March 13, 200719 yr Like I said in another thread I have been talking brackets for all but 8 hours since they were announced. I slept for 7 and watched 24 for an hour. In that time one of the guys I've had on the coverage (Jim from Gametime for those that know him) had an interesting thought. We were talking about how you can make a 16 team conference work in the system in place and he proposed this. The Big East should just go to a home and home with all 16 teams and have everyone play a 30 game conference schedule. This would vault every top half team into the upper portions of the RPI and it would be hard to deny any 18 win team from the tournament. It will never happen so let's hear the pros and cons just for fun...
March 13, 200719 yr Your right It will never happen. 30 conference games would pretty much eliminate the opportunity for any OOC games or pre-season tournaments such as Maui. I actually think that the Beast would be better off to eliminate some conference teams. 16 is just too many. IMO, expansion was simply for football reasons, however, in doing so they also attracted some pretty good basketball schools as well. I'm sure they would never ask a school to leave, but IMO right now schools like Seton Hall and St. Johns are doing nothing for the league. Basketball programs have been down for a while and football wise they don't exist. I feel like 12 teams is the optimal number and that more than that in a league just doesn't work. As a Notre Dame fan, I understand there preference to be independent in football, however, as a Beast member in everything else they are trying to have their cake and eat it to. I personally think that its time the NCAA stood up to Notre Dame and stopped putting concessions for them into the BCS agreements which would likely force them to fully join a conference. Personally I think that they should join the Big 10, from a geographical standpoint and also due to the fact that they have historically played a lot of Big 10 teams anyway. Some years they are only a game or two away from having a Big 10 schedule as it is.
March 13, 200719 yr Author Your right It will never happen. 30 conference games would pretty much eliminate the opportunity for any OOC games or pre-season tournaments such as Maui. I actually think that the Beast would be better off to eliminate some conference teams. 16 is just too many. IMO, expansion was simply for football reasons, however, in doing so they also attracted some pretty good basketball schools as well. I'm sure they would never ask a school to leave, but IMO right now schools like Seton Hall and St. Johns are doing nothing for the league. Basketball programs have been down for a while and football wise they don't exist. I feel like 12 teams is the optimal number and that more than that in a league just doesn't work. As a Notre Dame fan, I understand there preference to be independent in football, however, as a Beast member in everything else they are trying to have their cake and eat it to. I personally think that its time the NCAA stood up to Notre Dame and stopped putting concessions for them into the BCS agreements which would likely force them to fully join a conference. Personally I think that they should join the Big 10, from a geographical standpoint and also due to the fact that they have historically played a lot of Big 10 teams anyway. Some years they are only a game or two away from having a Big 10 schedule as it is. Thread jacker. :irked: The conversation was how to make this 16 team league work, and I thought it was a new path that I've never considered. They would keep every penny in house and there are enough national names that ESPN would be showing the games at a set time and night for 5 months. Think of the bottom 4 teams as 8 games against the mid to lower level OOC teams. The next 4 as the high level 8 OOC games against the teams you should be 50/50 with if you want to get in. And the top 8 are what you see in every conference now. The styles of play are across the board, and they would get ALL of the money across the board. Like I said, it's radical. But IMO that's what you are going to need to make 16 teams work...
March 13, 200719 yr Thread jacker. :irked: The conversation was how to make this 16 team league work, and I thought it was a new path that I've never considered. They would keep every penny in house and there are enough national names that ESPN would be showing the games at a set time and night for 5 months. Think of the bottom 4 teams as 8 games against the mid to lower level OOC teams. The next 4 as the high level 8 OOC games against the teams you should be 50/50 with if you want to get in. And the top 8 are what you see in every conference now. The styles of play are across the board, and they would get ALL of the money across the board. Like I said, it's radical. But IMO that's what you are going to need to make 16 teams work... It would make more sense to having a 16 team conference, but I don't think that the Beast dogs are bad enough to satisfy some of the Beast coaches scheduling styles. No one is going to want to open the season against Pittsburg, Georgetown, and Louisville as their 1st three games, which could be a possibility under this scenerio. Calhoun and Boeheim love to get fat on Quinnipiac, Sacred Heart, Central Arkansas, Northeastern, Canisius, Colgate, etc. Not to mention the fact that they are reluctant to leave Storres and the Empire State for the 1st month and a half of the season. Can't see the coaches ever being in favor of this.
March 13, 200719 yr Author It would make more sense to having a 16 team conference, but I don't think that the Beast dogs are bad enough to satisfy some of the Beast coaches scheduling styles. No one is going to want to open the season against Pittsburg, Georgetown, and Louisville as their 1st three games, which could be a possibility under this scenerio. Calhoun and Boeheim love to get fat on Quinnipiac, Sacred Heart, Central Arkansas, Northeastern, Canisius, Colgate, etc. Not to mention the fact that they are reluctant to leave Storres and the Empire State for the 1st month and a half of the season. Can't see the coaches ever being in favor of this. I know they'd never do it. That's why I dismissed it as legit in my last line of the first post. But thinking has to change if 16 is going to work. Let's hear some more ideas...
March 13, 200719 yr I know they'd never do it. That's why I dismissed it as legit in my last line of the first post. But thinking has to change if 16 is going to work. Let's hear some more ideas... Not to be negative, but my thinking is that 16 just won't work. But that is what the Beast has, so they have to find a way to go with it.
March 13, 200719 yr I know they'd never do it. That's why I dismissed it as legit in my last line of the first post. But thinking has to change if 16 is going to work. Let's hear some more ideas... I think you're idea would really widen the gap between the have and have nots in the Big East over time...teams like Providence, St. John's, (I can't think right now)...but you get my point....I think they would get buried to the point of being an afterthought. But, it would be interesting if it actually happened. I think anyway...
March 13, 200719 yr 16 teams is too many for a 30 game max college schedule. Something has to happen, and I think it will be the conference letting 4 teams go before long.
March 13, 200719 yr I think the conference should be divided into four groups, based on geography. Group 1: Connecticut, Providence, St. John's, Syracuse. Group 2: Georgetown, Rutgers, Seton Hall, Villanova. Group 3: Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, South Florida, West Virginia. Group 4: DePaul, Louisville, Marquette, Notre Dame. Every year each school would play one another, which gives each team 15 games. Then, the first place teams from the previous year all play each other a second time (second plays second, third-third, fourth-fourth). That adds three more games giving them 18 conference games, which is a traditional number. The bright side is that you always play every team, which the Big East doesn't do right now. The competitive balance should be fairly even (similar to the NFL setup) given that top teams have to work hard to stay there, while lower teams get a chance to step up a level. I'm sure it isn't perfect, but its an idea.
March 13, 200719 yr Author I think the conference should be divided into four groups, based on geography. Group 1: Connecticut, Providence, St. John's, Syracuse. Group 2: Georgetown, Rutgers, Seton Hall, Villanova. Group 3: Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, South Florida, West Virginia. Group 4: DePaul, Louisville, Marquette, Notre Dame. Every year each school would play one another, which gives each team 15 games. Then, the first place teams from the previous year all play each other a second time (second plays second, third-third, fourth-fourth). That adds three more games giving them 18 conference games, which is a traditional number. The bright side is that you always play every team, which the Big East doesn't do right now. The competitive balance should be fairly even (similar to the NFL setup) given that top teams have to work hard to stay there, while lower teams get a chance to step up a level. I'm sure it isn't perfect, but its an idea. But you still run in to the same selection problem. I had a similar idea last year that would treat the schedule like a tournament bracket from the year before. The 4 team pods would be the home and home and you'd play 18 games plus be rewarded for finishing near the top. What we saw with Syracuse missing and even Georgetown not getting a look for a #1 seed was November and December scheduling...
March 13, 200719 yr But you still run in to the same selection problem. I had a similar idea last year that would treat the schedule like a tournament bracket from the year before. The 4 team pods would be the home and home and you'd play 18 games plus be rewarded for finishing near the top. What we saw with Syracuse missing and even Georgetown not getting a look for a #1 seed was November and December scheduling... I tried! I seriously don't think there is any way to make it perfect for everyone. With a conference that big, someone will always get left out due to scheduling.
March 13, 200719 yr Play each of the 15 teams once. Only have a 15 game conference schedule, which would give you the abilility to beef up the OOC with the extra game.
March 13, 200719 yr Play each of the 15 teams once. Only have a 15 game conference schedule, which would give you the abilility to beef up the OOC with the extra game. That's not bad. Maybe add one more game with your "rival." Maybe Cincinnati-Louisville, so there's always a home-and-home.
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