January 26, 201016 yr Nor would I, just using the mind God gave me and the scripture that I read.Yet if comes off otherwise. No offense, just how it sounds.
January 26, 201016 yr Yet if comes off otherwise. No offense, just how it sounds. Oh, of course there is offense intended, or you would not have posted. Not wanting to offend would have led you to remain silent. It is real easy, here I will show you . . . see, silence. You only have that opionion of my point of view because it disagrees with yours. Were I espousing your sentiment I would have gotten an "amen" or a thumbs up smiley.
January 26, 201016 yr Oh, of course there is offense intended, or you would not have posted. Not wanting to offend would have led you to remain silent. It is real easy, here I will show you . . . see, silence. You only have that opionion of my point of view because it disagrees with yours. Were I espousing your sentiment I would have gotten an "amen" or a thumbs up smiley. :lol: Now you're speaking for me as well? OK.
January 26, 201016 yr Blessings from God do not come in material things, money, homes, cars, clothes, even health. God's blessing comes in the form of the Hope/Faith that I have that whatever my luck, God will see me through it. That is what a blessing is. God does not offer proseperity. While I agree that hope and faith are indeed blessings provided by God, I could not disagree more strongly with your assertion that God does not involve Himself in blessing us with our material/physical needs. What evidence other than just your opinion or feelings can you offer to support your statement?
January 26, 201016 yr While I agree that hope and faith are indeed blessings provided by God, I could not disagree more strongly with your assertion that God does not involve Himself in blessing us with our material/physical needs. What evidence other than just your opinion or feelings can you offer to support your statement? FB, honest question... If those who possess many worldly goods are blessed, in stands to reason that those who are in poverty are cursed. Or that some are more blessed by God than others. I can't get behind that. God's blessings, His concern, is our soul. What we possess or do not possess materially are not His concern. Truly blessed people possess a richness of the soul. They may impoverished, or they may be millionaires.
January 27, 201016 yr FB, honest question... If those who possess many worldly goods are blessed, in stands to reason that those who are in poverty are cursed. Or that some are more blessed by God than others. I can't get behind that. God's blessings, His concern, is our soul. What we possess or do not possess materially are not His concern. Truly blessed people possess a richness of the soul. They may impoverished, or they may be millionaires. Honest question to help me fully understand your honest question and answer it as accurately as possible... "What quality or qualities do 'truly blessed people' that 'possess a richness of the soul' possess?" or more specifically, "What is it in your opinion that makes them truly rich and blessed?" This is a sincere query on my part.
January 27, 201016 yr Honest question to help me fully understand your honest question and answer it as accurately as possible... "What quality or qualities do 'truly blessed people' that 'possess a richness of the soul' possess?" or more specifically, "What is it in your opinion that makes them truly rich and blessed?" This is a sincere query on my part. Frankly, truly blessed people can't be identified by you or I. That's God's identification to make. But, I'm 100% certain that a person isn't blessed because of their material richness, or cursed because of their lack thereof.
January 27, 201016 yr Honest question to help me fully understand your honest question and answer it as accurately as possible... "What quality or qualities do 'truly blessed people' that 'possess a richness of the soul' possess?" or more specifically, "What is it in your opinion that makes them truly rich and blessed?" This is a sincere query on my part. Here's one take: http://robertwells.tripod.com/Beatitudes.html So poor in spirit means that we come to God, conscious of our sins and our utter lack of righteousness. It means that we profess that we are totally unqualified to commune with, and have fellowship with God, and that we do not deserve any of the gifts that God is trying to bestow upon us. The poor in spirit realize that all our assets are actually liabilities before God, and that we should view these assets as Paul viewed them--as loss, as garbage, as rubbish.
January 27, 201016 yr Here's one take: http://robertwells.tripod.com/Beatitudes.html So poor in spirit means that we come to God, conscious of our sins and our utter lack of righteousness. It means that we profess that we are totally unqualified to commune with, and have fellowship with God, and that we do not deserve any of the gifts that God is trying to bestow upon us. The poor in spirit realize that all our assets are actually liabilities before God, and that we should view these assets as Paul viewed them--as loss, as garbage, as rubbish. Luke does not say "poor in spirit" - Luke says Blessed are the poor.
January 27, 201016 yr Blessings are things that are bestowed upon us through no doing of our own IMO. I've always defined luck by the quote.."Luck is where preparation meets opportunity."
January 27, 201016 yr Luke does not say "poor in spirit" - Luke says Blessed are the poor. I think it's important to examine at least the full sentence recorded in Luke 6:20 “Looking at his disciples, he said: "Blessed are you who are poor, for yours is the kingdom of God.” No matter how you read this or the example in Mark, Jesus does not say that being poor in and of itself is a blessing. It is followed by, “…for (or because) yours is the kingdom of God or (kingdom of Heaven).” The “because” introduced the actual blessing which is citizenship, participation in, a share in the kingdom of God/Heaven. Poverty in and of itself is never forwarded as a blessing anywhere in the Bible... just as greed and the accumulation of wealth for selfish purposes in not considered proper. Thankfully, physical earthly poverty is not the singular requirement for admission into God’s Kingdom. If this were true, Jesus Himself would be unnecessary, much less His suffering, crucifixion and resurrection.
January 27, 201016 yr Here's one take: http://robertwells.tripod.com/Beatitudes.html So poor in spirit means that we come to God, conscious of our sins and our utter lack of righteousness. It means that we profess that we are totally unqualified to commune with, and have fellowship with God, and that we do not deserve any of the gifts that God is trying to bestow upon us. The poor in spirit realize that all our assets are actually liabilities before God, and that we should view these assets as Paul viewed them--as loss, as garbage, as rubbish. You kinda jumped ahead of me on this Papa… I was headed here almost a week ago, but I was waiting for someone to actually tell me what they believe I am correct in thanking God for and giving Him praise… essentially crediting Him for my blessings. I have been waiting, but no one wants to step up and simply answer that. Traveling culinary bad boy Anthony Bourdain asserts that vegetarianism and veganism are first world luxuries… essentially stating that such high-minded, seemingly ethical sounding practices are simply not possible among the truly hungry and impoverished. Only wealthy individuals in a wealthy land can afford to be so selective. In a similar manner, I believe all assertions that poverty is a blessing are either misguided or disingenuous. I'm not suggesting that God can't use poverty of sickness to get our attention and teach us in ways we may be too busy or prideful to hear otherwise, resulting in the blessing of drawing nearer to Him and growing into a more blessed life. But I refuse to believe that poverty in and of itself is a blessing. IMO only someone that is not sick, hungry, cold, and in severe need could suggest that poverty is a blessing. If this were true, why are we constantly trying to fix it? Why do those in need try to feed, clothe and shelter themselves and their families? Why do we work so hard at our jobs to have warm homes, plenty of the foods we like, autos, computers, satellite tv, etc.? There is not one person posting on BGP that sincerely believes that hunger, sickness, poverty and misery are good things. ( Ironically, some of us earn our livings catering to the wishes of the fabulously wealthy, yet spend far less of our time and resources ministering to the needs of the poor. ) I think the actual words of Jesus in Matthew 5:3-12 provide a deeper insight into this: Now when he saw the crowds, he went up on a mountainside and sat down. His disciples came to him, and he began to teach them, saying: "Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Blessed are those who mourn, for they will be comforted. Blessed are the meek, for they will inherit the earth. Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they will be filled. Blessed are the merciful, for they will be shown mercy. Blessed are the pure in heart, for they will see God. Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God. Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you.” Jesus says, “Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.” Poor in spirit describes humility… the acknowledgment that all our gifts and blessings come from the grace of God, not our own will or efforts. To have poverty of spirit means to be completely empty of pride and open to the Word of God... this brings “a peace that passes all understanding” as we repent and place God’s will ahead of our own. In every instance of this sermon, the circumstance (poverty, mourning, hunger, meekness, etc.) is a descriptive of the condition each hearer may find themselves at that moment, followed by the assurance of being blessed “because” something better is coming. The actual blessing is the coming action… (for theirs is the kingdom of heaven... for they will be comforted… for they will be filled… ) Jesus was announcing that He was here to rock our world, shake our beliefs and traditions, and to establish His Heavenly Kingdom... the Good News that something Better was on the way. Hope that a better system, a better life, peace, joy, contentment and freedom from oppression are possible. The whole point was to bring conviction for our wrong thinking and actions, and to offer absolute hope and joy in Him. I don’t know how anyone could hear these words and not be shaken to their core. People… being people, constantly strive to “earn” God’s favor and their place in His Kingdom. I have plenty of flaws God is working to smooth in me, but I am convinced that faith alone in Christ alone is my only hope of salvation and meaning. I'm not good enough now... and I will never be good enough on my own... but I do have hope and faith in Him. :thumb:
January 27, 201016 yr Frankly, truly blessed people can't be identified by you or I. That's God's identification to make. Is it permissible for me to recognize that I am blessed and to thank God for His provision, mercy and grace? I have asked you to please tell me the things in your opinion I am justified in thanking God for bestowing upon me. I would still like to hear/read your opinion on these things for which I can legitimately thank God. But, I'm 100% certain that a person isn't blessed because of their material richness, or cursed because of their lack thereof. This is puzzling to me in light of the fact that whole chapters of the Bible are dedicated to describing promises of extravagant blessings to the faithful. The following is from Deuteronomy: Deuteronomy 28: 1-13 “If you fully obey the LORD your God and carefully follow all his commands I give you today, the LORD your God will set you high above all the nations on earth. All these blessings will come upon you and accompany you if you obey the LORD your God: You will be blessed in the city and blessed in the country. The fruit of your womb will be blessed, and the crops of your land and the young of your livestock--the calves of your herds and the lambs of your flocks. Your basket and your kneading trough will be blessed. You will be blessed when you come in and blessed when you go out. The LORD will grant that the enemies who rise up against you will be defeated before you. They will come at you from one direction but flee from you in seven. The LORD will send a blessing on your barns and on everything you put your hand to. The LORD your God will bless you in the land he is giving you. The LORD will establish you as his holy people, as he promised you on oath, if you keep the commands of the LORD your God and walk in his ways. Then all the peoples on earth will see that you are called by the name of the Lord, and they will fear you. The LORD will grant you abundant prosperity--in the fruit of your womb, the young of your livestock and the crops of your ground--in the land he swore to your forefathers to give you. The LORD will open the heavens, the storehouse of his bounty, to send rain on your land in season and to bless all the work of your hands. You will lend to many nations but will borrow from none. The LORD will make you the head, not the tail. If you pay attention to the commands of the LORD your God that I give you this day and carefully follow them, you will always be at the top, never at the bottom.” I don’t know about you, but this sounds like a lot of material blessing going on to me. I will grant you that it is not the material "stuff" that makes a person blessed, but his/her relationship and obedience to God. But it's difficult, if not impossible to deny that God does indeed bestow physical/material rewards upon those He chooses. The balance of the chapter details the curses that will accompany those that don’t keep God’s laws. Suffice it to say, these may be summarized as poverty, misery and sickness. The point is, God - in His own words - details how He is willing to bless those that keep His commands with “material” prosperity. I do not believe that God is pleased with us for amassing wealth merely to gratify our own lusts and greed, but I can also state with certainty that poverty is never forwarded as a reward or a blessing. It is also important to point out that I do not believe the character of God has changed over time. He desires to bless those willing to be obedient to Him. Truly blessed people possess a richness of the soul. They may impoverished, or they may be millionaires. I can agree that regardless of our material wealth or lack thereof, we can indeed be blessed. I’ve experienced both, and felt blessed as Paul tells us in Philippians 4:11-13 “Not that I speak from want, for I have learned to be content in whatever circumstances I am. I know how to get along with humble means, and I also know how to live in prosperity; in any and every circumstance I have learned the secret of being filled and going hungry, both of having abundance and suffering need. I can do all things through Him who strengthens me.” Edited January 27, 201016 yr by Fastbreak
January 27, 201016 yr 1 Cor 1:26 For you see your calling, brethren, that not many wise according to the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called. Matt 19:24 And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God. James 1:11 For no sooner has the sun risen with a burning heat than it withers the grass; its flower falls, and its beautiful appearance perishes. So the rich man also will fade away in his pursuits. NKJV Luke 6:24 But woe to you who are rich, For you have received your consolation. 25 Woe to you who are full, For you shall hunger. Woe to you who laugh now, For you shall mourn and weep. NKJV Prov 23:4 Do not overwork to be rich; Because of your own understanding, cease! 5 Will you set your eyes on that which is not? For riches certainly make themselves wings; They fly away like an eagle toward heaven. 6 Do not eat the bread of a miser, Nor desire his delicacies; 7 For as he thinks in his heart, so is he. “Eat and drink!” he says to you, But his heart is not with you. Matt 6:19 “Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy and where thieves break in and steal; 20 but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal. 21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.
January 27, 201016 yr Do not wear yourself out to get rich; have the wisdom to show restraint. Cast but a glance at riches, and they are gone, for they will surely sprout wings and fly off to the sky like an eagle. (NIV, Proverbs 23:4-5) What good will it be for a man if he gains the whole world, yet forfeits his soul? Or what can a man give in exchange for his soul? (NIV, Matthew 16:26) People who want to get rich fall into temptation and a trap and into many foolish and harmful desires that plunge men into ruin and destruction. For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil. Some people, eager for money, have wandered from the faith and pierced themselves with many griefs. But you, man of God, flee from all this, and pursue righteousness, godliness, faith, love, endurance and gentleness. (NIV, 1 Timothy 6:9-11) If anyone has material possessions and sees his brother in need but has no pity on him, how can the love of God be in him? (NIV, 1 John 3:17) I really like this one Command those who are rich in this present world not to be arrogant nor to put their hope in wealth, which is so uncertain, but to put their hope in God, who richly provides us with everything for our enjoyment. Command them to do good, to be rich in good deeds, and to be generous and willing to share. In this way they will lay up treasure for themselves as a firm foundation for the coming age, so that they may take hold of the life that is truly life. (NIV, 1 Timothy 6:17-19) It does say command.
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