June 28, 201412 yr The problem with media and social media is it's confusing some people about their rights. How so?
June 28, 201412 yr The problem with media and social media is it's confusing some people about their rights. All they have to do is look them up and interpret them correctly. Really all people need to know is reasonable suspicion.
June 28, 201412 yr So small invasions without cause are okay? You are reaching here. DUI check points and getting info from a detainees cell phone without probable cause are not the apples to even oranges. I can't type the whole full blown reason bc it would take a few pages. Expectation of Privacy and Public welfare are 2 of the main differences.
June 28, 201412 yr You are reaching here. DUI check points and getting info from a detainees cell phone without probable cause are not the apples to even oranges. I can't type the whole full blown reason bc it would take a few pages. Expectation of Privacy and Public welfare are 2 of the main differences. But isn't it true the only reason checkpoints squeak by as being legal is mainly due to them being forced to pseudo announce when and where they are ? If it were 100% legit they wouldn't have to announce it to the public in some form.
June 28, 201412 yr But isn't it true the only reason checkpoints squeak by as being legal is mainly due to them being forced to pseudo announce when and where they are ? If it were 100% legit they wouldn't have to announce it to the public in some form. Actually, it kind of works from a "it's published, so it's legit" deal, the same way it is when the fiscal court or city publishes a new ordinance. They avoid the "entrapment" boondoggle by leaning on the fact that people were warned ahead of time.
June 28, 201412 yr You are reaching here. DUI check points and getting info from a detainees cell phone without probable cause are not the apples to even oranges. I can't type the whole full blown reason bc it would take a few pages. Expectation of Privacy and Public welfare are 2 of the main differences. You can type all day. We'd still disagree. The checkpoints by definition are violations of the 4th amendment. Cloaking it in "public safety" just disguises it. We can take "public welfare" down a long path and people would say "nope - violates my privacy rights."
June 28, 201412 yr Doesn't this ruling make the "texting while driving" law almost unenforceable. You can get pulled over but how would the officer get proof without getting a warrant issued for your phone? For a misdemeanor?
June 28, 201412 yr Doesn't this ruling make the "texting while driving" law almost unenforceable. You can get pulled over but how would the officer get proof without getting a warrant issued for your phone? For a misdemeanor? Consent. Or an admission. Or if they were driving poorly because of the texting they could simply charge them with careless driving.
June 28, 201412 yr But isn't it true the only reason checkpoints squeak by as being legal is mainly due to them being forced to pseudo announce when and where they are ? If it were 100% legit they wouldn't have to announce it to the public in some form. You can type all day. We'd still disagree. The checkpoints by definition are violations of the 4th amendment. Cloaking it in "public safety" just disguises it. We can take "public welfare" down a long path and people would say "nope - violates my privacy rights." Depends on the jurisdiction as far as announcements go I think. For the Constitutional challenges to DUI checkpoints, the difference is whether something is a brief stop solely to check whether a driver is licensed and sober, but not to investigate for any other crimes. They can take 30 seconds or so, but if they keep each driver for say, 3 minutes, make you open the trunk to check for drugs, etc., then you've probably been detained and searched, and they need reasonable suspicion to justify doing so, otherwise you could raise a Constitutional challenge in court and the exclusionary rule would bar searches. Think of a DUI checkpoint as more like a border checkpoint when you are coming back into the US from Canada and less like an officer coming to your doorstep with a search warrant.
June 28, 201412 yr You can type all day. We'd still disagree. The checkpoints by definition are violations of the 4th amendment. Cloaking it in "public safety" just disguises it. We can take "public welfare" down a long path and people would say "nope - violates my privacy rights." Agreed I always fear when citizens are willing to give up rights in the disguise of government promised safety.
June 28, 201412 yr Think of a DUI checkpoint as more like a border checkpoint when you are coming back into the US from Canada and less like an officer coming to your doorstep with a search warrant. I'm not thinking the officer is coming with a search warrant. That's the point.
June 28, 201412 yr How so? Sorry, was on my phone and didn't feel like typing on it at the time you asked me this. I'm sure you have seen all of the youtube videos of people bating police into stopping them. In many situations without reasonable suspicion or probable cause the police can not demand you identify yourself. Some people confuse that with traffic stops and think they have certain rights during a traffic stop that they don't. For example, if the police tell you to get out of the car on a traffic stop, they're well within their authority to do so. Some people get confused about things like that based on social media (youtube videos etc)...
June 28, 201412 yr Sorry, was on my phone and didn't feel like typing on it at the time you asked me this. I'm sure you have seen all of the youtube videos of people bating police into stopping them. In many situations without reasonable suspicion or probable cause the police can not demand you identify yourself. Some people confuse that with traffic stops and think they have certain rights during a traffic stop that they don't. For example, if the police tell you to get out of the car on a traffic stop, they're well within their authority to do so. Some people get confused about things like that based on social media (youtube videos etc)... Gotcha. I can definitely see how that would happen. I'm not sure of a situation where someone has a right to deny identifying themselves (not saying there is or isn't one, just that I don't know of any one where you would be right to refuse to identify yourself if asked).
June 29, 201412 yr Sorry, was on my phone and didn't feel like typing on it at the time you asked me this. I'm sure you have seen all of the youtube videos of people bating police into stopping them. In many situations without reasonable suspicion or probable cause the police can not demand you identify yourself. Some people confuse that with traffic stops and think they have certain rights during a traffic stop that they don't. For example, if the police tell you to get out of the car on a traffic stop, they're well within their authority to do so. Some people get confused about things like that based on social media (youtube videos etc)... If your requesting someone to step out of the car doesn't that mean at least you are detaining if the citizens ask the cops why they have to step out ? There has to be some level of cause . A cop can't pull me over for not having my license plate illuminated and then ask me to get out unless they are detaining or arresting me . They can request I can get out and I can request to wait for my lawyer before I do anything else.
June 29, 201412 yr If your requesting someone to step out of the car doesn't that mean at least you are detaining if the citizens ask the cops why they have to step out ? There has to be some level of cause . A cop can't pull me over for not having my license plate illuminated and then ask me to get out unless they are detaining or arresting me . They can request I can get out and I can request to wait for my lawyer before I do anything else. I think you are confused. Read Pennsylvania vs. Mimms A traffic stop is a brief detention and them ordering you to exit the vehicle does not violate the 4th amendment according to the US Supreme Court.
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