crazy8s

I have to agree that the officiating was very one sided for this game. There were three SK posessions in a row in the early 3rd quarter where fouls were not called against SC upon which SC scored- it was a big swing of the game. Not sure as to why - as the officials were not "homers" as many people like to call them. I have seen them all call very good games but they missed alot of calls. Kind of goes back to what I have said about having three officals vs. two. Seems like they don't blow their whistle waiting on the other official to make the call. It was very obvious that Tolliver was not at her best but I do commend her for getting out there and contributing. I was suprised that the Farris girl did not play more though. SK is a much better team than they played against SC. Shelby Co. will be tough to beat on their own floor for region but they are beatable. The more games I watch with the top 4 schools within this region, the more that I believe it is wide open. Anderson, South Oldham, and Simon Kenton can play with Shelby Co- all of them at one point were beating them on their home floor. It is all going to come down to who can string together 3 wins at the right time. It is too soon to predict. Yes, it is at Shelby which may give them a very slight advantage, but I think it will not be enough to keep one of those other teams from winning.

I have seen three officials mulitple times @ girls games this year in the 8th region - especially with the top teams. They don't do a better job with three and one of them is always waiting for the other one to make the call.

Actually, South Oldham was up by 14 before they had a total meltdown at Anderson County. If it could have gone wrong - it did. Most teams experience moments like this - it was a very disappointing loss. One that they will be very motivated to redeem themselves for. Even though they fell apart, they still had a opporunity to win but could not make the free throws. Anderson is very beatable and yes they won but it by no means indicates anything. They executed well and made the plays when they needed to. South dominated for three quarters, they just couldn't finish the deal. As for the region, IMO Simon Kenton is still the team to beat along with Shelby since it is a Shelby Co. this year.. It will be intersting to see how the game between Shelby Co.& Simon Kenton goes. South still has a very good shot to win the region- I would not count them out because of their loss at Anderson nor would I make them the favorite. They are a good team and really any of the top teams in the region can beat eachother on any given night.

LIT ratings are based on scoring margin, strength of schedule, and overall record....I may be mistaken but I do know that the first two criteria are correct. There was an old post somewhere where they gave an exact definition. Seems to me that Highlands should be higher because they have beaten teams ahead of them. Doesn't really appear to work that way. When you have two teams with losing records in the top 20 - it doesn't necessarily mean it is totally accurate. I don't see how that is possible.

I would have to agree that all three of those regions are very strong but I also think that the LIT rankings are not a true indication as they place an emphasis on scoring margin as one of their criteria. IMO scoring margin influences these teams to run the score up to better position themselves.

Owen will bounce back with a victory at home. Owen by 8

I would have to add that South Oldham has not played as well or as consistently since the Highlands game which was a 25 point win over a very good team which has beaten so excellent teams of late. Last nights game was alot like the Highlands win- with all engines firing both offensively and defensively- they were very sharp playing as a team which has been a big struggle for them this year. They look to now be on the same page and working together.

Owen was at full strenth- all players were there. It was a very good defensive night for South Oldham and I would have to say that Owen had a poor night offensively due to the defense that was played on them. I don't think that Owen came ready to play- they seemed lethargic during warmups and South came ready to play and jumped on them quickly- they could never recover.

I have to disagree about the coaching at SK. He could coach boys very easily with his style which is more suited for boys than girls. That does not make him a bad coach though. Girls have a hard time with constant negativity and cannot separate the two- boys usually can and are more use to that within sports. Have you not heard a football coach lay into his team? All the time, in your face, etc. Coach Stowers is a good coach - he is demanding of his players as he should be. Players need to adapt and learn how to respond appropriatiely. It is not like the players don't know what to expect. The problem I see with girls is that they take everything as negative criticism not coaching - it is hard for them to not see it that way when that is all they hear. They are just too emotional and cannot separate the two.

South Oldham defense was smothering - Williams didn't score a field goal until 3 minutes left in the game which was surprising. She is a very nice player though- picked up two fouls pretty early which didn't help either. Conniff, the 6'2 center from South, had a good game defensively and some nice offensive moves against Williams. Guard play for South was good- Jones, Byrd, and McGuffin all played extremely well. South Oldham's size was key - they were taller at every position and Owen's guards had a hard time.

I agree about Maggie Prewitt- she is another very good player

Also - Kenisha Cook- Franklin Simpson

This is a great honor for these girls - and all are deserving. I do feel that one player did get left of the list who is very worthy of being there - Lauren Jones- South Oldham High School. She is currently in the top 20 in the state in scoring, three point shooting , and # 3 in Free throw %. She has put up ths same numbers last year. She had a great summer which earned her a scholarship to a D1 school so she must be doing something right. It is a shame that she is not included in that list as well.

You should play your best players regardless of age- all things being equal, both players can be used throughout a game and can play an important role. The big key is how effective they are when they are in there- are they productive in a positive way. This pertains to defense too. Some players may be a better offiensive player and they would get the nod in a game where they need to score. Other times, you may need a good defender to get in there and stop the other team. Every game could produce a different result. It depends on what you need for that game and who can give it to you. You can have a senior that is a great scorer but cannot buy a basket but their presence on the floor is still important becuase they do more than just score.- they are your anchor on defense, they are the one who can break the press, they find the open person and make the pass to get the basket. If there is not an aspect of their game that is valuable, put in the player that can. Parents and players put too much emphasis on who starts the game....not relative- it's who finishes the game, especially a close one, that is what really matters. Most important is to make the most out of the playing time that you do have- be effective and productive when you get the opportunity.

All great replies. I agree that your leader does not necessarily need to be vocal but must lead by example. Actions speak louder than words...funny how we all go back to ides we learned when we were little. I also agree that the coach has a significant decision in determining who they want to put in that position which takes me back to my original question. When a player, who may be talented but does not demonstrate a good work ethic, team work, or a positive attitude- (all values desirable of a true leader) you are asking for trouble. What happens when the coach chooses the wrong person?

I have read several posts today that mention senior leadership. I agree that the seniors need to step up and set the tone for the team-here are my questions and I look forward to your responses. What do you do when some of your seniors are committed and some are not but they are all given equal responsibility on the team? Some choose to take the "fun" role becuase it is easier and set a poor example for the younger players while others are trying to set a good example, work hard, play hard, etc which entails the younger players to not want to follow because it is not "fun" enough or they might have to work too hard. This causes confusion among all the players and frustration among the players that are trying to be good leaders. Your thoughts on how to handle that... Also,... any suggestions on how to provide good leadership for players who don't care about the team- they only care about themselves, their stats, etc?

I agree with this totally!

A great question and one that I can seen happening today in some districts. I don't have the answer for that but if the skills are good enough one would hope that eventaully that would win out over physical but it most cases it probably won't. If you want to win your district you may have to adapt- not hat I agree with it but it may be necessary.

The key word that I pick up on with regards to the rules is - "unintentional contact." There is a difference of what that means vs. what is occurring in the game today. Players are "intentionally" initiating physical contact which in turn hinders the movement of the other player. You are kidding yourself if you think that most of this stuff is unintentional- kids are taught to do it and there are entire teams that play this way and it is an advantage for them. When they finally come up against better officiating- they struggle. Some of the best officiating I have seen is when the ref sees what is going on and they tell them to stop. "get out of the lane, get your hands off, stop holding, etc." If they don't stop then they they call it. I have heard that officials are not suppose to talk to the players that way anymore which is a shame if that is true becaue I think it the kids learn from that. The last point I want to make that it all depends on what side of the play you are on- if you are a physical defender- you don't see anything wrong with being physical and it is ok. However, If you are the person on the offensive end of it, getting held, grabbed, pushed, shoved, etc. it takes on a whole different feel. Yes players should be tougher, and yes the game is more physical in college- but we are not talking about college here we are talking high school, even middle school games that have become a football game at times without pads!

I agree that the game has gotten more physical and that the girls need to get stronger so that those bumps don't affect them. My biggest complaint with physical play is that on one end they call it and the other end they don't within the same game- you get the beat up on one end and barely touch them on the other end- saw it happen all night long in a game last night. Either you call it tight or you don't - there is just a lot of inconsistency within the games which makes it hard to understand what is a foul or not a foul.

I agree that the officials don't want to have that many free throws shot in a game which is why they don't call it. Seems to me what is what they are getting paid for..... I understand that you cannot call everything but the "touchy" fouls get called - when a whole lot more is going on in the exact same game. When these kids who have formed these bad fouling habits get an official who call it, they don't know what to do. So some of the blame needs to fall on to the coaches who are allowing them to play that way. Players also will push the limit to see what they can get away with. They don't have the bball skills but they are going to beat the heck out of those who do- cannot win with skill so I am going to win with mugging, pushing, shoving, and hacking. There is a big difference between playing tough defense that might be phsyical than playing dirty.

This is a great topic and one that everyone seems to have an opinion on. The biggest thing that I have seen as both a parent and a coach is that a foul on one end is not a foul on the other end. Drives me crazy- it is understandable though becuase as the ref's rotate up and down the floor they change positions and each ref sees it differently. Body fouls, pushing from behind & holding are rampant - you cannot hold someone and I see it almost every game where the other team has a hold of the jersery -usually of the better player for the other team. There is no defense there but these kids are "taught" how to do it and they do it well and the majority of the time they do not get caught. Very rarely is that called by the offiicals and I don't understand why- especially when it is done right in fromt of them. I have heard numerous times by refs that it is not a foul by unless the other player "gets an advantage" - they will call an offensive player fighting for position with their body a charge but the defender is shoving like crazy from behind and it is a no call. Officiating is very inconsistent, especially with girls bball. Why girls don't get as good as officials as the boys do. I know that there is someone that assigns that but it would be nice to have the better officials for the varsity girls- there are some good ones out there but when they are paired up with the bad ones it makes them look bad too. Officiating is a thankless job but a poorly officiated game can make a difference especially when a team thrives in that type of environment. This year I have seen so many poorly officiated games, more than I have seen in over the last ten years. You have to call the fouls early to set the tone of the game- I think that some officials don't want to call them because it makes the game longer. It would just be nice if there was some consistency on both ends- the girls deserve it!

Kelsey is a very nice post player is is very under-rated. She does many things well. Congrats Kelsey!

It appears to me that this doesn't really reflect all the games that have been played to date. I know that Henderson Co has lost 2 games but it shows them 5-0, along with Manual only losing one- I think that they have lost two. It says as of 12 /31/07 on the above link...how often do they do this? I think that the LIT ratings put too much emphasis on high scoring games which only encoruages team to schedule easier teams and run up the score so they have a higher point margin- you see this alot early in the season. I have conistently seen teams within a region be rated higher because of this - has never really made much sense and I know that you have to come up with something, I am just wondering if they need to update their formula. Does anyone know how close these ratings have been to the teams that really make it to the sweet sixteeen? Still may not pan out though as several regions have more than one top team.

5- Hopkins Central 3- Manual 3- Rockcastle 1- Fulton 1- Franklin Co 1- S. Laurel 1- S. Oldham 1- Grant Co. 1- Mason Co 1- East Jessamine Tiebreaker - 105