All political issues seem to come back to taxes. Tax dollars to support the bailout plan. The effect of each candidate's economic "plan" upon taxes. Tax dollars needed to support Obama's health care "plan," and tax deductions/credits called for in McCain's "plan." Whether the tax dollars exist to eradicate illegal immigrants or build a wall, or how much tax revenue would be raised by a guest worker program. How tax affects gas prices. The amount of taxes being spent per month in Iraq. Tax breaks/subsidies for new energy development. Heck, even the 'Marijuana Legalization' thread centered in part around the benefits of product taxation.

 

So this is the tax thread. Since its my thread, here are the rules:

 

1. Discussion of Obama/McCain, Democrat/Republican, liberal/conservative/libertarian shall be permitted, BUT ONLY WITHIN THE CONTEXT OF THE DIRECT SUBJECT OF TAXATION. Therefore, references to Wright/Ayers/Rezko/ACORN or similar off-topic candidate issues will be stricken, unless you, in my brilliant judgment alone, can somehow tie it in to a legitimate tax issue;

 

2. I am looking, in particular, for good discussion of revision of the Uniform Tax Code of 1986, and proposals for same, so FairTax, FlatTax, etc. etc. is all ripe for proposal;

 

3. Discussion of elimination of certain SPENDING programs is a reasonable threadjack, as are discussions of corporate taxation, estate and gift taxation, capital gains taxation, property taxation, sales taxation, etc. etc.

 

4. Links to sources will be crucial;

 

5. I will patrol and strike over-the-line name-calling. "Liberal," "conservative," and "neo-con" "tax-and-spender" and "Big Oil" are O.K., but "left-wing nutjob," "Big Oil fat cat," "NoBama," "The One," and "McSame" will all be stricken. Use good judgment;

 

I will start.

 

I propose elimination of all unemployment insurance divisions unless a state wants to enact same. I call for elimination of all Departments of Workers Compensation unless the state wants to enact same, and also a repeal on all statutory restrictions against lawsuits against employers based upon injured workers. I call for the elimination of all state and federal estate, gift, and inheritance taxes. I call for an across-the-board 10% flat tax on all income from any source, in combination with a 5% retail consumption tax on all primary market transactions, collected point-of-sale. This would work in combination with a 3% consumption tax on all production-level transactions, collected point-of-sale. I call for the elimination of all capital gains taxation on real estate of any kind, and a flat 10% capital gains tax rate of all securities collected point-of-transaction. I call for the elimination of all deductions/exemptions/tax credits, with the exception of the following:

 

1. Income/Consumption "exemption" for up to 50% of income to the extent of health insurance premiums paid for/on behalf of employees and their families;

 

2. Income/Consumption "exemption" for up to 25% of personal income to the extent of health insurance rempiums paid by individual;

 

3. Income/Consumption "exemption" for up to 100% of income/consumption for the first 2 years of existence of all newly-formed businesses in energy technologies;

 

4. 100% infrastructure cost deduction, spreadable over a maximum of 5 years for the cost of production of any new: hospital; community health facility; refinery; electric plant; oil rig; incinerator; nuclear power plant; water treatment or waste treatment facility; or the cost of acquisition of any privately held land trust for ecological preservation.

 

I also call for the complete elimination of the federal Department of Education, with a 2 year disbursal of those federal funds, per capita, to the states for reorganization of their own state education plans.

I'm not well versed on the ins and outs of the tax system, but I think some version of a FairTax or FlatTax makes the most sense. I really liked Mike Huckabee's idea of setting up a tax system that will minimize, if not completely eliminate, the IRS.

 

I do not like the current setup.

I agree that the system needs to be simplified radically.

 

Any system that requires businesses to expend 10% or more of their time and personnel resources merely keeping up with paperwork and documentation is a severe drag on our economy.

 

Any system so complicated that it requires more and more "agents" to police, verify and collect returns is going in the wrong direction.

I think simplicity is the foundation of any reasonable tax policy.

 

But, this all boils down to what we want government to do or not to do. We can make taxes as low as we'd like or as high as we'd like depending on how much money is needed to fund the government. So, in this light, the income tax and deduction information attached to paychecks should also include a percentage for how much of that person's income is being spent by the government on roads, schools, wars, welfare, etc.

I will start.

 

I propose elimination of all unemployment insurance divisions unless a state wants to enact same. I call for elimination of all Departments of Workers Compensation unless the state wants to enact same, and also a repeal on all statutory restrictions against lawsuits against employers based upon injured workers. I call for the elimination of all state and federal estate, gift, and inheritance taxes. I call for an across-the-board 10% flat tax on all income from any source, in combination with a 5% retail consumption tax on all primary market transactions, collected point-of-sale. This would work in combination with a 3% consumption tax on all production-level transactions, collected point-of-sale. I call for the elimination of all capital gains taxation on real estate of any kind, and a flat 10% capital gains tax rate of all securities collected point-of-transaction. I call for the elimination of all deductions/exemptions/tax credits, with the exception of the following:

 

1. Income/Consumption "exemption" for up to 50% of income to the extent of health insurance premiums paid for/on behalf of employees and their families;

 

2. Income/Consumption "exemption" for up to 25% of personal income to the extent of health insurance rempiums paid by individual;

 

3. Income/Consumption "exemption" for up to 100% of income/consumption for the first 2 years of existence of all newly-formed businesses in energy technologies;

 

4. 100% infrastructure cost deduction, spreadable over a maximum of 5 years for the cost of production of any new: hospital; community health facility; refinery; electric plant; oil rig; incinerator; nuclear power plant; water treatment or waste treatment facility; or the cost of acquisition of any privately held land trust for ecological preservation.

 

I also call for the complete elimination of the federal Department of Education, with a 2 year disbursal of those federal funds, per capita, to the states for reorganization of their own state education plans.

A few questions/comments, really quickly-

 

1. I disagree with having a flat consumption and income tax. Not only do I feel that it is more dangerous, as they could both be raised slowly over time, I think that, if the goal is simplification, then we should do just one. Personally, I prefer the Flat Income tax.

 

2. I think that the 100% credit (or whatever it is termed) would cause problems. You could get giant companies getting themself minimally involved in alternative energy industries, and expecting to pay no income taxes. That would have to be very carefully safeguarded.

 

3. I am not sure if this is related, but I think abolition of the minimum wage should be in there instead. I would support a "basic income" which would be either cash/tax credit for everyone in America (citizenship is the only required quality) up to a certain level.

I honestly don't know, so please don't burn me at the stake:

 

Is it appropriate to discuss our ideas of reducing the COSTS that taxes support?

I honestly don't know, so please don't burn me at the stake:

 

Is it appropriate to discuss our ideas of reducing the COSTS that taxes support?

 

Yes. That is what I meant by elimination of spending programs.

 

Is there a burn at the stake emoticon?

ttt

 

A lot of posters on here want to discuss taxes in other threads but offer nothing here. Is it possible that we are just spouting stuff we know nothing about?

ttt

 

A lot of posters on here want to discuss taxes in other threads but offer nothing here. Is it possible that we are just spouting stuff we know nothing about?

 

 

I'm admitted economic imbecile. :lol: I have good thoughts on ways to cut spending, but I have little credibility on restructuring the tax system....but I will say we could save a lot of money by not paying IRS employees' salaries. :lol: Just kidding!

ttt

 

A lot of posters on here want to discuss taxes in other threads but offer nothing here. Is it possible that we are just spouting stuff we know nothing about?

It's possible that most posters don't care about the actual stuff, or don't feel educated enough to give there input. I know that many posters are smarter than I, but I have no problem giving my input- I don't why it is a problem for some.

 

Do you have any responses to my post about your ideas?

It's possible that most posters don't care about the actual stuff, or don't feel educated enough to give there input. I know that many posters are smarter than I, but I have no problem giving my input- I don't why it is a problem for some.

 

Do you have any responses to my post about your ideas?

 

I agree with abolition of the minimum wage. The combining ideas with Flat and FairTax was just a thought to appease different constituencies, the percentages are lower for each than are called for by their support groups.

 

The 100% exemption only helps corporations to the extent they, dollar for dollar, construct new facilities. We are running out of places to put garbage. If G.E. builds a new incinerator that costs $650 million, then it can exempt $650 million of income elsewhere in its tax filing. The nation gets a new incinerator and the environment gets some burned trash, shareholders get great dividends and less tax exposure, and nobody's taxes have had to have been raised so that the government can construct the facility.

I agree with abolition of the minimum wage. The combining ideas with Flat and FairTax was just a thought to appease different constituencies, the percentages are lower for each than are called for by their support groups.

 

The 100% exemption only helps corporations to the extent they, dollar for dollar, construct new facilities. We are running out of places to put garbage. If G.E. builds a new incinerator that costs $650 million, then it can exempt $650 million of income elsewhere in its tax filing. The nation gets a new incinerator and the environment gets some burned trash, shareholders get great dividends and less tax exposure, and nobody's taxes have had to have been raised so that the government can construct the facility.

:thumb:You won't find me disagreeing with the principle of tax exemptions, ever. Just do you think this one would be practical to implement and maintain? It would be difficult to specifically calculate where each dollar is going to, you know?

:thumb:You won't find me disagreeing with the principle of tax exemptions, ever. Just do you think this one would be practical to implement and maintain? It would be difficult to specifically calculate where each dollar is going to, you know?

 

Well, of course there is tax fraud that happens all the time, so I don't think the regulation of it would be any different than regulating many of the itemized deductions we all report every year. There's not going to be an inordinate amount of these projects, so I would say a G-man could be assigned to each one as they are reported.

Flat Income Tax is the answer.

 

4. 100% infrastructure cost deduction, spreadable over a maximum of 5 years for the cost of production of any new: hospital; community health facility; refinery; electric plant; oil rig; incinerator; nuclear power plant; water treatment or waste treatment facility; or the cost of acquisition of any privately held land trust for ecological preservation.

 

I also call for the complete elimination of the federal Department of Education, with a 2 year disbursal of those federal funds, per capita, to the states for reorganization of their own state education plans.

 

 

Those 2 are very interesting.

 

My question on infrastructure is would you coal, gas, or oil companies does to up production and efficiency falling in this category?