No, you would just not see them show up in the summer. How do you force a kid to get up and come to school when the parents don't care if they get up and come to school and then give an effort while here.

 

You are absolutely correct! Unless the teachers are are going to travel home with many of them at night, force them to do their homework and actually help them understand what they are struggling with, then these kids will struggle with class work and test taking.

You are absolutely correct! Unless the teachers are are going to travel home with many of them at night, force them to do their homework and actually help them understand what they are struggling with, then these kids will struggle with class work and test taking.

 

It is not a stretch to imagine that a parent would say that they are just going to homeschool because they are tired of the cabinets and the courts on their case when their child won't go to school and is failing all of their classes.

 

BGP rules prevent me, I believe, from stating the above any other way.

bottom line is this---CATS testing will never be an accurate assessment of what a student can actually do until that student is held accountable.

AMEN:thumb:

I think not, because like some people previously said, some don't test well.

 

Please help me to understand how someone is a bad test taker. In my opinion, you either know the material or you don't.

 

This is an honest question: What are some characteristics of bad test takers? I'm talking about someone who genuinely is trying to do well. And what are some characteristics of good test takers?

Please help me to understand how someone is a bad test taker. In my opinion, you either know the material or you don't.

 

This is an honest question: What are some characteristics of bad test takers? I'm talking about someone who genuinely is trying to do well. And what are some characteristics of good test takers?

 

Poor reader. They could verbalize the answers to you but can't put it down on paper or cannot read the question and comprehend what is being asked.

 

Some put a lot of pressure on themselves and similar to a bball player missing the free throw with 00 on the clock. They choke with the pressure on. They get so nervous, their minds go blank and they can't think of anything.

Please help me to understand how someone is a bad test taker. In my opinion, you either know the material or you don't.

 

This is an honest question: What are some characteristics of bad test takers? I'm talking about someone who genuinely is trying to do well. And what are some characteristics of good test takers?

 

My Daughter is OCD and is a straight A student in all Honors classes, however everything must be perfect, each answer will be erased several times and re-written, On the CATS tests she does great as long as there is not a time limit. She is usually the last person in the school to finish. She does great on Multiple choice also, just any time it is a timed test that involves a long answer it is difficult. She always scored distinguished except if it is a writing on Demand or other type test.

 

I think it is the timed issue that makes some kids choke.

 

Dyslexic children has issues with timed test also. It takes longer for them to read the question and understand it.

Wow...so many points to make, not enough time!

 

First, I am not a proponent of the CATS system, nor of NCLB.

Both are good in theory, but do not work in reality.

 

The CATS test is based on core content that is aligned with national standards in each area. If I am a good chemistry and physics teacher, I would teach those things...but not JUST those things. As a chemistry example, I need to teach the composition of the atom, trends on the periodic table, how compounds form, how their properties are affected, what affects rates of reactions, and why reactions occur. I teach those things and would likely do so, no matter what state I taught in.

 

However, as a teacher preparing my students for college chemistry, I also need to teach metric conversions, the mole concept, stoichiometry, gas laws, nuclear chemistry, organic chemistry, equilibrium, solubility and precipitation and a few others. I teach those things, too, even though they are not tested over them. This is the difference between teaching things that will be on the test and teaching the test itself.

 

As to the question of whether or not that a student should have to get a certain score on the test to pass a class, it is a slippery slope. Most of the students I have try really hard on the test. They answer all questions and spend time doing so. However, they don't all get proficient...does that mean that I haven't taught them enough?

 

Yet, isn't it ironic that I am judged by their test scores, while they are not? Not just judged, but accountable?

I hate the idea of CATS testing.

 

I wish we could go back to the old fashioned way of learning. Teachers taught, children learned, parents participated and backed teachers 100%. Everyone did their job, with few exceptions. Schools were not responsible for feeding our kids breakfast, providing medical care, birth control and sometimes day care. In addition, they didnt have to take a big part of the year teaching and preparing for a test. End result is that we LEARNED without holding special accountability testing. Students with learining issues passed if they worked hard and participated in class. If you failed, you had no one to blame but yourself and you were actually held back.

 

I think our teachers today are too stressed out trying to uphold responsibilities that should not be theirs.

Please help me to understand how someone is a bad test taker. In my opinion, you either know the material or you don't.

 

This is an honest question: What are some characteristics of bad test takers? I'm talking about someone who genuinely is trying to do well. And what are some characteristics of good test takers?

 

There is something called test anxiety. Some kids know the material, but when it's time to test, they freak out, or freeze, or all the information leaves them. This is what I meant by some kids don't test well.

 

On the other side, you have kids that flat out don't know the material and don't care.

 

I think our teachers today are too stressed out trying to uphold responsibilities that should not be theirs.

 

Or to the point that they realize that the job has been made to guarantee their failure as a group so, they concentrate on individual and single kids and if the school scores don't reach some political goal, who cares.

 

My feeling, with the new President and Governor, it is going to be changing in 2-4 years anyhow and we will all have knew stuff to do so no need to get myself worked up about it.

 

I will concentrate on the students in front of me and doing what I need for them to be successful in life and not on (I will let you fill in the rest.)

 

It is the reason why I gave up that thought of being a principal. I would be fired because I would be too much like Bobby Knight and tell people what I thought of the demands placed on schools that get in the way of allowing teachers to teach.

I shared this with an administrator once and I thought they were going to have a brain aneurysm right there.

 

I asked if private schools were better than public. They quickly pointed out that the latest tests show that public kids and private kids of the same ilk do the same. There is no big difference to the quality of education they are getting between kids of the same type.

 

The hook was set.:D

 

I then asked them how is that possible. How in the world can private schools be doing just as good as a job as we are. I mean seriously, how in the world are their kids learning at private schools when their kids don't have to 1) do portfolios; 2)do on-demande writing; 3)have CATS testing 4) have web organizers 5) another KIRIS demand of something, etc, etc etc.

 

How in the world can they be teaching anything to their students when they don't do the things that KY is telling us we have to do for students to learn. I thought it was impossible to learn unless we did all this stuff. (note the dripping sarcasm in my voice)

 

Surely since they don't jump through any of these hoops, there students must be failing everything and be dumb as Rocks.

 

But they aren't. They are educating them just the same as we are. Except without all the silly things that pulls us public school teachers away from teaching the kids.

 

You can imagine that I was not met with a smiling face.

Excellent points LBBC!

Excellent points LBBC!

 

Obviously, you are not my administator because they didn't think my points were excellent points.:lol:

 

If I keep posting on this topic, I am going to get so perturbed my children is going to be at Calvary Christian next year and I am going to have to change a whole bunch of posts in the P & P forum.:irked:

It's not like the kids are being taught the basic skills now anyway. They are being taught the test. Instead of focusing in on the basic skills and making them proficient in a small number of things, they are throwing too much at them and settling for them knowing just enough to pass the test. This isn't aimed at every teacher in the state, because I know their hands are tied and they have to teach what they are told.

 

In addition to working two, sometimes three jobs, which requires me to be gone at night sometimes, I now have to teach my sons the basics of math on a worksheet. During the day, they did a math worksheet that catered to what was on the test. My son is in the second grade. 50 math problems a night. Three times a week. 20 pages of required reading, three times a week. 30 spelling words. 40 reading words. Instead of making him proficient in reading to where he can just comprehend what he is reading, they have him do book reports because that's how the CATS test is set up. He's in the second grade.

 

I fear what's happening at schools across the state is that they are so wrapped up in "teaching the test", that the burden of teaching my children the basic skills are falling on my lap. The school has them seven hours a day. I have them five when I don't work at night and maybe one or two when I do. Sometimes not at all.

 

As far as the original question goes, should the CATS test be used to pass kids in school? If you do that, then do the same thing with college entrance exams. One day, one test. Make a 22 and you're in. One chance. It's basically what the CATS proposal is. If we do that, then why go to school during the year? You could have kids challenge the requirement to go to school, be able to stop in one day and take a test. If they can pass the test, then why require them to attend school?

 

Kentucky is too darned wrapped up in CATS testing and missing the overall picture. The CATS test is designed to make students proficient in learning and make the college ready. Yet, Kentucky's average ACT score has been below the national average 17 of the last 18 years.

 

I remember the testing days. Baloo is a bear. Wuzzle means to mix. Alate means to have wings. Sculch is junk. There was little pressure on testing then because it wasn't tied to much.

 

Now, test scores determine funding, who controls the school district (local or state), etc. So much emphasis has been placed on the CATS testing that small but important things are falling through the cracks.

 

To use a baseball analogy, you can't teach the hit and run until you teach the players how to hit a baseball and run the bases. You can't teach infield positioning on a bunt play until the players know how to field the ball to begin with.

 

In another logic that people in Kentucky probably do understand, you can't teach a team how to break a full court press if they can't dribble the ball in the first place.

 

Please forward this to one of our Senators or Congressmen, please!!!!!

 

Great post!!!