April 27, 20179 yr The top rate moving from 39.6 percent to 35 percent isn't as dramatic as many are acting like on TV, especially if the majority of deductions and loopholes are removed. One estimate was that with those being eliminated that the top bracket folks would now pay more tax dollars in than they currently are.
April 27, 20179 yr Wait...I'm just wondering where that talking point went. I'm not carrying the national debt flag. Candidate Trump said it wasn't important and is continuing that narrative. Does that fly with conservatives? If it doesn't this tax plan is DOA.
April 27, 20179 yr Author In my experience the Market is emotional short term and the numbers play out long term. What the actual impact the plan will have can be debated but there isn't a guy on Wall Street who likes making money who did not trade with a bullish outlook based on news of a corporate tax reduction. Details of the tax plan came out yesterday. The market was pretty flat yesterday and is even flatter today. I think the market is wait and see on the tax plan and the run-up in the market Monday and Tuesday was more about the French election results than anything else.
April 28, 20179 yr Author Good news IMO. Trump has clarified that the tax deductibility of 401k contributions will stay intact under his tax plan.
April 28, 20179 yr Details of the tax plan came out yesterday. The market was pretty flat yesterday and is even flatter today. I think the market is wait and see on the tax plan and the run-up in the market Monday and Tuesday was more about the French election results than anything else. Trump rally is 2nd best since JFK - Apr. 28, 2
April 28, 20179 yr Author Trump rally is 2nd best since JFK - Apr. 28, 217 Agreed. A lot of optimism in the market and expectations of pro-business policy in Washington. But, what happened Monday and Tuesday of this week was not because of Trump's tax plan.
April 28, 20179 yr Agreed. A lot of optimism in the market and expectations of pro-business policy in Washington. But, what happened Monday and Tuesday of this week was not because of Trump's tax plan. It actually 100% was. Anytime there is a snippet of corporate tax cut the market emotionally rallies to show support. This is just a known fact in our industry right now.
April 28, 20179 yr Author It actually 100% was. Anytime there is a snippet of corporate tax cut the market emotionally rallies to show support. This is just a known fact in our industry right now. OK. I am not going to beat my head against the wall anymore on this particular point. Please pay no attention to what has happened in the market the last 3 days since details of the tax plan came out. #believewhatyouwanttobelieve
April 29, 20179 yr I'm curious about something: Whether the corporate tax rate is 35 or 15 percent, why is that seen as a guarantee that corporations will repatriate their money? Zero percent overseas is still preferable to 15 or 35. I'm still, as always, skeptical that corporations are interested in "America First."
April 29, 20179 yr I'm curious about something: Whether the corporate tax rate is 35 or 15 percent, why is that seen as a guarantee that corporations will repatriate their money? Zero percent overseas is still preferable to 15 or 35. I'm still, as always, skeptical that corporations are interested in "America First." I've had similar thoughts. It might help with new business here but I don't believe they will bring that money back to be taxed at any rate.
April 29, 20179 yr Author I am pretty good with most of what I have seen in the tax plan. The big one that I am adamantly opposed to is elimination of the alternative minimum tax. That is a windfall for the ultra wealthy.
April 29, 20179 yr I am pretty good with most of what I have seen in the tax plan. The big one that I am adamantly opposed to is elimination of the alternative minimum tax. That is a windfall for the ultra wealthy. With the elimination of nearly all deductions there would be no need for the AMT. The AMT actually has been shown to hit large families and small businesses more than the super rich. From the Tax Policy Center Briefing Book... Taxpayers pay the higher of either their tax calculated under regular income tax rules or their tax calculated under the alternative minimum tax (AMT) rules. Because the 39.6 percent top rate under the regular income tax is higher than the 28 percent top statutory AMT rate, households with very high incomes who do not attempt to shelter much income typically pay based on the regular income tax system. Households that are not at the very top but still have relatively high incomes face somewhat lower statutory tax rates under the regular tax and are therefore more likely to pay the AMT. In 2017, 30.9 percent of households with “expanded cash income” (which is a broad measure of income) between $200,000 and $500,000 will be affected by the AMT (table 1). That number rises to 61.8 percent for those with incomes between $500,000 and $1 million. In contrast, only 18.2 percent of households with incomes greater than $1 million will be on the AMT. IRS collects around $3.2 Trillion per year, of that amount only $35 Billion come from the AMT or barely 1% of collections. Just for giggles here is a break down on who pays the most taxes by earnings... Edited April 29, 20179 yr by Jumper_Dad
May 3, 20179 yr Trump getting rid of a major thorn in his side, and of all those ultra high income like him ... the Alternative Minimum Tax. The AMT made sure the wealthy paid some tax versus using deductions and accounting tricks to eliminate taxes. A minimum tax has been in place since 1969 and the current AMT has been in place since 1982. Trump is also proposing eliminating the estate tax, sometimes called death tax. I will be interested in seeing the breakdown comparing benefits to the middle class versus benefits to the ultra wealthy. The AMT cost me $5,500 this past year, and I am VERY far from being the targeted wealthy. This is the backbone of my position on "taxing the rich" all along. The real rich hardly get touched and it is the middle and upper-middle class that feel the bite. AMT is an absolutely perfect example of this. The good news is we had a good year...bad news is IRS and Kentucky took a LOT of it.
May 3, 20179 yr Author The AMT cost me $5,500 this past year, and I am VERY far from being the targeted wealthy. This is the backbone of my position on "taxing the rich" all along. The real rich hardly get touched and it is the middle and upper-middle class that feel the bite. AMT is an absolutely perfect example of this. The good news is we had a good year...bad news is IRS and Kentucky took a LOT of it. What is the basis for your statement "The real rich get hardly touched ..."? Do you have any facts that show the AMT does not impact them?
May 3, 20179 yr What is the basis for your statement "The real rich get hardly touched ..."? Do you have any facts that show the AMT does not impact them? Here is a good read about the AMT. I do not have any "rich" people's individual tax returns. But...I would expect, unless they are stupid, that they: 1) defer income 2) shelter income 3) take income in incentive stock programs 4) if they own a business, only take a salary as income and keep the residual equity in the business. 5) move assets and equity to trust 6) move assets and equity offshore On the other hand, a lot of people are paying it...but many more middle and upper middle class than the uber-wealthy it was intended to tax.
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.