Rules Question Help Needed

[jdbaker12]

I do have a question about the rules, we had two situations in the game, 1st was 12 men in the huddle and as the huddle breaks one player goes off the field. Isn't that an illegal substution or in high school are you allowed to break the huddle with more than 11? The 2nd is a ball is intercepted at the 2 yard line, then run back into the endzone where he fumbles the ball and recovered by another player on his team. Is it a safety or a touchback? IN the game it was ruled a safety, but i was wondering if it should of been ruled a touchback since the defender who intercepted the ball wasnt the one who recovered it.

[O-Line 50]

:lol:

But really (not to defend coaches) it wasn't a pretend substitution in this case.

 

If it is 3rd and 5 at the 50 and they run the ball up the middle for no gain.......and the "punt" call comes from the sidelines......and four players run on the field and three run off .......and the wide receiver that was on the field for the 3rd down play...........starts towards the sidelines yelling at the coach for the play call..........

 

who's to say deception was involved? The coach could yell back, "Shut up and get out here wide and Go!!!.

 

Like I said it works to perfection.

 

I never knew where Dayton got this play from maybe they got it from Bellevue or maybe Bellevue got it from Dayton but I have seen Dayton run the exact same play with no flag, several times. I thought it was a pretty smart play :lol:

[refinstripes]

Can #70 catch a screen pass?

 

behind the line of scrimmage.... and it must be a backwards pass....

[kissinger]

I do have a question about the rules, we had two situations in the game, 1st was 12 men in the huddle and as the huddle breaks one player goes off the field. Isn't that an illegal substution or in high school are you allowed to break the huddle with more than 11? The 2nd is a ball is intercepted at the 2 yard line, then run back into the endzone where he fumbles the ball and recovered by another player on his team. Is it a safety or a touchback? IN the game it was ruled a safety, but i was wondering if it should of been ruled a touchback since the defender who intercepted the ball wasnt the one who recovered it.

 

 

Let's see how the debate goes on your second one. Lots of definitions involved.

[refinstripes]

I do have a question about the rules, we had two situations in the game, 1st was 12 men in the huddle and as the huddle breaks one player goes off the field. Isn't that an illegal substution or in high school are you allowed to break the huddle with more than 11? The 2nd is a ball is intercepted at the 2 yard line, then run back into the endzone where he fumbles the ball and recovered by another player on his team. Is it a safety or a touchback? IN the game it was ruled a safety, but i was wondering if it should of been ruled a touchback since the defender who intercepted the ball wasnt the one who recovered it.

 

 

The rule does not mention anything about 12 men in the huddle....

 

yes, they do have more than 11 on the field when they break is Illegal sub. Understand, when a sub comes into the game, their replacement must leave immediately! At times, during hurry up stuff, this tends to happen but the replaced player does leave immediately.

 

#2 the momentum rule could come into effect. It is neither a safety or a touchback if a defensive player is inside his five yard line when he intercepts a forward pass, or catches or recovers a kick, backwards pass or fumbleand his MOMENTUM carries him into the endzone where he is downed or loses possession of the ball. In this scenario I mentioned, the ball would come out to the 2 yard line if your play had momentum.

 

Now, if it did not have momentum and B took the ball into the EZ, in the scenario you mentioned, the officials got it right. If B took the ball into the EZ on his own and fumbles and B recovers in the EZ, safety.

[kissinger]

 

#2 the momentum rule could come into effect. It is neither a safety or a touchback if a defensive player is inside his five yard line when he intercepts a forward pass, or catches or recovers a kick, backwards pass or fumbleand his MOMENTUM carries him into the endzone where he is downed or loses possession of the ball. In this scenario I mentioned, the ball would come out to the 2 yard line if your play had momentum.

 

 

Be careful, the underlined part isn't in the book. for those that aren't officials, keep it simple. Was it the defensive player's momentum (inside the 5) that put it in the end zone? If so and it becomes dead in the end zone in his team's possession or is possession is lost out of the end zone, then the momentum rule still applies. His fumbling doesn't make any difference.

[refinstripes]

Be careful, the underlined part isn't in the book. for those that aren't officials, keep it simple. Was it the defensive player's momentum (inside the 5) that put it in the end zone? If so and it becomes dead in the end zone in his team's possession or is possession is lost out of the end zone, then the momentum rule still applies. His fumbling doesn't make any difference.

 

no it does not but the question did not mention anything about momentum playing a factor, therefore fumbling would make a huge difference, well, 2 points worth.... I only brought out the momentum rule to educate non-officials of the rule.

 

Check the Reddings book, the underline part is in the more expanded rules book that NFHS does not have but does endorse the Reddings Book.

[Hey-Ref]

As already stated, replaced players must leave the field immediately. Here are some additional comments:

 

1. If there are 11 players in the huddle, and a 12th comes into that huddle, 1 player must leave immediately. Immediately is arbitrary, and not 1 second, or 2 seconds. Officials account for communication delays that result from a player not knowing he has been replaced. Usually 2-5 seconds is acceptable to most officials.

2. Sometimes that replaced player leaves at the same time the huddle breaks. This is not a foul in high school rules, but is in college and NFL.

3. All 11 players on offense must at some time be between the ball and the 9 yard marks, if only momentarily, after the RFP (Ready for Play, whistle by Referee that starts play clock) and before the snap. This means on every down. Then they can assume any legal position on the field, including inches from the sideline.

4. The 9-yard marks are normally aligned with the tops of the numbers indicating yardlines. If there are no numbers painted there, there should be a short line bisecting the yardline 9 yards from the sideline. Officials will estimate this if no marks are present.

5. This foul should be called before the snap, which is illegal substitution, a 5 yard foul. If it is called after the snap it is illegal particpation, a 15 yard foul.

[refinstripes]

As already stated, replaced players must leave the field immediately. Here are some additional comments:

 

1. If there are 11 players in the huddle, and a 12th comes into that huddle, 1 player must leave immediately. Immediately is arbitrary, and not 1 second, or 2 seconds. Officials account for communication delays that result from a player not knowing he has been replaced. Usually 2-5 seconds is acceptable to most officials.

2. Sometimes that replaced player leaves at the same time the huddle breaks. This is not a foul in high school rules, but is in college and NFL.

3. All 11 players on offense must at some time be between the ball and the 9 yard marks, if only momentarily, after the RFP (Ready for Play, whistle by Referee that starts play clock) and before the snap. This means on every down. Then they can assume any legal position on the field, including inches from the sideline.

4. The 9-yard marks are normally aligned with the tops of the numbers indicating yardlines. If there are no numbers painted there, there should be a short line bisecting the yardline 9 yards from the sideline. Officials will estimate this if no marks are present.

5. This foul should be called before the snap, which is illegal substitution, a 5 yard foul. If it is called after the snap it is illegal particpation, a 15 yard foul.

 

very well put....