That simple?

 

 

 

 

 

I marked it down somewhere but have seemed to have misplaced it.

 

What's your point? I said if they continue to get quality pitching they'd be in the race. The pitching has been far from quality the past month and they are in last place. Don't really see your point.

What's your point? I said if they continue to get quality pitching they'd be in the race. The pitching has been far from quality the past month and they are in last place. Don't really see your point.

 

I said last month that was a big IF and it wouldn't hold up and you were sure that pitching had potential.

I said last month that was a big IF and it wouldn't hold up and you were sure that pitching had potential.

 

They do have potential...you disagree?

Every team can say "IF" when it comes to starting pitching. No way the Reds even sniff a wild card spot.

 

Here is what I said back in July.

They do have potential...you disagree?

 

Every staff has potential. The Cardinals staff is potentially the best in the NL but it doesn't always work like.

 

No way the Red staff was going to hold up this year. Not with basically two rookies as starters.

Every staff has potential. The Cardinals staff is potentially the best in the NL but it doesn't always work like.

 

No way the Red staff was going to hold up this year. Not with basically two rookies as starters.

 

Not every rotation has 2 guys who have the natural ability that Johnny Cueto and Edison Volquez have. In fact very few rotations do.

Not every rotation has 2 guys who have the natural ability that Johnny Cueto and Edison Volquez have. In fact very few rotations do.

 

Brewers: Sheets and Sabathia

Cardinals: Wainwright and Carpenter

D-Backs- Webb and Haren

Cubs-Zambrano and Dempster and even Hardin

Angels-Lackey, Santana

Red Sox-Beckett and Dice K

Rays-entire starting 5

White Sox-Floyd and Danks

 

There are several teams with 2 SP that have just as much or more natural ability thatn Cueto and Volquez.

 

I will say Volquez has been impressive but his stats over the past two month have not been .

Brewers: Sheets and Sabathia

Cardinals: Wainwright and Carpenter

D-Backs- Webb and Haren

Cubs-Zambrano and Dempster and even Hardin

Angels-Lackey, Santana

Red Sox-Beckett and Dice K

Rays-entire starting 5

White Sox-Floyd and Danks

 

There are several teams with 2 SP that have just as much or more natural ability thatn Cueto and Volquez.

 

I will say Volquez has been impressive but his stats over the past two month have not been .

 

You listed 8 teams...no where near the majority and a few of those aren't true IMO. Did you notice a trend in the teams you listed? All in the races. All I said was if the pitching held up they'd be in the race. You said it was a big if, I never disagreed.

You listed 8 teams...no where near the majority and a few of those aren't true IMO. Did you notice a trend in the teams you listed? All in the races. All I said was if the pitching held up they'd be in the race. You said it was a big if, I never disagreed.

 

I could have listed other teams but those are the ones off the top of my head. The cards are in the race with Carp starting 3 games and Wainwright being out 1/2 the season. The cards pitching has not held up but still find a way to compete.

 

The reds are just not good and they were really never in it. You were being unrealistic when you said they could be in it down the stretch.

I could have listed other teams but those are the ones off the top of my head. The cards are in the race with Carp starting 3 games and Wainwright being out 1/2 the season. The cards pitching has not held up but still find a way to compete.

 

The reds are just not good and they were really never in it. You were being unrealistic when you said they could be in it down the stretch.

 

The Cards also have one of the best pitching coaches in the game today. A good pitching coach can do wonders for a staff. Personally, I feel this has been a major problem for the Reds the past 5 or 6 years. They need to bring in a high profile pitching coach next season. Leo Mazzone would be a good get.

The Cards also have one of the best pitching coaches in the game today. A good pitching coach can do wonders for a staff. Personally, I feel this has been a major problem for the Reds the past 5 or 6 years. They need to bring in a high profile pitching coach next season. Leo Mazzone would be a good get.

Pitching coaches are overrated ... they get too much credit when things are good and too much blame when things go bad.

 

Leo Mazzone was supposed to be a genius in Atlanta ... so what the heck happened in Baltimore?

Pitching coaches are overrated ... they get too much credit when things are good and too much blame when things go bad.

 

Leo Mazzone was supposed to be a genius in Atlanta ... so what the heck happened in Baltimore?

 

So he's overrated because his pitcher's ERA's dropped by .6 when he took over, then rose by .7 after he left? I'm sure the Reds would love to see their ERA drop by .6. I heard this on the radio the other day. If you don't think Mazzone is a top of the line pitching then you're mistaken.

Pitching coaches are overrated ... they get too much credit when things are good and too much blame when things go bad.

 

Leo Mazzone was supposed to be a genius in Atlanta ... so what the heck happened in Baltimore?

 

I agree with you somewhat on the overrated. But if the right pitchers are with the right pitching coach then I can see this being a factor. The reason Duncan is good is because he has success with players that have potential but have never reached it. Dunc seems to be good with players like that. Now Rookies on the other hand have not been that goood with Duncan.

Personally, I feel this has been a major problem for the Reds the past 5 or 6 years.

 

I won't argue that.

So he's overrated because his pitcher's ERA's dropped by .6 when he took over, then rose by .7 after he left? I'm sure the Reds would love to see their ERA drop by .6. I heard this on the radio the other day.

Where did this happen?

If you don't think Mazzone is a top of the line pitching then you're mistaken.

Baltimore's team ERA in 2005, before Mazzone came there, was 4.56. In 2006 and 2007, the two years he was there, the team ERA was 5.35 and 5.17 ... this year it's 4.80.

 

I'm not saying he's not a good pitching coach, only that pitching coaches' work is overrated. But as good as he is purported to be, the Orioles' pitching was worse on his watch.

 

Let's face it ... it's easy to look like a genius when you have good young pitchers like John Smoltz and Tom Glavine, then sign Greg Maddux at his peak as a free agent.