Sorry I misspoke. I still would have an athletic trainer over a paramedic any day of the week for the same things I said.

 

Not me. I'd take a paramedic over a ATC in most situations. They have a greater range in trained skills.

Do you know of any statistics that show any correlation between AT's on site and healthier athletes? I assume that the two go hand and hand, but it may not necessarily be the case.

 

I'm still interested in these statistics, if anyone has them. I would say if there is a positive correlation between fewer injuries, fewer serious injuries or fewer deaths and the presence of an ATC, then those statistics should be out there and would make a strong case for having an ATC on staff.

This is virtual impossible. An athletic trainer has to have so many hours (800 contact hours) and then you have the nursing clinical hours. Plus on top of this, besides the basic science classes, the classes are very different. If someone really wanted to do this, I would say they would be in school for approximately 7 - 8 years and I am not sure many out there would want this.

 

Seems to me that the nurse would have already studied a great deal of the things an aspiring athletic trainer would. Not the physical therapy part, but definitely the diagnosis part.

Seems to me that the nurse would have already studied a great deal of the things an aspiring athletic trainer would. Not the physical therapy part, but definitely the diagnosis part.

 

I disagree. So I am guessing the nurse studies how to evaluate a knee and know how to test for meniscus, ACL, PCL, MCL & LCL tears in the knees? Or know how to test to see what ligaments are torn in an ankle. I am guessing you also think they know how to evaluate an elbow to see if the athlete has for an UCL? If you know a nurse, why don't you ask him/her. That is like saying an athletic trainer knows how to help in the OR or know how to wash a patient properly. NOT HAPPENING!

I disagree. So I am guessing the nurse studies how to evaluate a knee and know how to test for meniscus, ACL, PCL, MCL & LCL tears in the knees? Or know how to test to see what ligaments are torn in an ankle. I am guessing you also think they know how to evaluate an elbow to see if the athlete has for an UCL? If you know a nurse, why don't you ask him/her. That is like saying an athletic trainer knows how to help in the OR or know how to wash a patient properly. NOT HAPPENING!

 

Lighten up, Francis. I'm just asking questions here.

 

And besides, not every injury is as extreme as ligament tears -- those are actually fairly uncommon in comparison to sprains and such. Plus, rarely do I ever hear an athletic trainer definitively say, "It's torn." More like, "I think it could be torn. Won't know for sure until a specialist looks at it." Again, it seems to me that a nurse would have a higher threshold of education/training in diagnosis to achieve than an athletic trainer would. Obviously, the physical therapy part would be over and above what school nurses get in their standard nursing degree, but they do have the diagnosis part already under their belts (unless you're suggesting that it's not possible for anyone but an athlete to tear a ligament, because you're acting as though a school nurse would never see such things).

 

Seems like in this day and age of shrinking school budgets, getting more bang for your buck from the school nurse would be a money-saving opportunity rather than having to contract out for the athletic trainer in addition to what the nurse is already being paid.

Lighten up, Francis. I'm just asking questions here.

 

And besides, not every injury is as extreme as ligament tears -- those are actually fairly uncommon in comparison to sprains and such. Plus, rarely do I ever hear an athletic trainer definitively say, "It's torn." More like, "I think it could be torn. Won't know for sure until a specialist looks at it." Again, it seems to me that a nurse would have a higher threshold of education/training in diagnosis to achieve than an athletic trainer would. Obviously, the physical therapy part would be over and above what school nurses get in their standard nursing degree, but they do have the diagnosis part already under their belts (unless you're suggesting that it's not possible for anyone but an athlete to tear a ligament, because you're acting as though a school nurse would never see such things).

 

Seems like in this day and age of shrinking school budgets, getting more bang for your buck from the school nurse would be a money-saving opportunity rather than having to contract out for the athletic trainer in addition to what the nurse is already being paid.

 

I am fine and dandy. I think you need to really know what an athletic trainer does on a daily basis compared to what a school nurse does because to be honest, there is nothing to compare them. The only likeness is they are in the medical field.

 

By the way you were the one who said this: "Seems to me that the nurse would have already studied a great deal of the things an aspiring athletic trainer would. Not the physical therapy part, but definitely the diagnosis part."

 

My point is, they do not study on how to evaluate an injury like what you think. Why don't you ask a nurse if they can properly evaluate a shoulder, ankle, knee properly and be able to talk to a doctor and tell them what they think it is. They simply do not have the schooling as an athletic trainer, just like an athletic trainer (most of them) cannot tell some of the things a nurse does in a hospital. They are 2 totally different professions!

And besides, not every injury is as extreme as ligament tears -- those are actually fairly uncommon in comparison to sprains and such. Plus, rarely do I ever hear an athletic trainer definitively say, "It's torn." More like, "I think it could be torn. Won't know for sure until a specialist looks at it."

 

I've never heard an ATC diagnose a torn ligament. As you said, there's always, "well, it might be torn. See a specialist."

I've never heard an ATC diagnose a torn ligament. As you said, there's always, "well, it might be torn. See a specialist."

 

The guy that runs the AT program at EKU told me they do diagnose.

I am not knocking the nursing profession but in my opinion it is two totally different professions. All I am saying is I do not see any nurse doing what an athletic trainer does and to be honest, I do not see an athletic trainer doing what a nurse does in the SCHOOL SETTING.

 

If I had children, and he/she was injured on the field, the first person I would want him or her to see is the athletic trainer, they are trained to evaluate on field injuries. If I had to have a child back boarded I would want a paramedic to do it and the ATHLETIC TRAINER. They are trained in it. If I had a sick child at school I would want them to see the nurse but if I had a child who hurt his/her knee I would want them to see the athletic trainer.

 

Also, if you would like a guide to athletic training services check it out here.

The guy that runs the AT program at EKU told me they do diagnose.

 

I've never heard of a doctor diagnosing one without ordering an MRI.

Sorry I misspoke. I still would have an athletic trainer over a paramedic any day of the week for the same things I said.

I really don't think you are aware of what a Paramedic is. A Paramedic can, and does, perform procedures and assessments that no other health care provided can perform, except a doctor. A Paramedic has, on the average, over 1500 clock hours of education in medical management and emergency care. An Athletic Trainer is no where near the level of care as a paramedic. Not close even.

 

With that said, I still would like to see both an Athletic Trainer and a Paramedic staffed ambulance at every game. Even with the level of care of a Paramedic, the Trainers do a specific set of training regiments over the long term for more minor injuries.

Not me. I'd take a paramedic over a ATC in most situations. They have a greater range in trained skills.

Exactly.

The guy that runs the AT program at EKU told me they do diagnose.

 

They do diagnose, based on assessment. But, the only way for a Trainer, or nurse, or paramedic, or doctor, to diagnose with 100% accuracy a torn ligament, is with a MRI. Just like, a fracture can be diagnosed by exam, but to really know the extent of the injury you must have a X-Ray.

 

Assessment based management is common and needed, but some diagnoses requires study, be it X-Ray, lab values, or other form.

I've never heard of a doctor diagnosing one without ordering an MRI.

 

No question. My point is that ATCs are trained to diagnose. The athlete would still go to a specialist for the official word.

They do diagnose, based on assessment. But, the only way for a Trainer, or nurse, or paramedic, or doctor, to diagnose with 100% accuracy a torn ligament, is with a MRI. Just like, a fracture can be diagnosed by exam, but to really know the extent of the injury you must have a X-Ray.

 

Assessment based management is common and needed, but some diagnoses requires study, be it X-Ray, lab values, or other form.

 

Agreed.

We should not be debating ATC vs EMT-P. Both are highly skilled. However, the EMT-P , if employed in EMS, does not have the ability to be there every day for every practice and every game. That's why schools have ATCs.