David McAtee Shooting

[halfback20]

At least we have clarity on whether or not McAtee fired his weapon.

 

LMPD/National Guard still initiated this confrontation, and McAtee was killed defending his business.

 

Are you okay with him firing wildly into the streets towards police, National guard and possibly others?

[TheDeuce]

Are you okay with him firing wildly into the streets towards police, National guard and possibly others?

 

His business and the people outside it were shot at first, so yes. Is that an ideal reaction? No, but I certainly understand.

[Bluegrasscard]

David McAtee shot dead by National Guard officer, not an LMPD officer, state investigators say

 

This was basically obvious from the video(s).

 

The woman was "armed" with a paintball gun. The NGuardsmen were backup with lethal weapons. She backed off to the other side of the street and the NG then continued the engagement.

 

I would like to know where and why the first noticeable round comes into the group while the police are still across the street and closing in on the residence. A round from a rifle or a paintball gun definitely comes from the police and NG to start this incident.

[halfback20]

His business and the people outside it were shot at first, so yes. Is that an ideal reaction? No, but I certainly understand.

 

Shot at with what?

[halfback20]

This was basically obvious from the video(s).

 

The woman was "armed" with a paintball gun. The NGuardsmen were backup with lethal weapons. She backed off to the other side of the street and the NG then continued the engagement.

 

I would like to know where and why the first noticeable round comes into the group while the police are still across the street and closing in on the residence. A round from a rifle or a paintball gun definitely comes from the police and NG to start this incident.

 

They said today police or national guard did not fire anything but pepper balls until Mcatee came to the door shooting, at which time they retreated and took cover. He came back for a second round, and that is when they returned fire.

[halfback20]

Shot at with what?

 

Let's say police fired pepper balls at his business first. That may be true. It isn't justification to kill them, national guard or innocent people around.

 

He responded with gunfire. Police stopped shooting pepper balls and took cover along with the national guard.

 

He started shooting again.

 

Why did he do that? They stopped shooting pepper balls and had not fired a single round of gunfire at him.

[TheDeuce]

Let's say police fired pepper balls at his business first. That may be true. It isn't justification to kill them, national guard or innocent people around.

 

He responded with gunfire. Police stopped shooting pepper balls and took cover along with the national guard.

 

He started shooting again.

 

Why did he do that? They stopped shooting pepper balls and had not fired a single round of gunfire at him.

 

What justification did the cops have to shoot at the people outside the business??

 

There is no “may be” true. They shot pepper balls at/towards the business and people outside it twice before McAtee allegedly shot back. It doesn’t matter what the police shot at them with, especially when they had no business shooting at them in the first place.

 

Police can’t just go around shooting at people, with anything, just because they want to. Then shoot at somebody and expect them not to shoot back? Please... get over yourselves.

 

Police instigated this situation, as usual.

[Bluegrasscard]

They said today police or national guard did not fire anything but pepper balls until Mcatee came to the door shooting, at which time they retreated and took cover. He came back for a second round, and that is when they returned fire.

 

I have so many issues with this situation that it is hard to focus on individual elements. By the time the last few seconds of the event occurred it seemed a lot went wrong with LEO (collective police and National Guard) tactics and actions.

 

- LEO initiates firing (live rounds or pepperball makes zero difference)

- LEO does this from a distance on a family that is obviously and clearly not engaged in riots, looting, etc.

- LEO engages at short distance (right at property line) after everyone is now in the residence. Do not really care if its pepperballs or live rounds. To someone engaged with the attackers (that is what LEO was at this point) the type of projectiles is not something to analyze in real time.

- LEO made their approach with numerous obsticles in the way between them and house door where the family and friends took cover. A fence, a high top with cans on it, tent, car. Thus, who they were, what they were shooting and why they were there may have all been hard to decipher in real time.

- There is a lot of firing from LEO during the engagement. You can see sparks from live rounds hitting things. The tent ruffles.

 

In general, LEO forced an armed aggressive engagement that seemed completely unnecessary. A man was killed IN HIS OWN HOME. And when he was killed he was not being detained, he was not being served a warrant, he was not in commission of a crime, he was not resisting arrest. He was defending his family from an assault on his home, business and family members.

[halfback20]

What justification did the cops have to shoot at the people outside the business??

 

There is no “may be” true. They shot pepper balls at/towards the business and people outside it twice before McAtee allegedly shot back. It doesn’t matter what the police shot at them with, especially when they had no business shooting at them in the first place.

 

Police can’t just go around shooting at people, with anything, just because they want to. Then shoot at somebody and expect them not to shoot back? Please... get over yourselves.

 

Police instigated this situation, as usual.

 

I don't know why they shot non lethal pepper balls but that doesn't give anyone an excuse to try and murder them, even if they were initially wrong.

 

Never mind the fact that they stopped and he came out to shoot a second time.

 

So one or two misplaced pepper balls = a death sentence in your opinion? You are OK with him killing police and National Guard over something that burns a little?

 

Are you saying you think business owners should be allowed to kill looters then?

[TheDeuce]

I don't know why they shot non lethal pepper balls but that doesn't give anyone an excuse to try and murder them, even if they were initially wrong.

 

Never mind the fact that they stopped and he came out to shoot a second time.

 

So one or two misplaced pepper balls = a death sentence in your opinion? You are OK with him killing police and National Guard over something that burns a little?

 

Are you saying you think business owners should be allowed to kill looters then?

 

Yes, business owners would be justified in shooting looters, IF those looters were shooting at them.

 

Police shot at the building twice before they received any return fire.

 

Again. Cops can't just go shooting at whoever they want, whenever they want, and not expect anyone to shoot back. Especially in a part of town where gunfire, random and intentional, happens all the time.

 

Lethal or non-lethal is irrelevant. They shot at innocent people for absolutely no reason, and one of those people defended themselves. Are you saying McAtee shouldn't have defended his business and family?

 

If McAtee had shot pepper bullets at police, you expect me to believe wouldn't say police would be justified in using lethal rounds?

[halfback20]

I have so many issues with this situation that it is hard to focus on individual elements. By the time the last few seconds of the event occurred it seemed a lot went wrong with LEO (collective police and National Guard) tactics and actions.

 

- LEO initiates firing (live rounds or pepperball makes zero difference)

- LEO does this from a distance on a family that is obviously and clearly not engaged in riots, looting, etc.

- LEO engages at short distance (right at property line) after everyone is now in the residence. Do not really care if its pepperballs or live rounds. To someone engaged with the attackers (that is what LEO was at this point) the type of projectiles is not something to analyze in real time.

- LEO made their approach with numerous obsticles in the way between them and house door where the family and friends took cover. A fence, a high top with cans on it, tent, car. Thus, who they were, what they were shooting and why they were there may have all been hard to decipher in real time.

- There is a lot of firing from LEO during the engagement. You can see sparks from live rounds hitting things. The tent ruffles.

 

In general, LEO forced an armed aggressive engagement that seemed completely unnecessary. A man was killed IN HIS OWN HOME. And when he was killed he was not being detained, he was not being served a warrant, he was not in commission of a crime, he was not resisting arrest. He was defending his family from an assault on his home, business and family members.

 

A pepper ball gun sounds nothing like a real gun. Not even close.

 

He was in the commission of a crime. He was shooting wildly into the street at police, national guard and any innocent bystanders.

 

That's several crimes.

 

I dont know why police shot pepper balls and you don't either. You don't know what exactly happened based on one view from outside.

 

Law enforcement fired their guns the second time he shot at them. What excuse can you make for him trying to kill them the second time? Everyone has retreated and took cover and were no longer shooting anything.

 

I would bet everyone that ran inside knew who was there and what they were doing. You think none of them said who or what was going on while they were coming in?

[halfback20]

I don't know why they shot non lethal pepper balls but that doesn't give anyone an excuse to try and murder them, even if they were initially wrong.

 

Again. Cops can't just go shooting at whoever they want, whenever they want, and not expect anyone to shoot back. Especially in a part of town where gunfire, random and intentional, happens all the time.

 

Lethal or non-lethal is irrelevant, they shot at innocent people for absolutely no reason, and one of those people defended themselves. Are you saying McAtee shouldn't have defended his business and family?

 

If McAtee had shot pepper bullets at police, you expect me to believe wouldn't say police would be justified in using lethal rounds?

 

I dont know why they were there or why they shot pepper balls but it doesn't justify trying to kill them.

 

Yea I am most definitely saying he shouldn't have shot a gun at police and National Guard to defend his family from possibly a little uncomfortable burning. He would be alive today if he didn't do that. I think he'd be alive if he didn't come out shooting a second time.

 

 

Should business owners be able to kill looters?

[TheDeuce]

He was in the commission of a crime. He was shooting wildly into the street at police, national guard and any innocent bystanders.

 

That's several crimes.

 

No one was committing a crime when police shot TWO times at people outside the business. That's BEFORE anybody shot back at them.

 

I dont know why police shot pepper balls and you don't either. You don't know what exactly happened based on one view from outside.

 

Law enforcement fired their guns the second time he shot at them. What excuse can you make for him trying to kill them the second time? Everyone has retreated and took cover and were no longer shooting anything.

 

I would bet everyone that ran inside knew who was there and what they were doing. You think none of them said who or what was going on while they were coming in?

 

So we don't know exactly why police shot at them, but you know that the people inside the business knew exactly who were shooting at them, why, and where from? Just stop.

[TheDeuce]

 

I dont know why they were there or why they shot pepper balls but it doesn't justify trying to kill them.

 

Yea I am most definitely saying he shouldn't have shot a gun at police and National Guard to defend his family from possibly a little uncomfortable burning. He would be alive today if he didn't do that. I think he'd be alive if he didn't come out shooting a second time.

 

 

Should business owners be able to kill looters?

 

What is the justification for police shooting at them twice?

 

He would be alive today if the cops didn't instigate a problem that wasn't there.

 

Yes, business owners should be able to kill looters IF the looters shoot at them.

[halfback20]

No one was committing a crime when police shot TWO times at people outside the business. That's BEFORE anybody shot back at them.

 

 

 

So we don't know exactly why police shot at them, but you know that the people inside the business knew exactly who were shooting at them, why, and where from? Just stop.

 

There was a large group of police and National Guard outside. You think no one knew who they were? Just stop.

 

Didn't you initially say there was no gun and all he had was tongs?

 

Why does it matter who they are? You apparently think a couple pepper balls equals a death sentence regardless of who did it.