Logical Question

[Run To State]

I disagree. I have judged both sides of the argument(whether you believe me or not) and have found this one to be more logical. Until I am brought major proof disclaiming my beliefs I am inclined to believe in man-made global warming.

 

Some could say its my religion :sssh:

You're certainly entitled to believe in what you want, as am I. I'm not trying to change your mind, just voicing my opinion.

[AcesFull]

There are more details of the cooling oceans in a previous thread for anybody interested enough to seek them out.

Three-thousand oceanic probes — the "Argo" program — are a problem for global-warming alarmists. More to the point, explaining the probes' findings should be a priority for the alarmists if science is what drives them, and credibility. Argo shows no global warming over the last five years. In fact, the numbers show a slight cooling. These are merely one small data set, but they cut against the rhetoric, and require attention. Interestingly, though, as one measure of the widespread disinterest, the New York Times has not reported on Argo since its launch in 2000.

 

The 3,000 probes are scattered around the world's oceans surveying temperature and salinity. They surface approximately every 10 days, beam data to researchers and submerge again. They are not the climate scientist's monitoring panacea: That would be a $3 billion oceanic system the Partnership for Observation of the Global Oceans touted to warn of everything from tsunamis to climate change to undersea volcanic activity in the Daily Telegraph recently. But they were certainly viewed as a great advance when first deployed. "What we've done in the past is piecemeal," the New York Times quoted one oceanographer not involved with the project in the newspaper's sole story more than seven years ago. The project, in his view, "will help figure out what it is we have to be doing in terms of greenhouse gas control." Now, watch for the probes' findings to be questioned, or just ignored as usual. - Argo's cool reception

[thegooch]

Lets no turn this into a if it exists debate, I am guilty of getting off course.

 

Isn't just safer to assume that it does exist, and pose a real threat?

[Run To State]

Wow, I have completely misspoke for these last few posts. Sorry about that.

 

Yes oceans are cooling

Glad you came around.

[Run To State]

Lets no turn this into a if it exists debate, I am guilty of getting off course.

 

Isn't just safer to assume that it does exist, and pose a real threat?

Not to everyone. My point is, I don't want to pay more taxes for something that's simply a theory at this point.

[ladiesbballcoach]

 

Isn't just safer to assume that it does exist, and pose a real threat?

 

Can we use this same debate with WMD in Iraq?:lol::sssh::thumb::cool::jump::lol:

[AcesFull]

Lets no turn this into a if it exists debate, I am guilty of getting off course.

 

Isn't just safer to assume that it does exist, and pose a real threat?

No, it isn't. Sequestering CO2 and/or abandoning fossil fuels will be extremely expensive and somebody will be footing the bill. If man-made global warming is a colossal hoax, then the money that would be required to reduce CO2 emissions could be spent much more wisely. There is a downside to doing as Al Gore says and not as he does, whether global warming alarmists are willing to admit it or not.

[thegooch]

Can we use this same debate with WMD in Iraq?:lol::sssh::thumb::cool::jump::lol:

 

No, because there is a difference between knocking over a country, and helping to clean up the earth. If we are wrong about warming, then all we get is a cleaner earth, and some spent tax money.

 

We make a mistake in knocking over a country then we get.....well we all see what we get.

 

Nice try though, I like the thinking! :thumb:

[ladiesbballcoach]

No, because there is a difference between knocking over a country, and helping to clean up the earth. If we are wrong about warming, then all we get is a cleaner earth, and some spent tax money.

 

We make a mistake in knocking over a country then we get.....well we all see what we get.

 

Nice try though, I like the thinking! :thumb:

 

I was just pulling your leg.:banana:

 

I think we need to be good stewards because we need to be good stewards.

 

Not because of some scare tactic that does not seem to be accurate.

 

Why can government not give tax breaks to home owners, citizens that are participating in good steward activities like businesses get.

 

Some sort of tax refund with receipts of recyclable products that you recycled.

Tax incentives for using alternative, cleaner energy for your home.

Etc, Etc.

 

I have what might seem to be a silly question but it is an honest question.

 

Growing up, we ONLY burnt our trash.

Today, I send it to Rumpke.

Which is better?

[Hearsay]

I am sitting here, at this very moment, on my back porch at the base of Rendezvous mountain, looking up at the sun set over the Grand Teton Mountain Range. My parents first brought me here in 1979, and I have been back many times, and every single year since my children were born starting in 2002. The reason I return is the sheer magnificence of the planet in this area; the majestic, snow-covered Tetons rising out of Jackson's Hole, the crystal clear Snake River meandering its way through the Hole on down to Hoback Canyon; the fantastic Wind River Range to the East; the beautiful Bridger-Teton and Targhee National forests surrounding it; the incomparable Yellowstone caldera ecosystem that I visited Monday just to the north; the moose, fox, elk, osprey, eagle, and million other species that I see each year.

 

Every year I come here, I am inspired with a renewed sense of commitment to preserve that which I witness for my children, and the Lord willing for their children and so on down the Hearsay generations.

 

The analogy used by thegooch is an interesting, and valid, one. While the commitment to the work of Christ is one that is universal to everyone, a relatiosnhip with Christ, and God, is intensely personal, and YOU, and only YOU, are responsible for it. You cannot force Christ on anyone else; while you may attempt to share Him with others, His countenance cannot be the rule of law because a relationship with Him is individual, personal, and is only effective if everyone is responsible for himself.

 

Our commitment to the environment is identical. We all have a universal responsibility to the planet. However, how each of us approaches, and therefore affects, the planet, is intensely personal, and YOU, and only YOU can be responsible for yourself in effecting that commitment. If there is one thing that militant environmentalists have not learned, it is that the use of force and rule of law to attempt to coerce people into positively affecting the planet, the more they try to tighten their grip, the more people are repelled and slip through their fingers.

 

You should not believe in God because it is "safe" to do so; you should believe in God because He is who you believe in.

 

You should not care for the planet because it is "safe" to do so; you should care for the planet out of a sense of commitment, honor, and preservation of God's magnificant creation.

 

I believe "global warming," in all of its presented glory, is bunk. However, I believe that the air can get unclean by the wrong type of emissions, and have seen it (ever sailed off the coast of L.A.?). I believe that silt deposits in Virginia waterways are lowering blue crab populations in the Chesapeake. I like blue crab. I believe that "feeding the bears" in the Jenny Lake area north of here is causing bears to like people food and gets themselves shot. I like black bears (from a distance).

 

Therefore, I approach the planet the way folks around here do. Spend money on private causes you believe in, like the Jackson Hole Land Trust or The Nature Conservancy. Don't overregulate people to death; smart regulate them. Make recycling facilities available with private funds, recycling certainly can't hurt. Ride a bike when you can instead of driving a car. Or a raft. Or a horse. Your kids will enjoy it. Listen to a young park ranger give a talk about borer-beetles and encourage him in his work; tell him he's doing a good job. Spend less time in Washington, and more time in Wilson.

 

Do your part, and encourage others to do theirs, but don't scare them with nonsensical gibberish and threats of government overregulation.

 

By the way, RTS, nice Supertramp reference.

[Guest Bluto]

RTS, I've never seen you more lyrical!!! I'm impressed! :thumb: :lol:

 

When I was young, it seemed that life was so wonderful, a miracle, oh it was beautiful, magical. And all the birds in the trees, well theyd be singing so happily, joyfully, playfully watching me. But then they send me away to teach me how to be sensible, logical, responsible, practical. And they showed me a world where I could be so dependable, clinical, intellectual, cynical.

 

From my research, I find it just he opposite. Tell me this, gooch, what are we going to do to stop solar flares? What do we do to cool the sun down?

How do you stop, the sun from shining? What makes the world go 'round?

 

Blinded by science, Im on the run

Blinded by science, where do I belong?

Whats in the future, has it just begun

Blinded by science, Im on the run

 

I worry bout the world that we live in

Im worried by all the confusion

I wonder bout the lies Ive been reading

I wonder where this madness is leading

[Guest Bluto]

I am sitting here, at this very moment, on my back porch at the base of Rendezvous mountain, looking up at the sun set over the Grand Teton Mountain Range.

 

MY first thought is: WHY are you on your computer, posting on BGP???

[75center]

Yeah, I think we should do what we can. I am about halfway to converting to squiggly bulbs at home now.

 

Check your electric service before you go all in. We found out after the fact that electric surges would pop those things in a heartbeat. They were actually lasting fewer hours than the old ones. Once we fixed the electric it's been great.

[cch5432]

On topic that has been beaten too death on this board caught my interest, Global Warming. Whether Global Warming exists or not is a decision we must all make: both sides have presented there arguments and have made a good in effort in doing so. Therefor no matter what you choose, I ask you a question. Since I am a agnostic leaning atheist I am asked this questions: Wouldn't it be safer to believe in God? If he is real then if you are sincere you get into heaven, if he is not real then nothing bad happens, you are safe either way.

 

I ask the people of BGP this: Wouldn't it be safer to assume that Global Warming exists? If it does then we can take the necessary steps to preserve the earth for our posterity. If it does not exist then no harm no foul, we have again made the earth a cleaner, greener place.

(sorry if much of this has been stated already, I have been off BGP for a few days)

Here is the fundamental difference. You are using Paschal's Wager to propose a reason to believe in God. First of all, Paschal's Wager is not a reason to believe, but a logical reason to search for a reason to believe. We do not use Paschal's Wager as proof of God, so we should not do the same for Global Warming. Alas, Paschal's Wager provides excellent reason why we should care to look for proof of Global Warming.

 

Secondly, if one believes in God and one is wrong, then your assertion is correct- no harm done. Similarly, if one believes in Global warming and one is wrong, no harm done. However, if one believe in Global Warming, and is wrong, but still supports the actions recommended by many of the Global-Warming supporters (Al Gore included), then there is plenty of harm done. There proposed policies would put an enormous burden on our country and on our economy (and I do believe that will hurt the poor in the long run more than anyone). I rarely believe that increased government regulations is a good thing, and I won't support on the basis of some theory that I don't subscribe to.

[HHSDad]

When I was young, it seemed that life was so wonderful,

a miracle, oh it was beautiful, magical.

And all the birds in the trees, well they'd be singing so happily,

joyfully, playfully watching me.

But then they send me away to teach me how to be sensible,

logical, responsible, practical.

And they showed me a world where I could be so dependable,

clinical, intellectual, cynical.

Ooops, misread the thread title.