Can they afford to just eat Ludwick's contract? If so who do they replace him with?

1) I don't care about his power, speed, or defensive. I care about his OBP, and his OPS. He's fantastic. He's always been one of the best at getting on base, no way does that all of a sudden change.

 

I think OPS is a great indicator of offensive skill and I wouldn't give anyone who can't get to .900 $15 million. If his 2009, 2010, and 2013 were what I was going to get for next 4 years, you could probably talk me into this. However, 2011 was a clunker and 2012 was about midpoint between 2011 and 2013, so those scare me. Then add in that we are talking years 32-35, and I get VERY cautious.

 

Forgetting whether or not I'd give him that, because I'm not sitting on $15 million, I don't think he'll end up with that from anyone.

 

Side-note: while I also love OPS, to lead off with "I don't care about power, speed, or defense" appears to be going over-board a little, doesn't it? I don't want to jump into your ongoing UKMF vs. Spindoc argument, I'm truly somewhere in the middle, but to "not care" about key pieces of his game and focus only on his ability to get on base and OPS seems like you're taking things to extremes.

 

You can add Choo won't get $15 million to my earlier prediction that Arroyo wouldn't get $10 million per (and that the Reds would never offer him a one-year tender for fear he'd take it).

 

Thanks for the "count on it" regarding Hanigan, I was looking for someone to give me some inside info with the Reds, I appreciate that. I'm sure finding a dance partner for a $4 million non-everyday catcher won't be a challenge.

Can they afford to just eat Ludwick's contract? If so who do they replace him with?

 

$8.5 million? What do you think? Oh, and the $4.5 million buy-out to go away after next year...let's not forget that.

I think OPS is a great indicator of offensive skill and I wouldn't give anyone who can't get to .900 $15 million. If his 2009, 2010, and 2013 were what I was going to get for next 4 years, you could probably talk me into this. However, 2011 was a clunker and 2012 was about midpoint between 2011 and 2013, so those scare me. Then add in that we are talking years 32-35, and I get VERY cautious.

 

Forgetting whether or not I'd give him that, because I'm not sitting on $15 million, I don't think he'll end up with that from anyone.

 

Side-note: while I also love OPS, to lead off with "I don't care about power, speed, or defense" appears to be going over-board a little, doesn't it? I don't want to jump into your ongoing UKMF vs. Spindoc argument, I'm truly somewhere in the middle, but to "not care" about key pieces of his game and focus only on his ability to get on base and OPS seems like you're taking things to extremes.

 

You can add Choo won't get $15 million to my earlier prediction that Arroyo wouldn't get $10 million per (and that the Reds would never offer him a one-year tender for fear he'd take it).

 

Thanks for the "count on it" regarding Hanigan, I was looking for someone to give me some inside info with the Reds, I appreciate that. I'm sure finding a dance partner for a $4 million non-everyday catcher won't be a challenge.

 

As to the "I don't care about power, speed, or defense" comment, did you once this year say to yourself, "Man, I wish Choo hit more HRs" or how about "Man, it sure would be nice if Choo played better defense", or even, "Choo just doesn't steal enough bases"?

 

I know I sure didn't.

 

As to the Hanigan comment, clearly you know I have no "info" whatsoever. There's no way they're keeping 3 catchers though, and he's the one that's primed to be moved.

As to the "I don't care about power, speed, or defense" comment, did you once this year say to yourself, "Man, I wish Choo hit more HRs" or how about "Man, it sure would be nice if Choo played better defense", or even, "Choo just doesn't steal enough bases"?

 

I know I sure didn't.

 

As to the Hanigan comment, clearly you know I have no "info" whatsoever. There's no way they're keeping 3 catchers though, and he's the one that's primed to be moved.

 

I commented on his defense several times, yes, particularly when he'd take bad angles to the ball. Did I comment on his speed? Yes, frequently when he was on first late in a game, down 1, a horrible #2 hitter coming to the dish, and knowing he couldn't get to 2nd on his own. Power? No. In my mind, .900 is where daddy-warbucks players reside, and he has never, ever been there. And likely, at this age, not ever going to. I do think his OBP was a bit of an aberration (especially after two sub-par years for him, based on the previous 2 years) as I don't think he'll get plunked 26 times again.

^.900 is a very rare club....So, you wouldn't give Robinson Cano $15M a year? Evan Longoria? Yadi? Allen Craig? Beltre? Beltran? Mauer? Giancarlo? Joey Bats?

^.900 is a very rare club....So, you wouldn't give Robinson Cano $15M a year? Evan Longoria? Yadi? Allen Craig? Beltre? Beltran? Mauer? Giancarlo? Joey Bats?

 

I'm still trying to figure out how the Reds can afford to release Ludwick and eat the $11-12 million that will cost and then replace him.

I'm still trying to figure out how the Reds can afford to release Ludwick and eat the $11-12 million that will cost and then replace him.

 

What they should do, and what the can do are two totally different things...

What they should do, and what the can do are two totally different things...

 

Heck if that's the case why don't they just release both Phillips and Ludwick and bring in Ellsbury and Cano?

Heck if that's the case why don't they just release both Phillips and Ludwick and bring in Ellsbury and Cano?

 

Sigh....This is pointless, but anyways...My point is, they need to replace Ludwick if they want to have a chance at success this season.

I'm still trying to figure out how the Reds can afford to release Ludwick and eat the $11-12 million that will cost and then replace him.

 

I'm still trying to figure out what the hell Ludwick has to do with my post you quoted.

I'm still trying to figure out what the hell Ludwick has to do with my post you quoted.

 

I was going back to your list of things that they need to do. It is extremely unrealistic to think that they can afford to release Ludwick, or even trade him unless they absorb a significant part of his salary. About the best that they can hope for is that he has a decent start next season and someone with deep pockets needs a bat at the deadline next season. They certainly can't afford to eat his contract and pay a capable replacement.

I commented on his defense several times, yes, particularly when he'd take bad angles to the ball. Did I comment on his speed? Yes, frequently when he was on first late in a game, down 1, a horrible #2 hitter coming to the dish, and knowing he couldn't get to 2nd on his own. Power? No. In my mind, .900 is where daddy-warbucks players reside, and he has never, ever been there. And likely, at this age, not ever going to. I do think his OBP was a bit of an aberration (especially after two sub-par years for him, based on the previous 2 years) as I don't think he'll get plunked 26 times again.

 

Here's the thing, speed and power are almost never dance partners. There's a select few that posses both the capabilities to steal 40 bases a year and hit 30+ HR a season. So, you can't have your cake and eat it too in that regard. Let's face it, the Reds weren't really a threat to steal if there was anybody on base not named Hamilton.

 

The thing that I use as a barometer, is the guy he replaced. Stubbs was fast, as well as agile on defense. Did he steal more bases that Choo? Sure. Did he play a better CF? Yes. However, Choo not only was on base more often, he also hit more HR's and had a higher slugging percentage than Drew did his last year here. In my mind the "trade off" between Choo's numbers (offensively/defensively) and Stubbs' is waaaay in favor of Choo.

 

Now, as to whether all of that translates to $15m per year...I don't know. Millionaire/Billionaire owners sometimes make strange decisions, so I'm not even going to try and guess whether or not someone will sign him to that. Do I wish the Reds could get him back? Yes. But, I'll have to see what he ultimately signs for (if it's with another team) to say whether or not the Reds could really "afford" to have him back.

^.900 is a very rare club....So, you wouldn't give Robinson Cano $15M a year? Evan Longoria? Yadi? Allen Craig? Beltre? Beltran? Mauer? Giancarlo? Joey Bats?

 

Cano has been over .900 more than once.

Longoria? No.

Yadier, catcher is different, so much more than offense and he is special.

Allen Craig? No, and neither are the Cards.

Beltre, has been over .900 several times.

Beltran? He has been over .900 a ton of times.

 

Shin Shoo Choo isn't those guys. It isn't my loot, if he can get $15 million, more power to him. If I'm wrong and he gets that I'll show up and admit I know nothing about baseball finances. He won't get it....

Hogwash! .285 / 20 / 60 and average at best defensively isn't a $15 million player. Even if you accept that his BB / OBP / Runs Scored were the new norm for him, and not an aberration, he isn't a $15 million guy.

 

Fans continue to slay me, Votto is a bum (for the money) and only makes $12.5 this coming year, but Shoo is worth $15 million and his numbers were worse thatn Joey's across the board. So which is it?

 

I was firmly in the Votto is by far the reds best player camp and that BP's season was a fluke.