What abuse actually happened? Did any American get indicted, get arrested, have their spouse find out they were cheating on them or any other bad thing happen to them due to the NSA Computers listening for "Certain Phrases and Code Words" used by terrorist cells targeting our country?

 

I mean seriously people do realize that no one is out there listening to each of our calls, right? No one is reading every text or email? Some Computer may be doing it, but I would even then bet that only those targeted for illegal activity are being monitored.

I have no problem with the government holding Snowden accountable for breaking laws - as soon as the government hold Obama, Holder, Clapper, Lois Lerner, and scores of other high level employees accountable for breaking federal laws.

 

Watching James Clapper and Eric Holder lie and obstruct justice with their antics during Congressional hearing and seeing them escape any consequences makes Snowden's crimes much more understandable.

 

Those who say that Snowden should have taken his concerns to a member of Congress instead of the media (and I am one of them) often underestimate the risk that would have required. I am not sure that any individual member of the Senate or House could have kept Snowden's information confidential even if they tried to do so.

Unfortunately it's not a this then that proposition (get Administration then get Snowden), no one in the Administration is going to fall based on what they have done. Unfortunately it's just doesn't happen that way anymore.

What abuse actually happened? Did any American get indicted, get arrested, have their spouse find out they were cheating on them or any other bad thing happen to them due to the NSA Computers listening for "Certain Phrases and Code Words" used by terrorist cells targeting our country?

 

I mean seriously people do realize that no one is out there listening to each of our calls, right? No one is reading every text or email? Some Computer may be doing it, but I would even then bet that only those targeted for illegal activity are being monitored.

 

You're actually 100% wrong.

 

Glenn Greenwald will be posting names of those in the United States the NSA has targeted.

What abuse actually happened? Did any American get indicted, get arrested, have their spouse find out they were cheating on them or any other bad thing happen to them due to the NSA Computers listening for "Certain Phrases and Code Words" used by terrorist cells targeting our country?

 

Would you like to make a bet?

 

I bet you I can create a bigger list of abuses exercised by the NSA than you can of the number of people directly or indirectly harmed by what Mr. Snowden or Glenn Greenwald released in the documents.

 

I mean, you can Google this stuff. Have you even tried?

You're actually 100% wrong.

 

Glenn Greenwald will be posting names of those in the United States the NSA has targeted.

 

I didn't say no one was targeted (so I'm not 100% wrong)...Have any of those names not yet released been arrested? If so what for? I'm sure a lot of people were targeted based on potential or possible threat information.

 

Most of that post is me asking questions, not declaring anything.

How come Senators and Congressmen get so upset when some one lies to THEM...:lol2:

 

He didn't just lie to Ron Wyden of Oregon. Those hearings are a form of accountability and oversight that serve as another check and balance in our system of Federalism.

 

When he lied, he lied to you. Are you not mad about that? How any person can claim to be a conservative and then have no issue with the largest intrusion by government is beyond me.

Would you like to make a bet?

 

I bet you I can create a bigger list of abuses exercised by the NSA than you can of the number of people directly or indirectly harmed by what Mr. Snowden or Glenn Greenwald released in the documents.

 

I mean, you can Google this stuff. Have you even tried?

 

I'm not sure what you are getting at, Snowden absolutely broke the law...no question about that.

 

NSA computers looked at private data, I never disputed that. I'm asking because I don't know...Who has actually been harmed by the NSA computers looking at text, emails or listening to our calls?

I didn't say no one was targeted (so I'm not 100% wrong)...Have any of those names not yet released been arrested? If so what for? I'm sure a lot of people were targeted based on potential or possible threat information.

 

Most of that post is me asking questions, not declaring anything.

 

I don't know. Hasn't been released. He gave a vague preview.

 

"Glenn Greenwald, one of the reporters who chronicled the document dump by National Security Agency leaker Edward Snowden via the U.K. press, now said he’s set to publish his most dramatic piece yet: The names of those in the United States targeted by the NSA.

“One of the big questions when is comes to domestic spying is, ‘Who have been the NSA’s specific targets?’ Are they political critics and dissidents and activists? Are they genuinely people we’d regard as terrorists? What are the metrics and calculations that go into choosing those targets and what is done with the surveillance that is conducted? Those are the kinds of questions that I want to still answer,” Mr. Greenwald told The Sunday Times of London."

 

 

Read more: Glenn Greenwald to publish list of U.S. citizens that NSA spied on - Washington Times

Follow us: @washtimes on Twitter

What abuse actually happened? Did any American get indicted, get arrested, have their spouse find out they were cheating on them or any other bad thing happen to them due to the NSA Computers listening for "Certain Phrases and Code Words" used by terrorist cells targeting our country?

 

I mean seriously people do realize that no one is out there listening to each of our calls, right? No one is reading every text or email? Some Computer may be doing it, but I would even then bet that only those targeted for illegal activity are being monitored.

The NSA does not have to listen to private conversations to invade our privacy. Think about how a corrupt politician like Holder or Obama, who have no respect for the Constitution, politicize the NSA as they have the IRS and Department of Justice. If a President or U.S. Senators from one political party had access to call logs of their political opponents, how long would it take an analyst to deduce who was cheating on spouses, had potential gambling issues, etc.?

 

Metadata is as dangerous in the wrong hands as actual recordings of private conversations. If the information can be correlated to individuals, and that is the point of gathering it, then it can be used to violate the privacy of American citizens. An anonymous call placed by a campaign staffer to a political opponent hinting that certain information might become public is all that it would take to muzzle political opponents.

 

The fact is that if what I described is being done, then we may never hear about it. All we will know that for some reason some candidate did not seem to really want to win an election.

I'm not sure what you are getting at, Snowden absolutely broke the law...no question about that.

 

NSA computers looked at private data, I never disputed that. I'm asking because I don't know...Who has actually been harmed by the NSA computers looking at text, emails or listening to our calls?

 

The law has protections for Whistleblowers. I'm not a lawyer, but there are many, including Glenn Greenwald, who would argue Snowden falls in that category.

 

Also, if I went through your mailbox, took a sensitive piece of mail that was from your wife or whoever, scanned the front, opened it, read it, scanned the letter in a big database so I could go back to and peruse at my discretion, fold it back up and put back in the mailbox, would you be harmed?

 

I have my right to privacy. And no one can take that away unless I get my day in court, by a jury of my peers.

 

Did that happen?

 

No. But they're doing what I just described in the above with my digital communications. Yours too.

He didn't just lie to Ron Wyden of Oregon. Those hearings are a form of accountability and oversight that serve as another check and balance in our system of Federalism.

 

When he lied, he lied to you. Are you not mad about that? How any person can claim to be a conservative and then have no issue with the largest intrusion by government is beyond me.

 

Yeah I'm ticked every time anyone lies under oath especially to Congress. I am a Conservative and have been for a loooong time.

 

Look at it this way...Some Cities have License Plate Readers mounted to read every plate that drives by a certain point in the city...it goes along every day doing this. Then there is a murder or some other crime committed and all of this data that has been collected is reviewed after the fact and the murderer is caught due to data collected. Well they were collecting data that could tell your daily travel patterns, data that could prove every day at 1:00p.m. you were going some where you should not be going but the only thing the data was used for was to catch this murderer. Is this an intrusion on your life or freedom?

The law has protections for Whistleblowers. I'm not a lawyer, but there are many, including Glenn Greenwald, who would argue Snowden falls in that category.

 

Also, if I went through your mailbox, took a sensitive piece of mail that was from your wife or whoever, scanned the front, opened it, read it, scanned the letter in a big database so I could go back to and peruse at my discretion, fold it back up and put back in the mailbox, would you be harmed?

 

I have my right to privacy. And no one can take that away unless I get my day in court, by a jury of my peers.

 

Did that happen?

 

No. But they're doing what I just described in the above with my digital communications. Yours too.

 

You assume that is happening to everyone and I would tell you I think it only happens to those that they have a reason to target. We neither one know for sure.

 

As far as having your day in court before a jury of your peers before your privacy is taken away, you are completely wrong. Judge can give a Warrant to read your mail, listen on your calls, bug your living room, track your car with GPS all without your knowledge or appearing in court or before a jury. In fact if nothing comes of it you may never even know it was even being done.

The NSA does not have to listen to private conversations to invade our privacy. Think about how a corrupt politician like Holder or Obama, who have no respect for the Constitution, politicize the NSA as they have the IRS and Department of Justice. If a President or U.S. Senators from one political party had access to call logs of their political opponents, how long would it take an analyst to deduce who was cheating on spouses, had potential gambling issues, etc.?

 

Metadata is as dangerous in the wrong hands as actual recordings of private conversations. If the information can be correlated to individuals, and that is the point of gathering it, then it can be used to violate the privacy of American citizens. An anonymous call placed by a campaign staffer to a political opponent hinting that certain information might become public is all that it would take to muzzle political opponents.

 

The fact is that if what I described is being done, then we may never hear about it. All we will know that for some reason some candidate did not seem to really want to win an election.

 

I agree 100% that it is a slippery slope and could be misused very easily. You keep bringing up the President and the AG, did you trust the last President and AG? The NSA was collecting the same data then as they are now. While I do trust President Bush a lot more than the current administration the same stuff was going on then.

 

Getting back to Snowden, he could have been a whistle blower all he wanted WITHOUT STEALING TOP SECRET documents. There are other ways he could have proven what was going on without doing that.

You assume that is happening to everyone and I would tell you I think it only happens to those that they have a reason to target. We neither one know for sure.

 

As far as having your day in court before a jury of your peers before your privacy is taken away, you are completely wrong. Judge can give a Warrant to read your mail, listen on your calls, bug your living room, track your car with GPS all without your knowledge or appearing in court or before a jury. In fact if nothing comes of it you may never even know it was even being done.

 

Again, you're incorrect. Edward Snowden is a household name because the documents he released have shown and prove the government is collecting and targeting Americans that have zero to do with terrorism and/or terrorist activities.

 

And they cannot get a warrant without suspicion and some merit.

 

With the massive spying apparatus the NSA has created through secrecy and lawlessness, they are doing everything in the example I gave but also everything you said a warrant allows. Except they don't have to go through a Judge to get a warrant.

Getting back to Snowden, he could have been a whistle blower all he wanted WITHOUT STEALING TOP SECRET documents. There are other ways he could have proven what was going on without doing that.

 

Once again, that's incorrect. Initially the NSA and the Federal Government lied again saying Edward Snowden didn't go through the proper channels that most whistleblowers go through.

 

He in fact did go to his superiors.

 

 

Snowden told interviewer Brian Williams: “I actually did go through channels, and that is documented. The NSA has records, they have copies of emails right now to their Office of General Counsel, to their oversight and compliance folks, from me raising concerns about the NSA’s interpretations of its legal authorities.

 

“The response, more or less, in bureaucratic language, was: ‘You should stop asking questions.'"

 

 

NSA releases email in dispute over Snowden 'internal whistleblowing' | World news | theguardian.com

 

 

Shortly after the interview, the NSA miraculously found the email he was talking about that prove his actions.