For the record, I have no firm grasp on this law. Others in here seem to which I find interesting.

 

We can't get experts to agree on its impact yet we BGPers seem to be expressing certitudes.

 

My point in jumping in was not to say it's great or it's the devil but, rather, to simply comment on the absurdity of the "broccoli" argument.

 

It doesn't take an expert to figure out someone is going to pay these extra cost the companies will take on and we know they aren't just going to eat that cost. It will get passed onto the customers.

It doesn't take an expert to figure out someone is going to pay these extra cost the companies will take on and we know they aren't just going to eat that cost. It will get passed onto the customers.

 

 

So in your mine and UKMF's mind there are only extra costs with this plan?

So in your mine and UKMF's mind there are only extra costs with this plan?

 

I'm sure every type of reform would generate extra cost but opening up state lines to let insurance companies compete would help control some of the cost passed onto the customer but that's not part of the bill.

I'm sure every type of reform would generate extra cost but opening up state lines to let insurance companies compete would help control some of the cost passed onto the customer but that's not part of the bill.

 

Not the question as it appears that will not happen.

 

Your claim is that without question costs will go up dramatically. You do not believe there will be savings at all? You think that an expanded pool of insured will not reduce premiums? You believe that the overall costs (taxes , deductibles, premiums) is only going to rise?

 

What will you base your answers on?

Not the question as it appears that will not happen.

 

Your claim is that without question costs will go up dramatically. You do not believe there will be savings at all? You think that an expanded pool of insured will not reduce premiums? You believe that the overall costs (taxes , deductibles, premiums) is only going to rise?

 

What will you base your answers on?

No not at all. My answers are based off my job. I work for an insurance company. We have memos, calls, announcements every week about it. You aren't just expanding the pool to an average number of people with average health concerns. For the most part you are expanding to people who aren't healthy (Not their fault always but it is what it is) and aren't able to get coverage right now. It would take a lot of healthy members to cancel out the cost of 1 cancer patient.

There is a number of different reasons rates go up and yes that is one but a small part of it. How do you know it's my company? If people are forced to buy insurance you will see a huge increase in the number of Dr visits. If you have to pay for something you might as well use it right? Not to mention the cost that a sick person (I'm not talking about colds) has on an insurance company that they will be forced to take. From day one that company has zero chance to make a profit on a good amount of the "new" customers it will be bringing in so someone will be making up the difference. That would be me and you.

 

 

I'm not going to sit here and defend insurance companies all day. Point being healthcare reform needs to happen and this isn't they way to get it done.

 

But you will see fewer visits to the emergency room for people who are deathly ill, because they will have taken care of that with their regular doctor visits, AND they will be paying into the insurance system.

 

My regular visits and my children's wellness visits prevent a lot of expensive medical care. Which costs more the flu shot or the 10 day 'zpac' type cure?

But you will see fewer visits to the emergency room for people who are deathly ill, because they will have taken care of that with their regular doctor visits, AND they will be paying into the insurance system.

 

My regular visits and my children's wellness visits prevent a lot of expensive medical care. Which costs more the flu shot or the 10 day 'zpac' type cure?

Are you able to get into your DR with a few days notice? I sure can't. ER/Urgent care will be the only option still. I understand what you are saying about preventative care. That part of the healthcare reform is great IMO.

Are you able to get into your DR with a few days notice? I sure can't. ER/Urgent care will be the only option still.

 

I can get in tomorrow to my GP and they're jammed each day.

No not at all. My answers are based off my job. I work for an insurance company. We have memos, calls, announcements every week about it. You aren't just expanding the pool to an average number of people with average health concerns. For the most part you are expanding to people who aren't healthy (Not their fault always but it is what it is) and aren't able to get coverage right now. It would take a lot of healthy members to cancel out the cost of 1 cancer patient.

 

 

Give me some numbers/%s as to the newly insured who didn't have it previously because of being in bad health vs those who didn't have it because they couldn't afford it.

Give me some numbers/%s as to the newly insured who didn't have it previously because of being in bad health vs those who didn't have it because they couldn't afford it.

 

Give me numbers that support this reform being cost effective?

Give me numbers that support this reform being cost effective?

 

 

Did you forget the part where I said I'm not qualified to make accurate declaratives?

Did you forget the part where I said I'm not qualified to make accurate declaratives?

 

But you are defending it? I'm telling you what I know based off information that has passed to me by a company to has a pretty good idea about how this will go down. I can't provide any data or material but I'm sure it can be found somewhere online.

 

Estimated cost over $1 Trillion over 10 years. Seems cost effective to me.

http://www.kff.org/uninsured/upload/7553.pdf

 

From 2003. My guess is as a whole our nations' health hasn't changed dramatically.

 

Of the non-elderly uninsured 60-63% were in excellent or very good health.

28% to 29% were in good health.

28% to 29% were in fair or poor health.

But you will see fewer visits to the emergency room for people who are deathly ill, because they will have taken care of that with their regular doctor visits, AND they will be paying into the insurance system.

 

My regular visits and my children's wellness visits prevent a lot of expensive medical care. Which costs more the flu shot or the 10 day 'zpac' type cure?

 

No way Acemona. Those that don't pay now are NOT going to start paying in the future for something they get for free now. Just take auto insurance as an example. That is a state law that you must have coverage in most states, yet there is a percentage of the population that drives around without it. For this reason most consumers carry uninsured/underinsured motorist coverage to protect against being hit by an unisured/underinsured motorist. At the end of the day-those responsible consumers pay more for their coverage to protect against those who don't or can't abide by the law. The same will be true of health coverage. Nobody that pays nothing now is going to even contribute $20 a month for the same going forward.

But you are defending it?

 

Incorrect. Hit your scroll bar and go back up. I'm saying none of us , including our reps, know enough to make an educated decision. Anything I put out there was simply to show that others are saying there are pros to offset your stated cons, thus, my point about certitudes.

 

I could do a point-counterpoint for any side I took on this.