190 schools are wrong and just being vindictive . The problem only started when the privates started winning their share of Championships . Everything was alright when the public schools were dominant .:irked: I don't recall the privates complaining about that dominance .

 

I am glad that there are people on the private side making proposals and trying to address the issue and work through the issue rather than take your stance that there is no problem and your side is just wrong.

Level 1 = All schools

No Level 2

No Level 3

No Level 4

 

OK. Most think this is unfair.

 

How about:

 

Level 1 = Anyone who has won a state Championship in the last 20 years.

Level 2 = Any one who has ever won a state Championship in greater than 20 years plus all the runners up in the last 20 years.

Level 3 = Everyone else.

Level 4 = No one. We do not want to water this down.

What if we amended your proposal to:

 

Level 1 : Schools with 1600 or more students

Level 2 : Schools with 1000 to 1599 students

Level 3: Schools with 500 to 999 students

Level 4: Schools with 0 to 499 students

 

Level 5: Schools offering aid or open enrollment that accepts students more than 25 miles away and has 700 or more students

 

Level 6: Schools offering aid or open enrollment that accepts students more than 25 miles away and has 700 or less students

 

Think about what schools would fall into what level and would it change anything football-wise?

 

There are less than a handfull of schools that meet that requirement in KY. Unless you double the enrollment Trinity and St.X don't meet it either.

190 schools are wrong and just being vindictive . The problem only started when the privates started winning their share of Championships . Everything was alright when the public schools were dominant .:irked: I don't recall the privates complaining about that dominance .

 

 

The publics don't complain when the public schools win a big majority of the boys basketball titles. Seems to me they need to get off of their butts and put the same emphasis on football, girls basketball, etc. as they do in boys basketball. If they spent as much time doing that as they have trying to change the current system, maybe they'd win in those sports more often. No sympathy for those trying to change the system. None whatsoever.

The publics don't complain when the public schools win a big majority of the boys basketball titles. Seems to me they need to get off of their butts and put the same emphasis on football, girls basketball, etc. as they do in boys basketball. If they spent as much time doing that as they have trying to change the current system, maybe they'd win in those sports more often. No sympathy for those trying to change the system. None whatsoever.

 

The major problem on the girls' side is not just the system but society. (which is hard to change.) Girls' sports unfortunately is not given the same priority and emphasis in parents, in communities, in society as boys' sports are. Go to almost any sports league and I believe you will see many more teams than on the boys side than girls.

The major problem on the girls' side is not just the system but society. (which is hard to change.) Girls' sports unfortunately is not given the same priority and emphasis in parents, in communities, in society as boys' sports are. Go to almost any sports league and I believe you will see many more teams than on the boys side than girls.

 

 

I don't disagree with that, but there is no need for a change to the KHSAA because society just doesn't "get it". The system isn't a problem. Not a little; not a lot. And at some schools and in some communities, girls sports are given a lot of priority and emphasis. Its those schools that win and that's the way it should be. Highlands puts a lot of priority on girls soccer and we do just fine against the privates. Highlands puts a lot of priority on football and we do just fine against the privates. Show me any public school that makes a committment, a real over the long haul committment to a sport, and they will do just fine against the privates. Boys basketball proves that and I believe you know that. If your community doesn't place a real committment to girls basketball or volleyball or any other girls sport, then you don't change the system just to win some watered down competition. Heck, it becomes intermural sports when that happens. Either change the priority and the emphasis or accept that fact that you won't win and shouldn't win when you play those schools that provide that emphasis and priority.

 

Its almost embarrassing in my opinion to say that we need to separate those schools that are placing the priority and emphasis because my school doesn't or won't.

I don't disagree with that, but there is no need for a change to the KHSAA because society just doesn't "get it". The system isn't a problem. Not a little; not a lot. And at some schools and in some communities, girls sports are given a lot of priority and emphasis. Its those schools that win and that's the way it should be. Highlands puts a lot of priority on girls soccer and we do just fine against the privates. Highlands puts a lot of priority on football and we do just fine against the privates. Show me any public school that makes a committment, a real over the long haul committment to a sport, and they will do just fine against the privates. Boys basketball proves that and I believe you know that. If your community doesn't place a real committment to girls basketball or volleyball or any other girls sport, then you don't change the system just to win some watered down competition. Heck, it becomes intermural sports when that happens. Either change the priority and the emphasis or accept that fact that you won't win and shouldn't win when you play those schools that provide that emphasis and priority.

 

Its almost embarrassing in my opinion to say that we need to separate those schools that are placing the priority and emphasis because my school doesn't or won't.

 

I don't disagree with much of what you said. I do need to point out that my position as been that the division should be at open/closed enrollment rather than public and private. No different than the NCAA does.

 

DI and II are for those that are aggressively pursuing athletics and offering scholarships. While DIII does not. THe NCAA gives a division for those schools that are not aggressively pursuing athletics with $$.

 

I AM NOT IMPLYING that privates do. But for those school systems that want to offer open enrollment, one division. For those that don't, another.

 

Do you feel the NKU women's national title was watered down? Does Wilmington's DIII national title in women's basketball become watered down?

I don't think those involved will tell you they are any less proud of it.

I don't disagree with much of what you said. I do need to point out that my position as been that the division should be at open/closed enrollment rather than public and private. No different than the NCAA does.

 

DI and II are for those that are aggressively pursuing athletics and offering scholarships. While DIII does not. THe NCAA gives a division for those schools that are not aggressively pursuing athletics with $$.

 

I AM NOT IMPLYING that privates do. But for those school systems that want to offer open enrollment, one division. For those that don't, another.

 

Do you feel the NKU women's national title was watered down? Does Wilmington's DIII national title in women's basketball become watered down?

I don't think those involved will tell you they are any less proud of it.

 

If we are going to have two divisions, can we at least be honest about the naming of the two divisions: Committed and non-Committed?

If we are going to have two divisions, can we at least be honest about the naming of the two divisions: Committed and non-Committed?

 

So you feel DIII, Thomas More, Mt. St. Joseph, Transylvania, Centre are all non-Committed?

So you feel DIII, Thomas More, Mt. St. Joseph, Transylvania, Centre are all non-Committed?

 

 

Sure I do. They aren't committed to playing sports on a D1 level. NKU recently studied going to D1 in hoops. Once they discovered the level of committment (financial and otherwise) required, they said thanks, but no thanks.

Sure I do. They aren't committed to playing sports on a D1 level. NKU recently studied going to D1 in hoops. Once they discovered the level of committment (financial and otherwise) required, they said thanks, but no thanks.

 

I can agree with that. I do think that just because their commitment is lower does not diminish their accomplishments at the DIII level. Those schools at DIII look at the commitment and resources they have and say, we can't do that. We don't have the funds to compete against a Duke (Manual and Highlands), the facilities to compete against a UK (Trinity or St. X), the resources to compete against an IU or UNC (Lex Cath and Beechwood).

 

But we have all the resources, funds and facilities to compete against schools like us. So let them compete against schools like them. As NCAA does with DIII schools.

 

That has been what I am trying to say from the get go on this point.

If we are going to have two divisions, can we at least be honest about the naming of the two divisions: Committed and non-Committed?

Can NCC be in the division comitted to sports . maybe then we can play our esteemed neighbor in football again . Win or lose the competition against Highlands is always fun .

I can agree with that. I do think that just because their commitment is lower does not diminish their accomplishments at the DIII level. Those schools at DIII look at the commitment and resources they have and say, we can't do that. We don't have the funds to compete against a Duke (Manual and Highlands), the facilities to compete against a UK (Trinity or St. X), the resources to compete against an IU or UNC (Lex Cath and Beechwood).

 

But we have all the resources, funds and facilities to compete against schools like us. So let them compete against schools like them. As NCAA does with DIII schools.

 

That has been what I am trying to say from the get go on this point.

 

 

So the line of distinction is not open vs closed enrollment then. Its resources, funds and facilities.

 

 

Do you think the kids at your school really want to play in the non-Committed division? I may be wrong, but I'd bet they would feel strongly against doing that. They'd want the opportunity to play against the best, even if that meant losing.

 

And I think we need to point out the amount of funds, resources and facilities that most high schools have are probably on par (if not better) with those of Highlands, Beechwood, CovCath and NCC. Its really not funds, resources and facilities that separate the accomplishments of those schools. Its not open vs closed enrollment. Its not public vs private. Its work ethic and committment. Period.

 

I know that will upset a lot of people on here that want to find some other blame for their lack of success, but we need to start being honest with ourselves. Other than the dead period this past summer, the Highlands football players had 4 days, that's right 4 days, from the day school got out last spring to the first game when they weren't at that school doing some football related activity. No summer jobs. Very little hanging out on the corner with their buddies or at the mall. No staying out until midnight because they don't have football conditioning the next morning. My guess is that most of the perennial football powers do the same thing that Highlands does and its why they are good year in and year out, and don't only win when they are in some up talent cycle.

 

And when those perennial football powers play against programs that practice and condition a lot less all summer, the level of committment shows up on the scoreboard.

 

When my son was a freshman last year and we played Scott in the first game at Scott, a Scott parent was sitting behind me. Towards the end of the game I over heard him make a comment to the effect of "I can't believe how smooth Highlands looks in their first game". I turned around and asked him when Scott started football practice. He said 3 weeks ago. I told him we had been practicing almost every day (other than the dead period) since school had got out last spring. He couldn't believe it. He said the Scott coaches would never go for that as they like taking part of the summer off. Trust me, no coach on Highlands football staff takes the summer off. Neither do the kids. And that has nothing to do with funds, resources or facilities. It has everything to do with committment and work ethic. Again, I know that people don't want to hear that as they hate hearing that other kids and coaches work harder than their kids or coaches. But if you don't believe that happens, then I guess you don't believe that some teachers are more committed than other teachers; some lawyers work harder than other lawyers; some doctors care more about their patients than other doctors; some construction workers get more accomplished than other contruction workers or that some parents do a better job raising kids than others. But the simple truth is that all humans are not equal; some are more committed to their endeavors than others are. And those that are more committed succeed not just raising their kids, or on the job site, or in the office, or in the manufacturing plant, or in the board room, but also on the athletic playing field.

So the line of distinction is not open vs closed enrollment then. Its resources, funds and facilities.

 

 

Do you think the kids at your school really want to play in the non-Committed division? I may be wrong, but I'd bet they would feel strongly against doing that. They'd want the opportunity to play against the best, even if that meant losing.

 

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Why do kids choose to play DIII then? And no I don't think some kids care about playing against the best. In fact, some don't want to play the best and lose 76-0. They are out there to play and be a part of something that can be positive without HAVING to win a district, regional or state championship. I think parties on BOTH SIDES forget that HS Athletics IS NOT ABOUT WINNING STATE TITLES.

 

And I think we need to point out the amount of funds, resources and facilities that most high schools have are probably on par (if not better) with those of Highlands, Beechwood, CovCath and NCC. Its really not funds, resources and facilities that separate the accomplishments of those schools. Its not open vs closed enrollment. Its not public vs private. Its work ethic and committment. Period.

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I disagree. There is not enough wealth in a lot of rural counties through donations to fund an artificial turf football field like Highlands did. No Chris Collinsworth to lead the charge and not many like him that can financially do it. That is a huge benefit.

 

I know that will upset a lot of people on here that want to find some other blame for their lack of success, but we need to start being honest with ourselves. Other than the dead period this past summer, the Highlands football players had 4 days, that's right 4 days, from the day school got out last spring to the first game when they weren't at that school doing some football related activity. No summer jobs. Very little hanging out on the corner with their buddies or at the mall. No staying out until midnight because they don't have football conditioning the next morning. My guess is that most of the perennial football powers do the same thing that Highlands does and its why they are good year in and year out, and don't only win when they are in some up talent cycle.

 

And when those perennial football powers play against programs that practice and condition a lot less all summer, the level of committment shows up on the scoreboard.

 

When my son was a freshman last year and we played Scott in the first game at Scott, a Scott parent was sitting behind me. Towards the end of the game I over heard him make a comment to the effect of "I can't believe how smooth Highlands looks in their first game". I turned around and asked him when Scott started football practice. He said 3 weeks ago. I told him we had been practicing almost every day (other than the dead period) since school had got out last spring. He couldn't believe it. He said the Scott coaches would never go for that as they like taking part of the summer off. Trust me, no coach on Highlands football staff takes the summer off. Neither do the kids. And that has nothing to do with funds, resources or facilities. It has everything to do with committment and work ethic. Again, I know that people don't want to hear that as they hate hearing that other kids and coaches work harder than their kids or coaches. But if you don't believe that happens, then I guess you don't believe that some teachers are more committed than other teachers; some lawyers work harder than other lawyers; some doctors care more about their patients than other doctors; some construction workers get more accomplished than other contruction workers or that some parents do a better job raising kids than others. But the simple truth is that all humans are not equal; some are more committed to their endeavors than others are. And those that are more committed succeed not just raising their kids, or on the job site, or in the office, or in the manufacturing plant, or in the board room, but also on the athletic playing field.

 

I will not disagree with you at all here and battled with a baseball parent this weekend who was trying to tell me that parents of really talented baseball players say they don't put in time offseason. I called her on it and gave scenario after scenario to say does not happen that way.

 

And it drives me absolutely batty that they think I am crazy for putting in as they call it, "too much time" in trying to prepare these kids for the future.

 

But I do think that there are advantages out there. Look at Harrison County and golf. One 9 hole course that is a country club. So if you want to play golf, your parents have to fork over $1200 a year. Most families in Harrison County cannot do that. Where at NKY, Louisville, Lexington, etc schools they have multiple courses, practice ranges (Golf Ranch) to choose from. Look at swimming and diving. Big advantages to the urban areas and a main reason that you see so few swimming teams/clubs in the rural areas. Schools cannot afford a pool and business wise, it makes zero sense to build a swim club in a rural area.

 

So I take it with your post that you think the 3 divisions of the NCAA is a bad idea and Centre, TMC, Transy should compete against UK and be happy that they are competing against the best?

Can NCC be in the division comitted to sports . maybe then we can play our esteemed neighbor in football again . Win or lose the competition against Highlands is always fun .

 

And that attitude my friend goes a long way towards explaining NCC's success in athletics in spite of the fact the school doesn't have a lot of funds or resources and doesn't even have its own football field.