Lipton, you've posted your concerns. What is your solution? No more police raids? No more search warrants without calling ahead first? What?

 

Here's the deal. Crap happens. Unless your ready to give cops nothing but a whistle innocent people will be killed by mistake. You guys continue to post articles about raids gone bad but whats the time period these stretch over? How many innocent people are killed each year from bad raids? I know the PC thing to say is 1 is too many but if you think 0 is ever going to happen your living in lala land. I'm not trying to be disrespectful but it is the cold hard truth.

 

I would like to get away from where the system has been heading. Which is more of a focus on enforcement and security, instead of on civil liberties. In a system where we are suppose to be innocent until proven guilty, we have a society where we treat citizens as criminals. Whether its in NYC with a camera on every corner, or raids that results in the harm of innocent people. At the very least I would want more accountability. Instead of when police make mistakes and say "oops our bad" response. Anyone in leadership who was in charge of a botched raid should be punished.

 

We as society are driven on fear . I would like to see the use of SWAT to be cut down a lot. Quit using SWAT for non-violent offenses all together. Do I have all the answer nope. But like any other subject I raise concern on , it doesn't eliminate the validity of the concern. If innocent people have died and will continue to die in the future in the current system why is it so crazy to have concern? Police saftey is a concern, but not above a innocent citizen.

 

Military vehichles should not be owned by local police forces. That should be Federal Law Enforcement job to deal with terrorism. Local police should police local crimes.

 

I do recall in the gun rights thread how many of you who I sided with on the topic, cited the fact that a majority of murders in this country are done by handguns. I'm fine with police having AR-15's and similar weapons. But if this is the case why do police need so much artillery when its obvious most criminals aren't committing crimes with military grade weapons. How often is a local agency going to use a BEARCAT or other armored vehichles on legitmate circumstances. Does the ROI for local citizens really make these purchases economically feasible.

 

On this topic I always go back to the thought process of understanding history. There is a reason our founding fathers did not want military policing our streets. I'm sorry if some of you don't find it valid for some of us to have concerns that our local law enforcement is starting to look more like our military. But it does concern me. It is my job as a citizen to raise concern anytime I think civil liberties are being infringed. Our system was not built to make it easier on cops to arrest people, it was built to safe guard freedom.

Lipton, you've posted your concerns. What is your solution? No more police raids? No more search warrants without calling ahead first? What?

 

Here's the deal. Crap happens. Unless your ready to give cops nothing but a whistle innocent people will be killed by mistake. You guys continue to post articles about raids gone bad but whats the time period these stretch over? How many innocent people are killed each year from bad raids? I know the PC thing to say is 1 is too many but if you think 0 is ever going to happen your living in lala land. I'm not trying to be disrespectful but it is the cold hard truth.

 

duplicate

 

First you have yet to have a point except every who disagree's with you is wrong and none of us understand.

 

Second thank you for the point on Doctors proves my point even more. When you have a procedure done the doctor lets you no the risk invovled. If the doctor had malpractice he will be sued and lose in the court of law. With swat raids when the police do not announce their presence innocent civilians are not warned of any risk invovled. Even more so it's a lot less likley for a civilian to win any complaint against an officer whether it be criminal or civil is much more unlikley than a civilian winning against a doctor.

 

Another problem I have with how Swat teams are used these days. Are these pranks calls called "swatting", some moron calls in a threat on a homeowner who has no clue whats going on and puts a lot of people in harms way because there is little verification done before police are on the scene. I don't know think anyone has died from a "swatting" call yet but the increased calls and some of the situations people have been put it does concern me. I don't think that is a crazy concern.

 

Also why did I bring economics up? Well sir that is what people call an analogy. Economics isn't the topic but I was using an example of how other people site opinions and idea on this site through links.

 

Last but not least would I classify myself as a SWAT team expert, by no means. But I'm educated enough and done enough research to form an opinion and have some concern. You may not like my opinion or agree with my opinion . But it has validity .

 

Do you even know what an analogy is? "I'm a Milton Friedman disciple." Is not an analogy.

 

As a a matter of fact I don't see where you've posted anywhere that your knowledge of economics or poly sci in any kind of analogy.

 

"Working in economics is like working in policing in that we both know it all" That sir is an analogy in case you needed an example. And sorry but I will not discuss policies as there is too much liability at stake and you sir are far from worth that headache. I don't need to prove you're clueless, that's evident and I'm fully aware you are uniformed on tactics and department policies. That my friend is "no debate."

 

duplicate

 

I'm just curious, and you don't have to answer if you don't want, but what's your age range/background. 2nd year poly sci student? An elected official? Banker? You're an expert on a lot so I'm just curious if it's 40-50 years of life experience or a narrow minded college kid who has bought into liberalism in college with 110% of their being.

I'm just curious, and you don't have to answer if you don't want, but what's your age range/background. 2nd year poly sci student? An elected official? Banker? You're an expert on a lot so I'm just curious if it's 40-50 years of life experience or a narrow minded college kid who has bought into liberalism in college with 110% of their being.

 

30 something, multiple college degrees. Work in finance industry now but I have experience in different areas including government. Its almost hilarious reading your posts . Im guessing I've lived and worked in much more diverse groups and areas than you. I'm probably higher educated . Its almost sad the way you go about having discussions . Your profession deserves to be scrutinized as any other public position deserves it.

Edited August 20, 201313 yr by LIPTON BASH

30 something multiple degrees. Work in finance industry now but I have experience in different areas including government. Its almost hilarious reading your posts . Im guessing I've lived and worked in much more diverse groups and areas than you. I'm probably higher educated . Its almost sad the way you go about having discussions . Your profession deserves to be scrutinized as any other public position deserves it.

30 college degrees? Wow

 

Passing off others idea? Really? You can't attack the message again attack me. It is becoming quite sad to see you attempt to debate. Anytime someone researches a topic their opinions are influenced by that research. When it comes to economics I'm a Milton Friedman disciple. But because a majority of my ideas are influenced by him it does not make my points any less relevant. .

Yep looks like an analogy. Lol. Getting sad little guy

I'm just curious, and you don't have to answer if you don't want, but what's your age range/background. 2nd year poly sci student? An elected official? Banker? You're an expert on a lot so I'm just curious if it's 40-50 years of life experience or a narrow minded college kid who has bought into liberalism in college with 110% of their being.

 

Its funny hearing you call me a liberal. Most my democrat friends would laugh.

 

But since we are taking back handing shots. Let me guess you became a cop because of the large amount of swirles you received as a child. Got your feelings hurt one to many time for getting picked last in dodge ball on the playground. Now you sit behind a keyboard and your badge miserable and depressed because life has passed you buy and its not that your a hasben your a never was. Have fun continuing to try to convince people you are and intelligent when you can't debate without name calling.

Yep looks like an analogy. Lol. Getting sad little guy

 

:lol2: 30 something? I think there's a Brad Paisly song about stuff like your posts. 30 something degrees and cites Wikipedia...

30 college degrees? Wow

 

Forgot a comma. I apologize. See rocket you can admit a mistake.

 

Its funny hearing you call me a liberal. Most my democrat friends would laugh.

 

But since we are taking back handing shots. Let me guess you became a cop because of the large amount of swirles you received as a child. Got your feelings hurt one to many time for getting picked last in dodge ball on the playground. Now you sit behind a keyboard and your badge miserable and depressed because life has passed you buy and its not that your a hasben your a never was. Have fun continuing to try to convince people you are and intelligent when you can't debate without name calling.

 

Actually my life is quite awesome but thanks for playing new guy. Keep flapping those fingers. You're only making yourself look silly

:lol2: 30 something? I think there's a Brad Paisly song about stuff like your posts. 30 something degrees and cites Wikipedia...

 

Fixed it little guy. Now you want to bring substance ? Or continue to look like a bitter angry unintelligent old man

 

Its funny hearing you call me a liberal. Most my democrat friends would laugh.

 

But since we are taking back handing shots. Let me guess you became a cop because of the large amount of swirles you received as a child. Got your feelings hurt one to many time for getting picked last in dodge ball on the playground. Now you sit behind a keyboard and your badge miserable and depressed because life has passed you buy and its not that your a hasben your a never was. Have fun continuing to try to convince people you are and intelligent when you can't debate without name calling.

 

What names have I called you? Just curious!

 

Forgot a comma. I apologize. See rocket you can admit a mistake.

 

What are you talking about? :lol2:

Actually my life is quite awesome but thanks for playing new guy. Keep flapping those fingers. You're only making yourself look silly

 

I'm the one who looks silly OK.You need to calm down . Get all flustered when you disagree. First sign of lack of ability to communicate.