verses that hint at it, then others that hint against it. And in my very core I can't imagine the God I serving creating people that from day 1 have no chance of knowing him and that their whole purpose of existence will be to suffer in Hell. I'm not sure what the answer to the predestination question is. But, what I've found is that it doesn't really change anything for me personally...so, it's just one of those mysteries where the truth may never be revealed to us.
October 15, 200917 yr Author Ephesians 1:4...God chose us in Christ. Acts 2:23 ....God has prearranged plan. Matthew 22:14....Many are called, few are chosen. 2nd Timothy 1:9...Planned long before the world began. Romans 8:28...God foreknew who would be called. One thing I learned from this very hard subject is...you cannot think on the same level as God does....his ways are higher than man=Isaiah 55:8
October 28, 200916 yr Author A buddy of mine at church loaned me a book,,,23 minutes in Hell, a man claims he was sent to Hell for 23 minutes to come back and warn others. I'll report later on it.
October 28, 200916 yr A buddy of mine at church loaned me a book,,,23 minutes in Hell, a man claims he was sent to Hell for 23 minutes to come back and warn others. I'll report later on it. Wasn't that Bill Clinton's book after Hillary found out it WASN'T a right wing conspiracy?
October 28, 200916 yr Author Oh My....And I bet Bill has seen a lot more than 23 minutes of Hell. :eek:
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