I have had a lot of interesting debates in the last 5 years with many of my liberal friends. I consider myself overall to be moderate, but fiscally conservative. What I have come to realize, even in my best liberal friends is this:

 

A liberal thinks what is good for them is good for the country. A conservative thinks what is good for the country is good for them.

 

Have at it!!

Hard to argue in general terms.

Most people mean Republican or Democratic when they say conservative or liberal. Very few people are consciously guided by, or are aware of ideology.

 

The conservative ideology has generally been united by a fear of change in society.

 

The liberal ideology, in the United States version, has generally been united by egalitarianism.

 

I reread Hayek's "Why I Am Not a Conservative" last weekend, and it's a good start for discussion (he uses the traditional definition of liberal, which is something like libertarian in the American sense).

I found this graphic.

 

I have had a lot of interesting debates in the last 5 years with many of my liberal friends. I consider myself overall to be moderate, but fiscally conservative. What I have come to realize, even in my best liberal friends is this:

 

A liberal thinks what is good for them is good for the country. A conservative thinks what is good for the country is good for them.

 

Have at it!!

 

Do you actually believe that?? Why don't you ask women, whom conservatives violate their right of choice because it's what they may not believe in. It that what's good for the country?

Do you actually believe that?? Why don't you ask women, whom conservatives violate their right of choice because it's what they may not believe in. It that what's good for the country?

Why don't you ask the child....oh wait, you can't.....

Do you actually believe that?? Why don't you ask women, whom conservatives violate their right of choice because it's what they may not believe in. It that what's good for the country?

Same can be said about gun control...

Most people mean Republican or Democratic when they say conservative or liberal. Very few people are consciously guided by, or are aware of ideology.

 

The conservative ideology has generally been united by a fear of change in society.

 

The liberal ideology, in the United States version, has generally been united by egalitarianism.

 

I reread Hayek's "Why I Am Not a Conservative" last weekend, and it's a good start for discussion (he uses the traditional definition of liberal, which is something like libertarian in the American sense).

I see. In your view liberals are about social, political, and economic equality and conservatives are about fear of change in society. Easy to see which way you lean.

 

I think StudentNewsDaily.com pegged it pretty well without being shortsighted.

 

Liberals believe in government action to achieve equal opportunity and equality for all. It is the duty of the government to alleviate social ills and to protect civil liberties and individual and human rights. Believe the role of the government should be to guarantee that no one is in need. Liberal policies generally emphasize the need for the government to solve problems.

 

Conservatives believe in personal responsibility, limited government, free markets, individual liberty, traditional American values and a strong national defense. Believe the role of government should be to provide people the freedom necessary to pursue their own goals. Conservative policies generally emphasize empowerment of the individual to solve problems.

 

See more at: Conservative vs. Liberal Beliefs | Student News Daily

I see. In your view liberals are about social, political, and economic equality and conservatives are about fear of change in society. Easy to see which way you lean.

 

Not everyone considers egalitarianism to be a good thing, I certainly don't think you do, so I'm not sure why you are saying I'm painting a rosy picture for the liberal side. There are many who argue that equality necessitates a stronger government and less individual liberty and fear the ill-effects of those things.

 

I also don't think it's accurate to depict ideologies as though they exist in a vacuum of modernity. When Edmund Burke wrote about the French Revolution, what many people consider to be the philosophical start-point of the conservative ideology, I don't believe he was concerned with "traditional American values" or "limited government." He was concerned with the instability of radical change to established social order (something I think is thematic to conservative arguments throughout history). And even though that meant he tacitly favored the French monarchy, his skepticism of radical change might have been borne out by the Reign of Terror that followed the revolution.

Do you actually believe that?? Why don't you ask women, whom conservatives violate their right of choice because it's what they may not believe in. It that what's good for the country?

 

Yes, I believe what I typed. However, since you asked, as I mentioned, I consider myself to be socially moderate (I hate to say liberal)....and I believe it should be the woman's right to make her own decisions.

Not everyone considers egalitarianism to be a good thing, I certainly don't think you do, so I'm not sure why you are saying I'm painting a rosy picture for the liberal side. There are many who argue that equality necessitates a stronger government and less individual liberty and fear the ill-effects of those things.

 

I also don't think it's accurate to depict ideologies as though they exist in a vacuum of modernity. When Edmund Burke wrote about the French Revolution, what many people consider to be the philosophical start-point of the conservative ideology, I don't believe he was concerned with "traditional American values" or "limited government." He was concerned with the instability of radical change to established social order (something I think is thematic to conservative arguments throughout history). And even though that meant he tacitly favored the French monarchy, his skepticism of radical change might have been borne out by the Reign of Terror that followed the revolution.

 

Thanks for this very good dialogue!

Good dialogue so far, and this is what we need as a country! We are too polarized with little to no respect for differing opinions, IMO, and we have this one big either/or slice.

Not everyone considers egalitarianism to be a good thing, I certainly don't think you do, so I'm not sure why you are saying I'm painting a rosy picture for the liberal side. There are many who argue that equality necessitates a stronger government and less individual liberty and fear the ill-effects of those things.

 

I also don't think it's accurate to depict ideologies as though they exist in a vacuum of modernity. When Edmund Burke wrote about the French Revolution, what many people consider to be the philosophical start-point of the conservative ideology, I don't believe he was concerned with "traditional American values" or "limited government." He was concerned with the instability of radical change to established social order (something I think is thematic to conservative arguments throughout history). And even though that meant he tacitly favored the French monarchy, his skepticism of radical change might have been borne out by the Reign of Terror that followed the revolution.

It's not that I thought you were painting a rosy picture for the liberal side, it's the way you presented the conservative side, fear of change. I disagree. You can't tell me one side is afraid of change and the other side isn't, doesn't come across well and doesn't work.

 

I'm giving examples of the two ideologies as StudentNewsDaily.com labeled them as the way the average American thinks, not government. I think it's pretty accurate.

Why don't you ask the child....oh wait, you can't.....

 

On one hand, you want to eliminate the right of women choice. However, if a child is born with disabilities, you don't want to fund the programs that gives assistance to help with the disabled child(ren)..How ironic?

It's not that I thought you were painting a rosy picture for the liberal side, it's the way you presented the conservative side, fear of change. I disagree. You can't tell me one side is afraid of change and the other side isn't, doesn't come across well and doesn't work.

 

I'm giving examples of the two ideologies as StudentNewsDaily.com labeled them as the way the average American thinks, not government. I think it's pretty accurate.

 

When I paid attention in history class, one of the things I remember is studying the Constitution. And what I remember is that much of our government's early construction and the construction of the Constitution was to prevent radical change quickly and to prevent a sudden shift in power to prevent dramatic change based on popular sentiment of any given time as often this could be manipulated. Those who favored a strict interpretation of the Constitution as written were Conservatives, those who favored a more lenient interpretation with the ability to amend the Constitution were labeled Liberals. Of course maybe I got it wrong.