Hasbeen

I guess I need someone to give me an example of "working hard". I've seen teams that begin conditioning at 5 AM for road work, lift all year and practice 3 hrs. per day and still not win 5 games. "Working hard" is part of the equation but will only take you so far if the best athletes are going elsewhere. As for your second paragraph, it's hard to argue against a parent doing what he thinks is best for his child, but using that same logic, why limit it to only those who have not played varsity ball? A lot of things can change in four years. For example, a change in coaches, teaching staff or corriculum. Would it not be just as wise to change schools at that time? I know nothing of the situation at Pendleton or Campbell, but in your example you pointed out the reasons Campbell should accept the students and I agree, but what is the advantage for Pendleton? Please understand I agree that a parent should be able to choose what is best for a particular student. My point is that if this freedom is abused, if parents use this freedom solely to build an "All-Star" team at a particular school, it creates an obstacle that is almost impossible to overcome for other schools regardless of how much "hard work" they put into their program. I started this thread to point out that recruiting is not the viable excuse that many of the public supporters have been claiming and that giving the boot to the private schools will only strenghten an elite few of the publics who have more liberal transfer policies and better traditions than their neighboring schools. I expected the private supporters to see this as strenghtening their position but all I'm seeing is that tired claim that the schools I support are being out worked. A few years ago, I witnessed a local school suffer through an 0-10 season. Several players had transfered at the beginning of the year, the coaching staff left a lot to be desired and the team was full of malcontents and problem students. There was however, a small group of about 8 players who could have transfered and been welcomed at any of the area schools. They chose not to abandon each other worked their butts off throughout this miserable season, sometimes being the only players to show up for practice. Fortunately, this did not go unnoticed by supporters and district administrators and led to huge changes in the program including a coaching change, facilities and budget.

What would you suggest as the proper solution? Neither side can change their guidelines, mostly for financial reasons. The private schools need to draw from as large an area as possible to survive. The public schools need to follow guidelines set down by the state and their local boards. The privates can draw from multiple counties or even states, the publics with open enrollment can draw from other schools within their district, the schools with reciprical agreements can take students from other districts, and some schools only allow students from within their own boundaries. All have legitiment reasons for what they do and it works well for them in most cases with the glaring example of athletic parity.

While that sounds reasonable on the surface and in some cases is true, I have to disagree. There are many, many teams who work just as hard without the success those teams have. My point is, serious players gravitate toward programs who are successful for whatever reason. Sure some teams work harder than others but that's not the case as often as some think.

:irked: :lol: If I had been allowed to switch to a different school I might have known it is spelled v-o-l-u-n-t-a-r-i-l-y.

They don't call the desperate long pass play a "Hail Mary" for nothing.

Everyone knows that recruiting does go on, but my point is that it's not the major concern that some think it is. The really good programs don't have to recruit, they only have to accept those that come volunteerily. If we could find a way to eliminate this problem and still allow for the transfer of students for legitiment reasons i.e. change of address or academic needs, there would be no need for the public/private debate. The KHSAA has rules in place now, but they are almost impossible to enforce and easily gotten around.

:thumb: I've been waiting for the opportunity to point that out and you beat me to it.

I know it's an attempt to become more regional, but you guys maybe should rethink that one. A quick Google search comes up with many Times-Tribune but only one Corbin Times-Tribune. Perhaps S.E. Ky T-T?

After months of reading and considering the points of this forum, I have concluded we are attempting to treat the symptoms and not the real illness. To illustrate, I'm going to describe a hypothetical situation and I would like opinions on what would be the best course of action. Let's eliminate the Private/Public emotions by staging my scenario in the mountains of Eastern Ky and involving two public school systems. It goes like this: School A and School B exist in neighboring counties of very similar size and economic status. They have a reciprical agreement that allows students to freely attend either school for reasons of convenience. For some reason, be it the excitement of a new coach, the arrival of an exceptionally gifted class of athletes or sheer dumb luck, School A has a noteworthy run of good football seasons. This does not go unnoticed by the athletes and especially the fathers of middleschool players feeding into school B, and more and more begin to show up at School A. School A does not recruit these kids but they do welcome them with open arms. Now, having recieved many of the best athletes from both counties for two or three years, School A becomes a powerhouse football team and the word in the area is "If you want to play football for a good coach, have a shot at a state championship and get colleges to notice, School A is the place to be." For the sake of this story, the coach at School B is just as good as his counterpart, his kids work just as hard in the off season, and the parents of the players who remain work just as hard providing for the team. Yet, with the constant flow of the best athletes heading for school A, they struggle to get above .500 year after year. Contrary to what both sides have stated, I think this is the root of the problem and I believe their is no solution other than dividing schools into classes relating to what rules they choose to play by. If we take the private schools out of the equation, we still have the open enrollment districts to contend with. Some will say I'm watering down the championship. Some will call me a whiner, but I believe each player and team deserves an equal shot limited only by how hard they are willing to work toward that goal. Opinions? Look at it with an open mind. You schools that have, get over the idea that your success is the sole result of a superior upbringing and work ethic. You schools that have not, stop complaining about recruiting, I've illustrated why it's not necessary. Show me a solution.

So we're saying small town reporters are not competent to vote on All-State team? Will the larger newspapers inside The Golden Triangle then send someone to watch the teams out in the rest of the state? Or shall we just assume there is no one at the smaller schools worth seeing anyway?

:thumb: Knox Central made great strides in strengh last season. Speed is the need.

It's on the Times-tribune website, but you have to have a subscription to read the full article. As for whether the paper jumped the gun, it was reported as unconfirmed and that the kids were the source. I'm fine with that.

I'm still amused that you saw fit to provide me a list of things you've bought/donated/contributed. I think you've become so involved in the discussion you're not noticing who you're debating with. :lol:

Parents work so the kids benefit! What a novel idea! Can anyone do this or only private schools?

True, but at the end of the season you can't have a big barbeque with a school bus.

Sure. Loaded our equipment in the covered wagon and played every Friday.

1969 Knox Central at Morristown Tenn. of all places. It had rained earlier in the week and when the temperature went below freezing, all the footprints in the mud froze into a sharp edge that would open cuts on any part of the body that contacted ground. Back in those days we were allowed to bleed and continue playing.

According to what Brian said last night, that is exactly the type of atmosphere they're hoping for. He even encouraged fans from other games played nearby to drop in after the game they attended is over. I think it's a great idea.

While I don't think he's coach of the year, Clay County's Aaron Steppe deserves some form of recognition. He completely revamped his offensive system this year to match his personel and has the Tigers in the playoffs for the 2nd straight season.

Homework? Well golly gee! We wud never do homework. When we would get to watch tv?

See? :mad:

Exactly, but that's the whole point. We're stuck with what we have. It's not your fault, it's not mine, but the whole argument is equality, a level playing field. That's why I think there will never be a solution other than separation. It would be stupid (and actually mean spirited) to ask the privates to give up what they have. By the same token, it has built in advantages that the publics by law can not have. This is one of those riddles that have no answer and if it were not for the arrogance of some that believe the only difference is that the public schools are just too lazy to improve I would not even bother to read these threads.

But that's against the law. Every child has the right to an education. (Whether they want it or not).

The districts maintain an "alternative school". Usually a separate campus where students are sent either temporarily or permanantly if they are such disipline problems that it disrupts the normal classroom.

I'm all for classes in all sports. The dream of a Carr Creek scenario has been a disservice to small schools in my opinion although I will acknowledge it's much easier to come up with 5 outstanding players than it would be 30-40.