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I mentioned this in another thread, but I think it deserves it's own thread.

 

We've had other threads about what we think should be done to eliminate or decrease the numbers of people receiving aid.

 

We've gnashed teeth about "freeloaders" and gnawed over the abusers.

 

But, we really need to discuss what actually needs, and can be done. I would assume that even the most bitter among us recognizes that there is a need for a support system. That may be an incorrect assumption, but I'm running on that one.

 

IMO, the problem isn't in the programs that are provided, but in the administration of the system. That's where reform needs to start.

 

I personally know of administration abuse. Not because I benefit from it, or have been denied benefits because of it; but because I know some people who work in the administration of it, and others who have been guided by their case workers in the ways to manipulate the system.

 

So, my first step to a solution is to thoroughly investigate the administration. Audit the process and those who are charged with approving or denying eligibility.

 

We all wail about people who live their lives on benefits, but are seemingly able to work. We rail about the brand new cars sitting outside subsidized housing. We rant about people buying sodas and chips at the gas station with an EBT card.

 

I propose we first start with an outside audit of those who have been on aid for more than 2 years.

 

From there, of those who have been continually confirmed eligible for benefits, look at who is administering their cases. Are those workers thorough in their investigative process? I submit that just because seemingly appropriate documents are provided by the person seeking benefits, that further investigation should ensue to ensure that the documents have not been falsified or forged.

 

Further, should a benefit recepient actually be charged with bringing documentation with them personally, or personally providing it in any way? What small step would it be to have the caseworker contact the provided references, etc, to ensure that veritable documentation is being provided? For instance, instead of giving a recepient a form to be filled out by an employer and asking the recepient to bring it back completed. Why not ask simply for the name of the employer, and sending it to that company directly? I know people who get these forms and have friends fill them out for them. The employer never sees them. I have yet to hear that the recepient was busted when the aid office called the employer to verify the information.

 

Just some random thoughts I've been having....Maybe the system isn't broke because we have abusers. Maybe the system is broke because we don't do enough to stop abuse.

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Lordy, I wouldn't even know where to start. I think you also have to throw in indigent health care in this topic. We need a solution that doesn't lock people into poverty. WIC seems to be one of the more productive programs. I have issues with the whole state job placement program. I think its very ineffectual. The person who solves this deserves a Nobel.

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My cousin had a child in the 80's that had serious problems at birth and is mentally retarded for the rest of his life. At the time his medicine was $5,000 a week.

 

After her maternity leave, she wanted to return to work as a salad bar supervisor at Frisch's and was not allowed by the government because she couldn't work and bring in a salary at the same time of receiving aid for his son's medicine.

 

There should be ways to supplement work without forcing people out of work.

 

Hopefully, this has changed but I fear it has not.

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I don’t know the specifics of the various welfare systems we currently use, so I can’t speak to those. But from what I can gather, our welfare system fails in moving people from the welfare rolls to the payrolls. I think rockmom touched on this in the other thread, but once a minimum income is hit - and it’s a low threshold – a person loses their benefits, making it advantageous to remain unemployed. I don’t think it’s a matter of money in the system, but the system itself that needs overhauled.

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My cousin had a child in the 80's that had serious problems at birth and is mentally retarded for the rest of his life. At the time his medicine was $5,000 a week.

 

After her maternity leave, she wanted to return to work as a salad bar supervisor at Frisch's and was not allowed by the government because she couldn't work and bring in a salary at the same time of receiving aid for his son's medicine.

 

There should be ways to supplement work without forcing people out of work.

 

Hopefully, this has changed but I fear it has not.

 

:thumb:

 

 

 

And no, it has not changed.

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I just spoke today with a dear friend of mine. This is the same young woman who had her already meager food assistance cut significantly because she worked hard and received a 23 cent raise.

 

She told me that she got a letter from the preschool/daycare program she was hoping to enroll her little girl in, informing her that she made too much money. Yet she barely makes enough to get by each month. Makes no sense. If she quit work to stay home and care for the little girl, she would be able to qualify for housing and daycare assistance and probably be better off financially. But she doesn't want to quit working and doing her best to provide for her child on her own. Yet the system is essentially encouraging her to do just that. We are motivating the unmotivated to stay unmotivated,while at the same time, discouraging the motivated from staying motivated. Something is terribly amiss.

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I just spoke today with a dear friend of mine. This is the same young woman who had her assistance cut significantly because she worked hard and received a 23 cent raise.

 

She informed me that she got a letter from the preschool/daycare program she was hoping to enroll her little girl in that she made too much money. Yet she barely makes enough to get by each month. Makes no sense. If she quit work to stay home and care for the little girl, she would be able to qualify for housing and daycare assistance and probably be better off financially. But she doesn't want to quit working and doing her best to provide for her child on her own. Yet the system is essentially encouraging her to do just that. We are motivating the unmotivated to stay unmotivated,while at the same time, discouraging the motivated from staying motivated. Something is terribly amiss.

 

Preach on brother, preach on.

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I just spoke today with a dear friend of mine. This is the same young woman who had her already meager food assistance cut significantly because she worked hard and received a 23 cent raise.

 

She told me that she got a letter from the preschool/daycare program she was hoping to enroll her little girl in, informing her that she made too much money. Yet she barely makes enough to get by each month. Makes no sense. If she quit work to stay home and care for the little girl, she would be able to qualify for housing and daycare assistance and probably be better off financially. But she doesn't want to quit working and doing her best to provide for her child on her own. Yet the system is essentially encouraging her to do just that. We are motivating the unmotivated to stay unmotivated,while at the same time, discouraging the motivated from staying motivated. Something is terribly amiss.

 

:thumb:

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Lordy, I wouldn't even know where to start. I think you also have to throw in indigent health care in this topic. We need a solution that doesn't lock people into poverty. WIC seems to be one of the more productive programs. I have issues with the whole state job placement program. I think its very ineffectual. The person who solves this deserves a Nobel.

 

I think the whole system in general (welfare) is beyond help as it is today. I think the whole system needs to be overhauled.

 

(1) Medical Cards - I have a big problem with a program that will issue a

medical card to someone just because they are pregnant. I know of

a family that the daughter got a medical card, AFDC, food stamps and

WIC and her family is filthy rich, and I do mean FILTHY. Her father

is so well know and so rich that it would make you sick but she moved

out when she got pregnant and we provided everything for her then

and we still are providing for her and her child.

 

We should not be issuing medical cards to women who arrive in

our country pregnant and can't speak a speck of english. They

have nothing showing who they are, where they live or what kind

of income they have, and the horrible thing is, they don't have

to prove anything in order to receive that medical card.

 

(2) I'll address the WIC that I highlighted in HHS post. WIC is a

wonderful program but I have always felt that if you receive

food stamps then you shouldn't receive WIC also. If you get

a medical card, food stamps, free lunch, etc, etc, you qualify

for WIC. Now, if you get none of those but fall short by a few

bucks you cannot get WIC. Perhaps if they would change the rules

then they could raise the income limit for people and more could get

some help.

 

(3) Doing more audits of the people who are providing these services

might show us some of what is wrong with the system. Make the

audits real and make them count. I sat through an audit for over

5 months (something was done in our office) and was interviewed

so many times I got sick whenever they called me. After I retired

there was nothing else done. After all those months, the person

who did the "something wrong" was just let go. There was nothing

done to her. If you aren't going to make people step up when

they do something wrong then don't bother spending tax money on

audits.

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I think another problem with our current system is that is unintentionally anti-family. It doesn't pay for a single mom to marry the father of her children. This causes a lot of harm in families in poverty.

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I think another problem with our current system is that is unintentionally anti-family. It doesn't pay for a single mom to marry the father of her children. This causes a lot of harm in families in poverty.

:thumb::thumb: We have a winner!!!!!

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I am not sure which single moms you folks have run into, but as a teacher I meet a bunch every semester. The ones I know have no business whatsoever compounding an already stupid mistake by an even bigger one-marrying the jerk they opened their legs for. I prefer seeing the single mom who has made such an error get her education, learn from her mistake, grow up, work hard to help care for and love her child, and hopefully when she is at a better point of attraction in her life, meet a decent, loving, responsible man who will work with her to make a better life. The welfare system , in my opinion, should not necessarily encourage an almost certain disasterous marriage and all of the emotional scarring that always follows.

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I am not sure which single moms you folks have run into, but as a teacher I meet a bunch every semester. The ones I know have no business whatsoever compounding an already stupid mistake by an even bigger one-marrying the jerk they opened their legs for. I prefer seeing the single mom who has made such an error get her education, learn from her mistake, grow up, work hard to help care for and love her child, and hopefully when she is at a better point of attraction in her life, meet a decent, loving, responsible man who will work with her to make a better life. The welfare system , in my opinion, should not necessarily encourage an almost certain disasterous marriage and all of the emotional scarring that always follows.

 

 

Good point, but at the same time it shouldn't penalize those who really do have a loving relationship with the father of their child.

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