I like him...

 

Without seeing all of the numbers last year at HC, I'd guess he averaged around 10-12 ppg as a freshman at Holy Cross playing a tough schedule. Has been seeing varsity time since his 8th grade year.

 

Averaged 13 ppg in 3 games v Madison Central, Holmes, and Scott Co last year. Didn't get to play against Bullitt East or PRP because of an injury that kept him out a few games.

 

He has been playing against high level competition for years, playing with OBC/All Ohio, which also features Jarron Cumberland. (one of the top players in Ohio for 2016)

Regarding your comment of how often I have seen Hoop Dreams play; I have seen them play in at least 3 tournaments in the last couple years. That includes 2-3 games in each tournament. I have seen a number of their players play outside of Hoop Dreams, and don't bother to ask when and where because that would just be too taxing.... Now as I have said to you before, I believe your son to be very talented and could start and be featured on a number of teams around the state, but when we begin to talk Top 10, we are talking the Elite of the Elite! Kids who are top 10 players should make the game look easy in their age groups, and if they don't then they shouldn't be in the discussion. If we are saying that Some of the players named are one of those top 10 players, then what does that say about basketball in the State? Now I am sure that I watch enough basketball throughout the state and nation for that matter to make such a statement. What Farris and Ayers did playing with Manimal against Hoop Dreams was awesome, but I doubt that colleges determine their opinions about players from one game and I think you should take the same approach.... I have seen them play multiple times and as stated before these may not even be the best players on their team. I have talked with a college coach that thinks 3 of their best players come off the bench... When I make statements, it is without bias. Ayers being is a kid going to my Alma Mater who I knew of and watched before you had a clue who he was. I recognized his potential then and there is absolutely nothing wrong with saying he is good, but not top 10... A huge part of Manimals success was great coaching, teamwork, and effort... But I am a realist without a political agenda, and to say that they have 3 players outside of Sharpe and Fualkner that are top 10 or just outside the top 10 is far fetched. And I think most would agree with me.

 

I think you're at least partially missing the point. I'm not arguing whether my son deserves to be top 10, rather I was taking issue with the way you approached it - even more so with the Ayers kid. I didn't mind at all when you started the post with the top 10 and didn't mention my son. As I mentioned in our communication last week, he's not a flashy/highlight reel type player. It'll take someone (a coach) watching him over several games to appreciate everything he does for a team. Regardless, your and my opinions don't matter anyway at the end of the day.

Your comments that you watched HD 2-3 times/year over the last 3 years and that I'm basing my input on Ayers on 1 game - actually, I watched Manimal play 3 games at state this year, which is comparable to what you watched HD play this year. And, based on those 3 or so games I watched, Ayers stood out as a scorer and Sharpe as a good shooter. Otherwise, it was a good team effort. Watching us in previous years, or Ayers since he was young, is immaterial when assessing who the best players are as of 2013.

That leads to your comment that the truly elite players make the game look easy in their age groups. Against other freshmen teams in the state, I think it's safe to say anyone on any of these lists could do that. However, if you talk about going against high level AAU competition (at their age), and you use that definition, you can't honestly come close to a top 10 from our state. There are 4 players that could meet that definition. Maybe 1 more that is slightly short of that definition. And you pretty much identified those IMO. But the next 15 or so (in a top 20) are not at that level. At least at this stage, they aren't close to the top 4 (or 5) in this group, and there's very little differentiation between any 2 of these players below that. If you were picking for a team beyond that elite group, then it becomes more about what type of player you need as opposed to whose clearly the best. There will likely be more differentiation by the time graduation rolls around, but it's just not there yet.

Wireman stated that he was hesitant to even throw a ranking out there, and I'm assuming it's for these reasons. Overall, I think the 20 or so names that've been mentioned on here are the names that should be in play but, beyond that top 5, trying to differentiate is truly about personal preferences.

 

I can agree with most of what you have said but on some of the other points, we will have to agree to disagree...

2 Camels should be on the watch list. Matt Wilson and Trent McGovney. Along with Weyer, they are the backbone of TBC Elite who made Final Four of State and King James.

Doubletake which 3 kids came off the bench and what coach were you speaking with? Find it very odd that you speak so highly about Coach Stallworths ability but believe his 3 best players did not start.

2 Camels should be on the watch list. Matt Wilson and Trent McGovney. Along with Weyer, they are the backbone of TBC Elite who made Final Four of State and King James.

 

Didn't Brandon Moore play with this group, too? How did he do this summer?

 

I know Weyer had a great summer and averaged close to a double double.

But I am a realist without a political agenda, and to say that they have 3 players outside of Sharpe and Fualkner that are top 10 or just outside the top 10 is far fetched. And I think most would agree with me.

 

Just Saying...

 

I talk to college coaches at all levels almost daily and I can say 100% that coaches are interested in those players. Perry Ayers has been noticed by coaches all around the state this summer.

One of the bullit east kids, and their back up center IMO.... Not sure who he thought.

 

Didn't Brandon Moore play with this group, too? How did he do this summer?

 

I know Weyer had a great summer and averaged close to a double double.

 

Moore left TBC prior to State. Not sure where he went.

Moore left TBC prior to State. Not sure where he went.

 

Gotcha...TBC has a nice program that consists of local kids. Attended NKU for a semester with Stapleton. Good guy that knows how to relate to the kids.

I would love to hear some more folks Top 10s.... I won't dissect anyone else's. I promise! Lol!

I would love to hear some more folks Top 10s.... I won't dissect anyone else's. I promise! Lol!

 

It's cool to give your opinion, you're not upsetting anyone (well at least not me). We all have generally the same top 20, which is pretty much all one can do right now anyways. There are a couple of elite players who are no brainers for top of the list and the rest we'll just have to watch their development.

It's cool to give your opinion, you're not upsetting anyone (well at least not me). We all have generally the same top 20, which is pretty much all one can do right now anyways. There are a couple of elite players who are no brainers for top of the list and the rest we'll just have to watch their development.

 

Now that statement I can agree with 100%... Lol! I just love talking basketball...

It's cool to give your opinion, you're not upsetting anyone (well at least not me). We all have generally the same top 20, which is pretty much all one can do right now anyways. There are a couple of elite players who are no brainers for top of the list and the rest we'll just have to watch their development.

 

THIS!

I'm not ranking based on potential. I'm not going to do a ranking at all. This is a tough class to rank. Potential wise Colton Elkins has tremendous upside and potential and would be in my top 5 based on potential. He could be one of the best ever to play for the Rebels. I was amazed at his growth when I saw him on Tuesday.

he has improved tremendously. Where did u see him play?? Open gym

he has improved tremendously. Where did u see him play?? Open gym

 

 

Yes. First time I had seen him since January/February. I wasn't ready for that. :lol: :lol: I was floored. If he adds that free throw line/elbow jumper to his arsenal......:eek: :eek: