Let me throw a wrinkle at you guys on this topic. If an 8th grader plays up on the varsity team, should that player be able to go to a different HS the next year and not forfeit a year of eligibility?

 

In this case the 8th grader took the position of some other HS player and the varsity experience that would've been gained only to have the 8th grader go to another HS the following year. Is that fair?

 

Not fair at all...but happens all the time. It's within the rules today and I wish they could fix that. But rules get stretched all the time...see the transfer rules! Sometimes rules are set for good and there will always be people that use those same rules for bad.

The best players play no matter what age they are or grade they are in....period.

Let me throw a wrinkle at you guys on this topic. If an 8th grader plays up on the varsity team, should that player be able to go to a different HS the next year and not forfeit a year of eligibility?

 

In this case the 8th grader took the position of some other HS player and the varsity experience that would've been gained only to have the 8th grader go to another HS the following year. Is that fair?

I'd suggest adopting the rule that Tennessee has regarding that situation.

I'd suggest adopting the rule that Tennessee has regarding that situation.

 

Don't know what that is, but I guess you could fix it by applying the same transfer rules to any kid that plays up in a high school program.

Sorry another softball analogy, because it just happened to us. But would apply to any sport.

 

We had a 7th grader starting at 2nd base all year last year. Very good player and you would not find one person in Ft Thomas that felt she should not be starting. If we were not allowed to play her, our team would not be as good as we would have been. There is NO ONE that would have been as successful as her at 2nd. Did we have girls that we could have put there...sure.

 

So with that said, we won the region. The 7th grader made multiple plays and actually hit the game winning double off the fence late in the game to go up by two. We won the regional finals 8-7. So without her in the lineup all year and at the end, we are not as successful as a team. I have two senior last year that sunk their heart and soul into the program. Their goal was to win the region before they left. The rest of the teams goal was also to win the region for them and themselves. You could make a strong argument that we don't reach that goal for them without that 7th grader in the lineup. So who do you think those seniors and the rest of the team would have wanted at 2nd base in the final game? Does that goal and dream happen if MS kids were not allowed to play up?

 

My argument is not to let just anyone play up. My argument is if the kid is good enough, physically and mentally can handle it and is approved by the coach, the administration and their parents...then they should be allowed.

 

counterpoint .... (I really didn't want to go here ....)

 

In 2012/13, CVH played Varsity basketball for Villa Madonna as an 8th grader. Everyone in the universe knew he was going to CCH the following year. He was the leading scorer on a 16-13 team that lost their opening District game, ending their season. They won two games ... TWO GAMES ... by less than 10 points. So in essence, you could say he improved a .500 team's number of wins by TWO GAMES.

 

Meanwhile, EVERY MINUTE he was on the floor, a VMA student was sitting the bench. They had 11 players score on the season, so I doubt you could say they wouldn't have had a team without him.

 

Once again, athletics is an extracurricular activity meant to enrich the lives of students.

counterpoint .... (I really didn't want to go here ....)

 

In 2012/13, CVH played Varsity basketball for Villa Madonna as an 8th grader. Everyone in the universe knew he was going to CCH the following year. He was the leading scorer on a 16-13 team that lost their opening District game, ending their season. They won two games ... TWO GAMES ... by less than 10 points. So in essence, you could say he improved a .500 team's number of wins by TWO GAMES.

 

Meanwhile, EVERY MINUTE he was on the floor, a VMA student was sitting the bench. They had 11 players score on the season, so I doubt you could say they wouldn't have had a team without him.

 

Once again, athletics is an extracurricular activity meant to enrich the lives of students.

 

Already answered that in another response and made a suggestion in a different post. .

counterpoint .... (I really didn't want to go here ....)

 

In 2012/13, CVH played Varsity basketball for Villa Madonna as an 8th grader. Everyone in the universe knew he was going to CCH the following year. He was the leading scorer on a 16-13 team that lost their opening District game, ending their season. They won two games ... TWO GAMES ... by less than 10 points. So in essence, you could say he improved a .500 team's number of wins by TWO GAMES.

 

Meanwhile, EVERY MINUTE he was on the floor, a VMA student was sitting the bench. They had 11 players score on the season, so I doubt you could say they wouldn't have had a team without him.

 

Once again, athletics is an extracurricular activity meant to enrich the lives of students.

 

AND I said...My argument is if the kid is good enough, physically and mentally can handle it and is approved by the coach, the administration and their parents...then they should be allowed.

 

If everyone knew this, was it approved by the administration? The coaches? I assume it was, right? Then shame on them for letting it happen.

counterpoint .... (I really didn't want to go here ....)

 

In 2012/13, CVH played Varsity basketball for Villa Madonna as an 8th grader. Everyone in the universe knew he was going to CCH the following year. He was the leading scorer on a 16-13 team that lost their opening District game, ending their season. They won two games ... TWO GAMES ... by less than 10 points. So in essence, you could say he improved a .500 team's number of wins by TWO GAMES.

 

Meanwhile, EVERY MINUTE he was on the floor, a VMA student was sitting the bench. They had 11 players score on the season, so I doubt you could say they wouldn't have had a team without him.

 

Once again, athletics is an extracurricular activity meant to enrich the lives of students.

 

Let me ask you this...If you were given a chance to be put on a new project that leads to high rewards at work. If you succeed, it could mean a promotion and significant increase in salary. Your boss tells you that you need a partner for the project. Your company has recently brought in some temporary employees and your boss gives you a choice between taking one of the temps or one of the tenured employees in your group. You interview both candidates (that are going to help you succeed) and discover that that temp employee has a ton of experience with the subject matter and has had success in similar projects. The other person is okay and has been with the company for 20 years. Who do you choose to work on the project with you? If your boss knew everything you did about both candidates, who would he want you working with. And if your boss's boss job was on the line, who would he choose?

Let me ask you this...If you were given a chance to be put on a new project that leads to high rewards at work. If you succeed, it could mean a promotion and significant increase in salary. Your boss tells you that you need a partner for the project. Your company has recently brought in some temporary employees and your boss gives you a choice between taking one of the temps or one of the tenured employees in your group. You interview both candidates (that are going to help you succeed) and discover that that temp employee has a ton of experience with the subject matter and has had success in similar projects. The other person is okay and has been with the company for 20 years. Who do you choose to work on the project with you? If your boss knew everything you did about both candidates, who would he want you working with. And if your boss's boss job was on the line, who would he choose?

 

sorry .. that example (hypothetical) isn't even in the same stratosphere ... not even close.

sorry .. that example (hypothetical) isn't even in the same stratosphere ... not even close.

 

Tell me why it's not?

 

Are you relying on someone with skills that aren't on your team or in your company? That equals the best player playing and contributing.

 

So you have a vested interest in getting the best team member for your project?? Yes...hence playing the best that you have availability to.

 

 

 

It's a life situation...do you feel sorry for your co-worker that has been there for 20 years and is now going to lose out on her opportunity? I'm sure you do. But if she came to you and said, why didn't you pick me...what would you tell her. That maybe she should have worked harder and developed more skills so she wouldn't get passed up by a new comer. Or would your reward her for NOT going out and doing something to stay ahead of the curve?

 

If a MS kid is beating out a HS kid in a sport, then my first question when a parent comes to me is what did that kid do to make herself better and keep this from happening. Almost 100% of the time, that older kid got comfortable and didn't do much. They weren't going to lose their spot, I've been here for X years. I'm a JR/SR. That's entitlement and that's not a good life lesson.

 

With your reasoning, the opportunity should have just been given go the 20 year employee. It's her company, the temp doesn't even work for that company, she's been in the company much longer, it's her company and she has the first right of refusal of big projects. Only if she refuse the project (doesn't play) should anyone else have the right to be on the project. The company and bosses should make due with the talent they have and not offer it to a temp.

Not fair at all...but happens all the time. It's within the rules today and I wish they could fix that. But rules get stretched all the time...see the transfer rules! Sometimes rules are set for good and there will always be people that use those same rules for bad.

 

If a kid plays up as a 7th and/or 8th grader, then they should have to play at that school when they graduate from 8th grade. If they are associated with that program, then let the best players play. If they have to forfeit a year of eligibility for choosing another HS, I bet they wouldn't play up at all.

 

What is the Tennessee rule?

If a kid plays up as a 7th and/or 8th grader, then they should have to play at that school when they graduate from 8th grade. If they are associated with that program, then let the best players play. If they have to forfeit a year of eligibility for choosing another HS, I bet they wouldn't play up at all.

 

What is the Tennessee rule?

 

Totally agree! They might still do it, but it would make that decision a lot harder!!!...as it should! Honestly, that may do away with all this crap. If you're committed to the program, then whenever you are deemed okay to play by parents, coaches and administration...have at it and the best player wins.

Totally agree! They might still do it' date=' but it would make that decision a lot harder!!!...as it should! Honestly, that may do away with all this crap. If you're committed to the program, then whenever you are deemed okay to play by parents, coaches and administration...have at it and the best player wins.[/quote']

 

Is their a personal agenda here? I find it fascinating that HMS has a rule in place that MS kids can't play up; however this thread is to gain some sort of traction? I don't see it changing with the current administration. I don't have girls and don't give two shakes one way or the other. I have always told my boys to be at the top of their class and push hard on the class above. Girls are different, they have outside interests. Mine came home today battle tested with boards as he did not want to run another 8!! Interesting thread.

Is their a personal agenda here? I find it fascinating that HMS has a rule in place that MS kids can't play up; however this thread is to gain some sort of traction? I don't see it changing with the current administration. I don't have girls and don't give two shakes one way or the other. I have always told my boys to be at the top of their class and push hard on the class above. Girls are different, they have outside interests. Mine came home today battle tested with boards as he did not want to run another 8!! Interesting thread.

 

No personal agenda for me at all. I'm fine with where they are at because I know that Highlands girls has enough numbers to field teams this year. So I'm good with it. As you may or may not know, my daughter has the potential to play up and is not. But nothing personal.

 

However, I don't think it's right to make that rule as a MS principal, but honestly I haven't really pushed it because I know the numbers in the high school program are good right now. However, next year, I'm not sure they will have enough for the freshman team, so it will be interesting what happens then.

 

All I'm saying is that you can't make a blanket statement for that doesn't allow kids to play up. Now if others are abusing what the rule was intended for, then shame on them. In my opinion, if the HS program needs players for any of its teams to exist, then they should be allowed to move up. If a MS kids is deemed able to contribute to their varsity program, then they should be allowed to move up. All others, I agree that I might have an issue with that. But again, you can't say no MS kids can move up. It does more harm than good.

This argument could go on & on & on because no one will ever agree to disagree!! I understand that many have tried hard to argue their point by giving a million different analogies & hypotheticals, but we're not talking about apples & oranges or even apples & bananas for that matter. This is a basketball thread. There are many other sports besides basketball where youth have an advantage over older girls for the physicality purposes (for example Cross-country or Track consistently have top runners winning Varsity meets that are middle schoolers), but this is basketball not softball...not soccer & not volleyball!! Right or wrong this MS trend is here to stay so you best just learn how to deal with that fact!! No matter what age the player is people (especially overzealous parents) will never be satisfied. The lesson to teach here is if you are a high schooler on a high school team, you better bust your tail & step up your game because you can be replaced no matter how many years you've played or what grade you are in. Those players moved & playing up should also remember to watch their backs because come senior year there just might be a 7th or 8th grader taking their spot on that Varsity team!!! Wonder if those in support of MS playing up will still feel so strong when their kid (former MS star that played up) as an upperclassman loses that Varsity spot to a 7th or 8th grader?? It happens & more than likely will happen!!