It would make sense to me if the KHSAA would amend their regs. to allow anyone, including coaches, to talk to kids about athletics. Why is it so evil for a coach to talk to a kid about athletics? Are we all so naive to believe that kids don't consdier athletics as part of their decision making process? In Jefferson County's open enrollment system why is that Seneca seems put out a great Wrestling team every year, PRP a great baseball team, Eastern and BAllard great basketball teams? Kids who excel in those sports want to go there. Why shouldn't a kid be allowed to meet PRP's baseball coach and find out if he would fit in and if he's ready to make the commitment Coach Miller expects?

It would make sense to me if the KHSAA would amend their regs. to allow anyone, including coaches, to talk to kids about athletics. Why is it so evil for a coach to talk to a kid about athletics? Are we all so naive to believe that kids don't consdier athletics as part of their decision making process? In Jefferson County's open enrollment system why is that Seneca seems put out a great Wrestling team every year, PRP a great baseball team, Eastern and BAllard great basketball teams? Kids who excel in those sports want to go there. Why shouldn't a kid be allowed to meet PRP's baseball coach and find out if he would fit in and if he's ready to make the commitment Coach Miller expects?

 

My kid will give 0% consideration to athletics when they choose what high school to attend.

 

There is only one high school in the county. No real choice.

 

And your example along with mine highlights a true difference that exists in HS athletics today.

My kid will give 0% consideration to athletics when they choose what high school to attend.

 

There is only one high school in the county. No real choice.

 

And your example along with mine highlights a true difference that exists in HS athletics today.

 

Very true for many schools in the state....then you hear of kids moving in with their "guardian" one county over and they happen to be decent ballplayers. I know it happens, I've talked to college students who did it. Even in your situation, surely there is a private school within driving distance your child could attend. Say she was a swimmer and your county school didn't have a pool or a swim team (many don't), but the private school 40 miles away did. What would the harm be in your child meeting with the swim coach and talking about the swim program at the private school? What if this particular private school had sent 30 kids on to college with full or partial scholarships in swimming over the last 5 years? Just doesn't sound awful to me to let that swim coach talk to your child.

Very true for many schools in the state....then you hear of kids moving in with their "guardian" one county over and they happen to be decent ballplayers. I know it happens, I've talked to college students who did it. Even in your situation, surely there is a private school within driving distance your child could attend. Say she was a swimmer and your county school didn't have a pool or a swim team (many don't), but the private school 40 miles away did. What would the harm be in your child meeting with the swim coach and talking about the swim program at the private school? What if this particular private school had sent 30 kids on to college with full or partial scholarships in swimming over the last 5 years? Just doesn't sound awful to me to let that swim coach talk to your child.

 

I would assume that swimming is like golf. What you do during the HS season doesn't mean alot when it comes to college recruiting.

Good luck figuring this out...

 

Bylaw 10...

Sec. 1) Foreword

Pupils (both domestic and foreign) at any grade level shall not be recruited to a member school of the KHSAA for the purpose of participating in athletics, including recruitment under the guise of academics

 

Sec. 2) Definition

 

Recruiting is defined as an act, on behalf of or for the benefit of, a school, which attempts to influence a student to transfer to a member school for the purpose of participating in athletics. A school official utilizing an intermediary, such as, but not limited

to a peer, another school employee, a student, a parent or a citizen, for the purpose of recruiting a student athlete shall be in noncompliance.

 

 

I feel smart...

 

In section 2, the word transfer may be the most important thing to look at. You are recruiting illegaly, by definition, if you attempt to influence a student to transfer to another member school for athletic reasons.

 

Well what does transfer really mean? I would say you would have to be enrolled at one member school, then leave and automatically enroll at another member school, for it to be called a transfer. It is not a transfer if one enrolls at any member school the first day of 9th grade, even if the student was not in a direct feeder school in 8th grade. The transfer rule, is currently not in effect for any student between 8th and 9th grades, even if the 8th grader played varsity athletics at one school and enrolled in 9th grade at another school. Whether it should be in effect (Prop 2), is another story for another thread. The way that one could read Bylaw 10, is that you can have athletic specific recruitment of students below grade 9, because none of those students are able, by rule to become a transfer student, because they are not currently enrolled in a member school. So most of what a lot of us think is the recruiting of middle schoolers not being morally right, could be perfectly legal under Bylaw 10.

I feel smart...

 

In section 2, the word transfer may be the most important thing to look at. You are recruiting illegaly, by definition, if you attempt to influence a student to transfer to another member school for athletic reasons.

 

Well what does transfer really mean? I would say you would have to be enrolled at one member school, then leave and automatically enroll at another member school, for it to be called a transfer. It is not a transfer if one enrolls at any member school the first day of 9th grade, even if the student was not in a direct feeder school in 8th grade. The transfer rule, is currently not in effect for any student between 8th and 9th grades, even if the 8th grader played varsity athletics at one school and enrolled in 9th grade at another school. Whether it should be in effect (Prop 2), is another story for another thread. The way that one could read Bylaw 10, is that you can have athletic specific recruitment of students below grade 9, because none of those students are able, by rule to become a transfer student, because they are not currently enrolled in a member school. So most of what a lot of us think is the recruiting of middle schoolers not being morally right, could be perfectly legal under Bylaw 10.

 

Right, but section one covers any kid before they get to the high school level...

Right, but section one covers any kid before they get to the high school level...

 

Right, but section 1 doesn't define recruitment...only section 2 does and it specifically uses the word "transfer" to define. A student going from 8th grade to high school does not transfer, he enrolls. Moreover, Section 1 uses the phrase "any grade level", but doesn't specifically reference middle school kids. Since this is the Kentucky HIGH SCHOOL Athletic Association many would argue "any grade level" refers to any HIGH SCHOOL grade level. I've raised this before and I agree with covercorner.....It's ambiguous at best. Courts will always interpret ambiguities against the drafter, which in this case is the KHSAA. I'm sure the case studies they publish suggest the recruiting regs apply to middle school...but those case studies are not the letter of the law and would have little if any significance if challenged in court.

 

More than anything Sections 1 and 2 illustrate how poorly drafted, overly broad, and vague the regulations are that the KHSAA is supposed to enforce. They need to scrap the regs, start over and bring some common sense what evil they're trying to prevent.

Right, but section 1 doesn't define recruitment...only section 2 does and it specifically uses the word "transfer" to define. A student going from 8th grade to high school does not transfer, he enrolls. Moreover, Section 1 uses the phrase "any grade level", but doesn't specifically reference middle school kids. Since this is the Kentucky HIGH SCHOOL Athletic Association many would argue "any grade level" refers to any HIGH SCHOOL grade level. I've raised this before and I agree with covercorner.....It's ambiguous at best. Courts will always interpret ambiguities against the drafter, which in this case is the KHSAA. I'm sure the case studies they publish suggest the recruiting regs apply to middle school...but those case studies are not the letter of the law and would have little if any significance if challenged in court.

 

More than anything Sections 1 and 2 illustrate how poorly drafted, overly broad, and vague the regulations are that the KHSAA is supposed to enforce. They need to scrap the regs, start over and bring some common sense what evil they're trying to prevent.

 

Yup...

 

I guess I was thinking about my definition of recruiting, not the KHSAA's.

I have to think that a Varsity coach is sending text messages to a 6th grade boy's mom inquiring about where her son is going to attend high school when he is enrolled in a Catholic grade school would be considered a violation. I will leave it at that but its a fact.

I have to think that a Varsity coach is sending text messages to a 6th grade boy's mom inquiring about where her son is going to attend high school when he is enrolled in a Catholic grade school would be considered a violation. I will leave it at that but its a fact.

 

Doesn't sound like it is...

Right, but section 1 doesn't define recruitment...only section 2 does and it specifically uses the word "transfer" to define. A student going from 8th grade to high school does not transfer, he enrolls. Moreover, Section 1 uses the phrase "any grade level", but doesn't specifically reference middle school kids. Since this is the Kentucky HIGH SCHOOL Athletic Association many would argue "any grade level" refers to any HIGH SCHOOL grade level. I've raised this before and I agree with covercorner.....It's ambiguous at best. Courts will always interpret ambiguities against the drafter, which in this case is the KHSAA. I'm sure the case studies they publish suggest the recruiting regs apply to middle school...but those case studies are not the letter of the law and would have little if any significance if challenged in court.

 

More than anything Sections 1 and 2 illustrate how poorly drafted, overly broad, and vague the regulations are that the KHSAA is supposed to enforce. They need to scrap the regs, start over and bring some common sense what evil they're trying to prevent.

 

I agree that Bylaw 10 is pretty ambiguous, and there was a thread sometime back that posed the question of is it enforceable. Another thing to add, is that the recent violations, if they did not include a student that had transfered to another member school for athletic purposes, then there was not a violation(by the letter of the law) of Bylaw 10, but violations of other Bylaws occured. In other words, they were not recruting violations.

Doesn't sound like it is...

 

Trying to influence a catholic grade school kid to come to your school and play for you by sending mom text messages and inviting them down on the court and in the locker room after Varsity games IMO is wrong. Especially when the parent says she was freaked out by the text message.

Trying to influence a catholic grade school kid to come to your school and play for you by sending mom text messages and inviting them down on the court and in the locker room after Varsity games IMO is wrong. Especially when the parent says she was freaked out by the text message.

 

I don't disagree at all. Just doesn't look like it's covered in the "recruiting" bylaw...