I think you know as well as I do that you cant necessarily go off last seasons stats. You also have to look at the situation. Giesler wasnt fighting for time with other big men. Stauffer had a senior or 2 and was playing with Tate Nichols who likes the basketball. Stauffer asserted himself last season and will only continue to grow. Plus, he may play a higher level of competition than NCC in my opinion.

 

 

Sounds like throwing under the bus to me.

 

You are way underrating Geisler athletically. I think he is going to start football at defensive end at NewCath this year and runs the floor well for a big man. He has really slimmed down and is as good athletically as any big on the list for N KY except for Pittman. Earls runs the floor extremely well but is not as physical as Geisler.

 

Timmy Knipp is going to be a very VERY good big man. IMHO he will be the top big in the state next season. With the exception of Pittman of course.

 

Fant and Gibbs will both be ahead of Knipp.

Edited May 1, 200917 yr by gold sunrise
Fixing quote

Sounds like throwing under the bus to me.

 

You are way underrating Geisler athletically. I think he is going to start football at defensive end at NewCath this year and runs the floor well for a big man. He has really slimmed down and is as good athletically as any big on the list for N KY except for Pittman. Earls runs the floor extremely well but is not as physical as Geisler.

 

You're WAY off here. This wasnt throwing anyone under the bus. I simply stated a fact... Giesler didnt have another big man that he was truly competing with. Stauffer did. That's a fact. If Lebron and Kobe played together would they contribute the way they do individually? Absolutely not. I dont throw kids "under the bus", I simply stated a fact. Giesler IS a nice player. No doubt about that.

 

Dont make assumptions or put words into someone's mouth. that's not cool.

What's your reasoning for Geisler not being above Stauffer? Geisler was the most consistent big man for that sophomore class. Stauffer was too inconsistent IMO to be considered ahead of Geisler.

 

Thelen really started to come on before his mid season injury. It's tough to give him a fair assessment because we didn't get to see him a full season.

 

Geisler- 90-175 (51%)

Earls- 125-234 (54%)

Pittman- 193-366 (53%)

 

Geisler/Stauffer, Stauffer/Geisler.... I never said Stauffer was above Geisler, I just said that I dont know that I would necessarily put Geisler ahead of Stauffer. Both were very solid last season as sophomores. Both will continue to get better. I personally think Stauffer is more athletic than Geisler. The kid doesnt wear down. He has a very "high motor" (to coin a football term) that doesnt quit. He isn't as big as Geisler, but he plays an inch or 2 bigger than is doesnt appear to get "out-muscled" by anyone. Should be fun to watch these two progress. Both are good players. 2 and 2a either way behind Pittman in NKY. (My opinion)

 

The Thelen thing, I dont get either. Very solid offensive contributor. The kid can shoot at times. I dont see much out of him defensively. Maybe he was hurt or something. I dont know much about him. But, when I've seen him play some defense was lacking. Also, if you put him inside, he is going to get banged around by stronger, bigger guys. If you put him on the wing, a nice spot for him, and could probably take the bigger, stronger guys out there.

Geisler/Stauffer, Stauffer/Geisler.... I never said Stauffer was above Geisler, I just said that I dont know that I would necessarily put Geisler ahead of Stauffer. Both were very solid last season as sophomores. Both will continue to get better. I personally think Stauffer is more athletic than Geisler. The kid doesnt wear down. He has a very "high motor" (to coin a football term) that doesnt quit. He isn't as big as Geisler, but he plays an inch or 2 bigger than is doesnt appear to get "out-muscled" by anyone. Should be fun to watch these two progress. Both are good players. 2 and 2a either way behind Pittman in NKY. (My opinion)

 

Geisler is more physically and mentally mature than Stauffer at this point and is more athletic than you're giving him credit for. I agree Stauffer has a high motor and is deceptively athletic with nice talent, but I have to disagree that he doesn't get "out-muscled" by anyone. Several bigs pushed him around in their games against Ryle...Pittman, Geisler, O'Connor, Grubbs, and Watson, to name a few. Stauffer has more range than Geisler but overall just isn't as solid as Geisler yet. That very well could change over the next two years though, because as you said, both are good players.

 

The Thelen thing, I dont get either. Very solid offensive contributor. The kid can shoot at times. I dont see much out of him defensively. Maybe he was hurt or something. I dont know much about him. But, when I've seen him play some defense was lacking. Also, if you put him inside, he is going to get banged around by stronger, bigger guys. If you put him on the wing, a nice spot for him, and could probably take the bigger, stronger guys out there.

 

I think the thing with Thelen was just a matter of confidence. From looking at the CCH stats, he didn't get very much playing time at the beginning of the season. Once he started seeing more time, you could notice a drastic improvement in his game both offensively and defensively. He began grabbing more rebounds, taking more shots, and becoming more aggressive on both ends of the floor. He also held his own in the game against Holmes. I'm not sure if it was from a lack of effort from Pittman or not, but Thelen was having his way down low. He finished with 10 points and 9 rebounds that game. Pretty solid if you ask me considering none of the other big men you mention finished with over 7 points against Pittman.

You're WAY off here. This wasnt throwing anyone under the bus. I simply stated a fact... Giesler didnt have another big man that he was truly competing with. Stauffer did. That's a fact. If Lebron and Kobe played together would they contribute the way they do individually? Absolutely not. I dont throw kids "under the bus", I simply stated a fact. Giesler IS a nice player. No doubt about that.

 

Dont make assumptions or put words into someone's mouth. that's not cool.

 

 

How about Matt Geisler, POY in his division and also pretty good size. I don't recall NewCath starting a five guard offense at any time this season. NewCath didn't run their offense thru Jake any more than Ryle did thru Stauffer. Those are facts as well.

 

If you are going to use that logic then how can you leave O'Conner off of your list? Better stats than Stauffer, outplayed him head to head and also had to share court with Gligoravic, an All Conference selection? Shouldn't O'Conner be in your top five based on that?

 

Imagine O'Conners stats if he didn't have to share the court with another quality big or does it actually benefit you to have another quality player on the interior?:ylsuper:

:popcorn::irked:I can't remember his name:ohbrother: but the Kid from East Carter IMO needs to be listed on here. He was a Jr. last year and around 6' 7" or 6' 8":thumb: He will be a great ball player this next season.

:popcorn::irked:I can't remember his name:ohbrother: but the Kid from East Carter IMO needs to be listed on here. He was a Jr. last year and around 6' 7" or 6' 8":thumb: He will be a great ball player this next season.

 

Colt Barnhill.

Fant and Gibbs will both be ahead of Knipp.

 

Don't think so.

Don't think so.

 

How many times have you seen Fant and Gibbs play? Fant is easily the best big man in the state for his class and Gibbs is rapidly emerging as one of the hottest prospects in the state for the c/o 2010.

 

Knipp is a solid player but not nearly as sound as those two. Both are complete players offensively and defensively. Knipp struggles defensively with athletic kids who are his size. See the Holmes game against Pittman as evidence. He benefitted greatly from playing with the Faulkners and Ferguson throughout his young career because very rarely was he forced to create off the dribble or use post moves with his back to the basket to score.

 

Fant and Gibbs are both much more attractive prospects.

I mentioned Fant and Knipp in my earlier quote as being tops. Read back!!!!!!!!!

How many times have you seen Fant and Gibbs play? Fant is easily the best big man in the state for his class and Gibbs is rapidly emerging as one of the hottest prospects in the state for the c/o 2010.

 

Knipp is a solid player but not nearly as sound as those two. Both are complete players offensively and defensively. Knipp struggles defensively with athletic kids who are his size. See the Holmes game against Pittman as evidence. He benefitted greatly from playing with the Faulkners and Ferguson throughout his young career because very rarely was he forced to create off the dribble or use post moves with his back to the basket to score.

 

Fant and Gibbs are both much more attractive prospects.

 

Ive seen all 3 and would say that all of them are very close.

How about Matt Geisler, POY in his division and also pretty good size. I don't recall NewCath starting a five guard offense at any time this season. NewCath didn't run their offense thru Jake any more than Ryle did thru Stauffer. Those are facts as well.

 

If you are going to use that logic then how can you leave O'Conner off of your list? Better stats than Stauffer, outplayed him head to head and also had to share court with Gligoravic, an All Conference selection? Shouldn't O'Conner be in your top five based on that?

 

Imagine O'Conners stats if he didn't have to share the court with another quality big or does it actually benefit you to have another quality player on the interior?:ylsuper:

 

I didnt leave O'Conner off my list intentionally. He may be a good player. I have not had to much of an opportunity to see him play. But you need to check the stats again. Stauffer had more points, and more rebounds. He also had less turnovers, and this is in important stat. Not to mention, Stauffer never played more than 28 minutes in a game and he only did that once. O'Connor played more than 28 minutes 5 times. His two biggest game were also against Calvary Christian and Silver Grove. And, to boot, O'Connor is a Junior.

 

Look, Im not trying to debate the fact that O'Connor isnt a good player. You can clearly see that he is a nice player. Not to mention that he is 6'8" and still has another whole season to play. And he does play with another nice big man in Gligorevic who is a forward though, not a center ("big man"). O'Connor should be fun to watch next season.

 

Stauffer is a very nice player. And he went to combat with an older, bigger guy on the team and he held his own. This is what I mean by saying that Stauffer really had to compete for time with another big man. Jake Geisler didnt have to split time with Matt. One is a center, one is a smaller forward.

 

Look, all are nice players, period. You are entitled to your opinion, it is apparent you like Geisler and O'Conner, both very nice Players. I think Stauffer is gonna be a top 5 big man in NKY next season which is what I stated from the first post. IMO he could be top 2 or 3. If I'm not mistaken I had Geisler in there as well.

I didnt leave O'Conner off my list intentionally. He may be a good player. I have not had to much of an opportunity to see him play. But you need to check the stats again. Stauffer had more points, and more rebounds. He also had less turnovers, and this is in important stat. Not to mention, Stauffer never played more than 28 minutes in a game and he only did that once. O'Connor played more than 28 minutes 5 times. His two biggest game were also against Calvary Christian and Silver Grove. And, to boot, O'Connor is a Junior.

 

Look, Im not trying to debate the fact that O'Connor isnt a good player. You can clearly see that he is a nice player. Not to mention that he is 6'8" and still has another whole season to play. And he does play with another nice big man in Gligorevic who is a forward though, not a center ("big man"). O'Connor should be fun to watch next season.

 

Stauffer is a very nice player. And he went to combat with an older, bigger guy on the team and he held his own. This is what I mean by saying that Stauffer really had to compete for time with another big man. Jake Geisler didnt have to split time with Matt. One is a center, one is a smaller forward.

 

Look, all are nice players, period. You are entitled to your opinion, it is apparent you like Geisler and O'Conner, both very nice Players. I think Stauffer is gonna be a top 5 big man in NKY next season which is what I stated from the first post. IMO he could be top 2 or 3. If I'm not mistaken I had Geisler in there as well.

 

I like Stauffer and have posted on here many times how much I like his game. Stauffer started many games for Ryle with Nichols and in the Ryle games I saw it was not Stauffer and Nichols subbing in for one another. If anything Tate played more of the 5 position and Bobby played more of a true 4 position.

 

As far as the stats between Stauffer and O'Conner:

 

Stauffer

8.5 ppg

98 defensive rebounds

39 offensive rebounds

27 blocks

47 turnovers

16 steals

16 assists

 

O'Conner

8.4 ppg

79 defensive rebounds

49 offensive rebounds

59 blocks

60 turnovers

29 steals

34 assists

 

While O'Conner did have more turnovers he did have more blocks, assists and steals. While checking Scotts stats they also did not put in their last 5 games with the last regular season game against Cooper and two district games and two regional games. I am assuming that since O'Conner made the All District tourney team and Scott made a nice run in the regional that his stats would only have improved.

 

I will give you the Silver Grove game but Ryle had a few of those games on their schedule as well (think of their Christmas tourney) and Calvary was a quality team this season representing the 10th in the All A.

 

What all this means is as you say both are quality players and imho I am not ready to rate Stauffer as a top 2-3 big player in N Ky yet! For the same reason that I have not put Thelen into the mix and I like his game as much as I like Stauffer. While both made great strides last year both need to make improvements to their game and become more consistent at the varsity level.

 

In my opinion Stauffer needs to work harder without the ball on the offensive side and become a better offensive rebounder. Rebounding is not all about size, it is much about anticipation and desire. On the defensive side he needs to become a better off the ball defender. The biggest improvement he needs to make is to learn to channel his competitive nature and not question every foul call and not have to react and become involved in every incident on the floor. Talk less and play more.

 

He plays with great energy and that is one of his strengths but his summer coach and high school coach need to start sending him the message that he will be so much better when he learns to channel his energy.

 

I think he is a top 10 big player in N Ky right now but if improves on some of the things I have mentioned he has the potential to be a top 5.

I like Stauffer and have posted on here many times how much I like his game. Stauffer started many games for Ryle with Nichols and in the Ryle games I saw it was not Stauffer and Nichols subbing in for one another. If anything Tate played more of the 5 position and Bobby played more of a true 4 position.

 

As far as the stats between Stauffer and O'Conner:

 

Stauffer

8.5 ppg

98 defensive rebounds

39 offensive rebounds

27 blocks

47 turnovers

16 steals

16 assists

 

O'Conner

8.4 ppg

79 defensive rebounds

49 offensive rebounds

59 blocks

60 turnovers

29 steals

34 assists

 

While O'Conner did have more turnovers he did have more blocks, assists and steals. While checking Scotts stats they also did not put in their last 5 games with the last regular season game against Cooper and two district games and two regional games. I am assuming that since O'Conner made the All District tourney team and Scott made a nice run in the regional that his stats would only have improved.

 

I will give you the Silver Grove game but Ryle had a few of those games on their schedule as well (think of their Christmas tourney) and Calvary was a quality team this season representing the 10th in the All A.

 

What all this means is as you say both are quality players and imho I am not ready to rate Stauffer as a top 2-3 big player in N Ky yet! For the same reason that I have not put Thelen into the mix and I like his game as much as I like Stauffer. While both made great strides last year both need to make improvements to their game and become more consistent at the varsity level.

 

In my opinion Stauffer needs to work harder without the ball on the offensive side and become a better offensive rebounder. Rebounding is not all about size, it is much about anticipation and desire. On the defensive side he needs to become a better off the ball defender. The biggest improvement he needs to make is to learn to channel his competitive nature and not question every foul call and not have to react and become involved in every incident on the floor. Talk less and play more.

 

He plays with great energy and that is one of his strengths but his summer coach and high school coach need to start sending him the message that he will be so much better when he learns to channel his energy.

 

I think he is a top 10 big player in N Ky right now but if improves on some of the things I have mentioned he has the potential to be a top 5.

 

You are very much entitled to your opinion and it is respected. But, just as much as you are going to give your say... So will I.

 

You are forgetting that O'Connor is going to be a Senior. Stauffer just a Junior. For being a whole year behind, the stats are pretty comparable, if not dead even. You must admit that... As far as working without the ball on offense, you are way off here IMO. The kid works so hard on both sides of the basktball floor. Maybe he does question some calls, but what passionate, competitive basketball player doesnt. As much as you say that this is his flaw, it's that same fire that burns in him to wanna be great and makes him a real good ball player. Or would you rather these boys just lay down. IMO it's his fire and passion that makes him so good as just a sophomore.

 

As far as summer ball, I've seen him a few times in Louisville and in a tournament in Cincinnati... Seems to be playing well to me. Yet to see anyone push him around or shut him down.