Have you ever watched Fox News?

 

:thumb:

Have you ever watched Fox News?

I watch it all the time. They spin conservatively. I like my spin that way. However, in order to get the whole picture it is the individuals responsibility to check things out . . . not just take the reporters word for it.

Iraq is obviously going to be used as a propoganda tool to recruit more extremist. However, it doesn't change the fact that the hate already exist. The Muslim extremist that choose to read the Quran in the literal sense feel that they are empowered by Allah to either convert all infadels to Islam, or destroy them. When these teachings are used to instill hatred towards western prosperity, they will be sucessful in creating generation after generation of people willing to give their lives to conquer or convert. The source of the hatred is as old as biblical history. The fact of the matter is that the hatred is not increased or decreased by our actions. We simply must deal with the matter in the only manner possible, to destroy all threats to our safety. IMO, the real threat exist in Iran and should be dealt with. Of course, our population has developed such a distaste for fighting that I worry if we actually have the resolve anymore to maintain our position in the world.

I agree.:thumb:

Sometimes blatant spin is reported as fact . . . so in that case . . . "facts" can change. It is the responsibility of the reader to discern the difference. Many times John Q. Public will simply take what is reported as Gospel without bothering to check things out.

 

So, if I've done my homework, and consulted various sources, and I still have an opinion that differs from yours, how can you say that the conclusion that I have reached is wrong?

You can not make me believe that over throwing Saddam was not a good thing. The fact is that when Saddam fell, when we marched through the streets of Baghdad and the people cheered us. When kids would run up to hug your neck as if we were heros. You can not tell me that was not a good thing. That was a good day in my life. I was away from my family for a year and that feeling is what i have that makes it ok. Nobody on a message board can take that away from me or any of my soldiers. The failure by our government to plan post war is what has made it into a mess. Now every terrorist in the world is coming there to fight us. But at least they are not coming here.

You can not make me believe that over throwing Saddam was not a good thing. The fact is that when Saddam fell, when we marched through the streets of Baghdad and the people cheered us. When kids would run up to hug your neck as if we were heros. You can not tell me that was not a good thing. That was a good day in my life. I was away from my family for a year and that feeling is what i have that makes it ok. Nobody on a message board can take that away from me or any of my soldiers. The failure by our government to plan post war is what has made it into a mess. Now every terrorist in the world is coming there to fight us. But at least they are not coming here.

 

 

Agree 200% on the bolded.

 

IMO, the timing on overthrowing Sadaam was wrong. Not only that, that wasn't the "reason" we were supposed to be invading Iraq.

 

I have no problem it the US wants to overthrow Sadaam, but plan it well; plan for the aftermath. Know what you're getting into and prepare for it.

 

I have no issues whatsoever with our troops. They're doing their jobs. But, like a business, if there's no "business plan", there's no success. The troops' bosses had no idea what kind of "business" they wanted to run, didn't have a plan to get there. Now, they're flying by the seat of their pants, and it's the troops, more than anyone, who're suffering the consequences.

 

There's no way we can leave right now, and I understand it. But my issue was, is and will continue to be, that the Bush Administration (collectively) preyed upon the emotionalism of the American public after 9/11 to support a poorly planned and poorly executed invasion of Iraq.

 

 

I have no idea how anyone can overlook the gross misjudgements of the Administration in this and still staunchly defend the decision to invade.

You can not make me believe that over throwing Saddam was not a good thing. The fact is that when Saddam fell, when we marched through the streets of Baghdad and the people cheered us. When kids would run up to hug your neck as if we were heros. You can not tell me that was not a good thing. That was a good day in my life. I was away from my family for a year and that feeling is what i have that makes it ok. Nobody on a message board can take that away from me or any of my soldiers. The failure by our government to plan post war is what has made it into a mess. Now every terrorist in the world is coming there to fight us. But at least they are not coming here.

 

Well stated Cats Eye. It was a very good thing, and you should remember it for the rest of your life and remember it in a good light.

No one I've seen has said this is a new phenomenon. I know that I, Trinity Alum, and H, to name a few, have mentioned the long history of poor Middle Eastern policy by administrations dating back decades and decades. It's funny that everyone thinks that because we disagree about whether we should have invaded Iraq, it's assumed we must not know anything about world politics or history. :lol:

 

You, and the people you mentioned, were not who my comment was directed at. :thumb:

 

You can disagree with the Iraq war all you want. It doesn't bother me at all until someone says that us being over there is inflaming their hatred and making it worse toward us...that is totally false, IMO. And, supposing it is true, as I said before, their hatred can only manifest itself to a certain degree...I'm pretty sure it's already reached that level, so any further hatred they have for us is just for their own peace of mind.

First I just wanted to say that I thought that was an excellent post.:thumb: Now here are my thoughts.

 

First bolded part:

I believe that if we began our gradual pull out of Iraq that they would then have less of a finger pointed towards the U.S.. While we are there, terrorists will continue to use the U.S. as the reasoning for many of the bombings. If we left, there is no doubt that they would continue and it would become much more evident to the people of Iraq that their biggest problem is internal and it's something they need to solve themselves. It's kind of like a family dispute. Say two brothers are in a heated argument with each other about something. They will argue until some kind of agreement is reached, but when a 3rd party comes in to tell them both what to do, they will turn on that third party until they are gone. Leaving the original point to rest until they have dealt with that 3rd party. I know it's not the best possible example but that is pretty close to how I feel the situation is going.

 

Second bolded part:

Bin Laden's hatred was inflammed by the U.S. long before 9/11. I'm not saying that the U.S. was at fault, but they were the reason behind it none the less.

 

I agree with one point that your touched on there...the biggest gain of us pulling out would be in the court of world opinion. Pulling out of Iraq is not something that I'm against, but I'm afraid we would back off of our pursuit of terrorists. As long as we keep fighting the "War on Terror" and making things difficult for these guys, that's what's most important to me.

 

If we back off completely, a favorable world opinion would be of little consolation to me when the United States turns into Israel-lite with bus bombings and other various attacks...which is what would eventually happen, IMO...and may happen anyway. Luckily, unlike Israel, we're a much larger nation and separated by a vast body of water from these lunatics.

Are you disputing the evidence base only on where it is reported? What do you think of the validity of the reports? Have you read them? Do you make it a point to automatically not read reports from those sources?

I tend to get my news from several sources. Let's just say I hold about as much stock in a report from those sources as you and H do in Fox news.

So, if I've done my homework, and consulted various sources, and I still have an opinion that differs from yours, how can you say that the conclusion that I have reached is wrong?

Nevermind, it is toooooooooooooooooooooooooooo easy. :lol: :lol:

I tend to get my news from several sources. Let's just say I hold about as much stock in a report from those sources as you and H do in Fox news.

 

I actually like FoxNews.

 

I don't read or watch anything because they may be either liberal or conservative in their slant. I watch everything to find out information, and then I look for more sources to find out more.

So, if I've done my homework, and consulted various sources, and I still have an opinion that differs from yours, how can you say that the conclusion that I have reached is wrong?

I can't say yours is wrong . . . it is merely your opinion. But, you can't say mine is wrong either . . . it just differs from yours. That is what makes this country great . . . I don't have to agree with you to defend your right to say it. (You can be wrong if you want to.

You can not make me believe that over throwing Saddam was not a good thing. The fact is that when Saddam fell, when we marched through the streets of Baghdad and the people cheered us. When kids would run up to hug your neck as if we were heros. You can not tell me that was not a good thing. That was a good day in my life. I was away from my family for a year and that feeling is what i have that makes it ok. Nobody on a message board can take that away from me or any of my soldiers. The failure by our government to plan post war is what has made it into a mess. Now every terrorist in the world is coming there to fight us. But at least they are not coming here.

Amen! I for one am very thankful that you and other brave souls like you have sacrificed to keep them at bay. Sadam Hussein demise was a good thing for the world but particularly for freedom loving Iraqis GOD BLESS YOU!!!:thumb:

I actually like FoxNews.

 

I don't read or watch anything because they may be either liberal or conservative in their slant. I watch everything to find out information, and then I look for more sources to find out more.

Ok, I get your point. :lol: