Does this open the ...er, door for gay marriages for Priests?

Does this open the ...er, door for gay marriages for Priests?

 

If you are joking, I did get a laugh from that. If you are serious, I would say w/o question, the answer would be no.

If you are joking, I did get a laugh from that. If you are serious, I would say w/o question, the answer would be no.

 

:thumb: Actually I was joking about the first part (and I am glad it was taken that way).

 

However, it could be an interesting discussion because I am aware that there are some churches that support the concept. I was going to say I could go both ways on the topic of married Priests, but I have decided to change my wording to state that my mind is open. I have been in Catholic churches where Deacons have very strong roles, and I have seen advantages to their shared life experiences. However, does it lower the position of the Priest to a Deacon if now they are married at least in the eyes of the parishoners?

:thumb: Actually I was joking about the first part (and I am glad it was taken that way).

 

However, it could be an interesting discussion because I am aware that there are some churches that support the concept. I was going to say I could go both ways on the topic of married Priests, but I have decided to change my wording to state that my mind is open. I have been in Catholic churches where Deacons have very strong roles, and I have seen advantages to their shared life experiences. However, does it lower the position of the Priest to a Deacon if now they are married at least in the eyes of the parishoners?

 

I have wondered about the role of deacons down the road should priestly celibacy end also. Part of me thinks there will always be a role because even if married men are allowed to become priests, I just don't think ordinations will go through the roof like some say will happen. Will some men who were discerning the priesthood but then met a woman they married decide to become priests now? Yeah, but so many that there will be an abundance of priests? I just don't see it. I just think the daunting idea of a life long vow (married or not) will still be too much for many to bear so to speak to go for ordination so I think deacons will still be needed. And I do realize deacons take a life long vow but what their vow commits them to is not near as heavy as what a priest commits to.

 

I once was listening to a priest speak and he made the comment,

 

"With the ridicule all priests face today due to the actions of a few (the pedophiles) and the fact that priests are no longer held up on a pedestal by parishioners like the used to be, I cannot think of a single Earthly reason why any guy would want to become a priest today"

 

The faces of those in the crowd was shocking. He then continued:

 

"While I cannot think of any Earthly reasons, I can think of dozens of heavenly reasons"

 

A feeling of relief could be seen then.

I would parallel somewhat the the number of permanent deacons. For those who don't know there are 2 types of deacons in the church. Transitional deacons are the step between seminarian and priest. Permanent deacons are ordained and serve for life. They are allowed to be married. There is a 3 year educational process that involves not only the perspective deacon but his spouse as well. There are not people beating down the doors to become deacons in Louisville. It's a huge commitment not only from the deacon but his whole family. As a result most (not all) deacons are older with adult children when they take on the role. FWIW my grandfather was a deacon.

 

I can't imagine a process in which married priests are allowed that a stringent educational process wouldn't be required of the spouse as well.

I would parallel somewhat the the number of permanent deacons. For those who don't know there are 2 types of deacons in the church. Transitional deacons are the step between seminarian and priest. Permanent deacons are ordained and serve for life. They are allowed to be married. There is a 3 year educational process that involves not only the perspective deacon but his spouse as well. There are not people beating down the doors to become deacons in Louisville. It's a huge commitment not only from the deacon but his whole family. As a result most (not all) deacons are older with adult children when they take on the role. FWIW my grandfather was a deacon.

 

I can't imagine a process in which married priests are allowed that a stringent educational process wouldn't be required of the spouse as well.

 

Very true, the education process would probably be similar but maybe more exhaustive than what the wives of deacons go through.

Very true, the education process would probably be similar but maybe more exhaustive than what the wives of deacons go through.

 

No doubt about it. That's why I don't see allowing priests to marry as a panacea that would produce a huge influx of priests.

I wouldn't mind.

I was talking with my pastor tonight at a social gathering about this topic. He honestly believes this discipline will not be reformed. He and a few of his priest friends believe that this is another case of the media taking the words of the current Pope and running further than was intended by Francis. Just because it "could" be changed doesn't mean that it "will" be changed. Pope Francis is getting good at "speaking frankly" when reporters are listening. You will probably see the Vatican do a little "what the Pope really meant to say was..." in the next week or so. Francis respects his predecessor, Pope Benedict, who in April 2012 issued a blistering denunciation of priests who had questioned church teaching on celibacy and ordaining women, saying they were being selfish in disobeying his authority.

^It's probably a topic for another thread, but I've never once heard a solid rationale reasoning as to why women can't be ordained as priests.

^It's probably a topic for another thread, but I've never once heard a solid rationale reasoning as to why women can't be ordained as priests.

 

John Paul II issued something years ago explaining why women can't be priests. It was very long and extremely in depth. I remember someone joking you almost need a degree in theology to understand it. I haven not read it but have been told it give a very good, logical and well thought out explanation as to why the church does not even have the authority to validly ordain women even if the church wanted to. Again, I haven't read it so that is all I know.

^ The apostolic letter Ordinatio Sacerdotalis.

 

Here's a link.

 

It's not terribly long. The document the Congregation for the Doctine of the Faith promulgated back in the 1970s is way more extensive, I believe. I'll try to track that one down.

John Paul II issued something years ago explaining why women can't be priests. It was very long and extremely in depth. I remember someone joking you almost need a degree in theology to understand it. I haven not read it but have been told it give a very good, logical and well thought out explanation as to why the church does not even have the authority to validly ordain women even if the church wanted to. Again, I haven't read it so that is all I know.

 

 

I'm assuming it was a an argument along the lines of "the Bible says so" or something of that nature. Holds zero water to me. I want logical rationale common sense reasoning.

I'm assuming it was a an argument along the lines of "the Bible says so" or something of that nature. Holds zero water to me. I want logical rationale common sense reasoning.

 

Then nothing will make you happy. This is a religious matter, not a civil or governmental one, so how can you demand rationale of a non-religious nature? You will find any such answer unsatisfying.

^ The apostolic letter Ordinatio Sacerdotalis.

 

Here's a link.

 

It's not terribly long. The document the Congregation for the Doctine of the Faith promulgated back in the 1970s is way more extensive, I believe. I'll try to track that one down.

 

Hmmmm. I am thinking is was much longer. Is there any chance there was another one he wrote?