I think Volquez's ERA is a little bit north of 1.73. By the time Maddux was 24 he had already won 61 games in the Big Leagues. When Smoltz was 22 he had a season where he won 12 games with a 2.94 ERA. Volquez and Cueto are not near that at all.

 

Clearly a typo...should be 2.73. Maddux first season wasn't exactly HOF worthy. 6-14 5.61 ERA. I never once said Volquez would end up in the HOF. I simply said they have equal potential and if they work, they could very well end up there. So just going by first seasons they are very comparable....and thats all we have right now is their first full seasons.

Clearly a typo...should be 2.73. Maddux first season wasn't exactly HOF worthy. 6-14 5.61 ERA. I never once said Volquez would end up in the HOF. I simply said they have equal potential and if they work, they could very well end up there. So just going by first seasons they are very comparable....and thats all we have right now is their first full seasons.

 

Then why were you listing their ages? The other pitchers were much more accomplished at the same ages, Smoltz and Maddux were much further along at 22 and 24 than Cueto and Volquez--that is undisputable. When they made their debuts is irrelevant. Look up their comparable numbers at the same age.

They had also been in the league a lot longer. It's not every day pitchers get called up at 20 anymore for more than a september call up.

Volquez is having a better season than either one of those two guys did at 24....

They had also been in the league a lot longer. It's not every day pitchers get called up at 20 anymore for more than a september call up.

 

 

 

Unless they are just that good. Don't think for a second that Big League GMs wouldn't call up an 8 year old if it were within the rules and he was ready to pitch in the bigs. Look Cueto and Volquez can be very good but you're comparing their potential to 2 of probably the top 50 pitchers of ALL TIME. That's ALL TIME out of the thousands that have pitched in the Big Leagues, don't you think that's a little bit out of line?

Unless they are just that good. Don't think for a second that Big League GMs wouldn't call up an 8 year old if it were within the rules and he was ready to pitch in the bigs. Look Cueto and Volquez can be very good but you're comparing their potential to 2 of probably the top 50 pitchers of ALL TIME. That's ALL TIME out of the thousands that have pitched in the Big Leagues, don't you think that's a little bit out of line?

 

 

Nothing wrong with that, players are compared to other greats all the time. No, not out of line at all.

Unless they are just that good. Don't think for a second that Big League GMs wouldn't call up an 8 year old if it were within the rules and he was ready to pitch in the bigs. Look Cueto and Volquez can be very good but you're comparing their potential to 2 of probably the top 50 pitchers of ALL TIME. That's ALL TIME out of the thousands that have pitched in the Big Leagues, don't you think that's a little bit out of line?

 

Sure it is, but right now there's nothing to say Volquez and Cueto won't be up on that list. Maybe not likely, but nothing to say it wont happen. Volquez would be getting a lot of Cy Young talk if the Reds weren't in last place. This season is a learning experience for Cueto. He never even had a september call up. You saw his first two starts just like I did.

Nothing wrong with that, players are compared to other greats all the time. No, not out of line at all.

 

I'm glad someone else gets it.

I'm glad someone else gets the point i'm trying to make.

 

 

Well, he was losing his arguement with me in the other thread. He's going O-fer for the night.:lol:

Well, he was losing his arguement with me in the other thread. He's going O-fer for the night.:lol:

Very debatable ...

They had also been in the league a lot longer. It's not every day pitchers get called up at 20 anymore for more than a september call up.

Clayton Kershaw was this year, as was Felix Hernandez two years ago.

 

The reason the Braves pitchers were "in the league a lot longer" is because they established themselves as MLB-worthy pitchers at an early age and stuck. Volquez and Cueto, as talented as they are, are behind on that count.

Very debatable ...

 

 

 

Not at all.

Clayton Kershaw was this year, as was Felix Hernandez two years ago.

 

The reason the Braves pitchers were "in the league a lot longer" is because they established themselves as MLB-worthy pitchers at an early age and stuck. Volquez and Cueto, as talented as they are, are behind on that count.

 

Wow, two pitchers in the matter of two years. Thats a lot....

 

Thanks for backing up my point. I appreciate it.

Wow, two pitchers in the matter of two years. Thats a lot....

 

Thanks for backing up my point. I appreciate it.

Not backing you up at all. Those are the only two I knew off the top of my head. There may have been more.

 

A lot of pitchers come up and stick earlier than Cueto and Volquez have, which is the point.

Not at all.

Yes, it is ... you weren't winning at all, in my book.