cooperstown

Not technically true. There is nothing that legally prevents police from controlling these matters or filling charges. It's not as if a sports arena is somehow beyond police jurisdiction, but simply a matter of practice that police let the sports teams "police" themselves. But there certainly have been occasions where criminal charges were filed against athletes for their conduct on the field/court/ice. Rare, but it happens.

There's always a first time when you set a precedence. Because it's never happened before doesn't mean it can't happen or shouldn't happen. And while I know it wasn't your intent, "yapping" rather minimizes the totality and seriousness of Holloway's actions. Not trying to be nitpicky or get into semantics debate with you - I don't have the IQ to fight that battle - but Holloway's actions were more than "yapping." Oh, and don't ask me to come up with another word for it - got other things on my mind right now.

You think? :lol:

Our think our definition of "nailing" kids and "holding them accountable" must differ somewhat, which surprises me since I've always deemed you semi-intelligent. I am left with this feeling that you want to minimize the seriousness of their actions. Frease could have been hurt very badly. Sure, he wasn't, but what if the blow or stomp landed in just such a way to really injury his eye and maybe end his career? Perhaps landing the sucker punch 2 inches higher could have made the injury much worse? More serious punishment warranted then? I say no. It was the intent of the punch, the egregious manner of some of these players' behavior, the lack of remorse, the pride over participating/instigating it. "Nailing" a kid would be telling Holloway his season is over. One game? Not sure that conveys that strong of a statement or effects any major attitude change. We'll disagree on this I suppose. I get tired of all the showmanship, one-upmanship, selfishness, me-first bravado, smack talk. A little is fine, I guess, but it's just too entirely commonplace and over-the-top these days. I don't think anyone is being "nailed" here. I think they're being held responsible for some outrageous and, quite frankly, criminal behavior. Period.

He's old enough to know the emotions that certain words convey and evoke in people. There simply are certain words/phrases you just don't use in certain settings. I don't care whether he's from the tough streets of New York where the word is much more common and accepted. It was one part of the totality of his offensive tone and words and that he was quite proud of helping to cause and participate in the brawl. He's a thug. Excellent ballplayer, but a thug and a punk and he deserved a minimum 3-game suspension.

And potentially VERY embarrassing if those players aren't extremely humble and don't articulate themselves fairly well.

Is the UC player in the warmup jacket jawing with Lyons at the end of the half Octavius Ellis? He was the first guy off UC's bench to rush the floor and takes a montrous slug at someone right off the bat. Kid is remarkably mouthy for someone who has played all of 25 minutes this year. If I'm Cronin, I have to question whether I want to put up with four years of this punk.

Agree with Clyde. I hope your wish come true. If I could have one, I'd love to spend one more hour with my Dad. Died in April 2008. The suddeness of his cancer (pancreatic) caught us offguard. I had even purchased some Diamond Club seats for my brother and I to go to one last game together and never got to use them. I'd like to sit with him for a few more minutes and say a few things that I struggled to get out of my mouth while he was on his death bed. A regret I'll take to my grave....

Gates is too short. You'll be in the vast minority if you feel it's appropriate. Actually, you might be the only one to think that. I'm going to believe Cronin's comments at the time were sincere, not duplicitous or contrived, and truly came from the heart. To me anyways, there was nothing about his statements that didn't appear genuine. Believing such, I now have to reconcile why the punishment did not fit his statements. He was either persuaded by those above him or the outlook of a miserable season becoming more miserable and potentially affecting his job security. If the latter, a true shame and the definition of selling out.

They are not going to see an attendance bump until the year following a successful season. People want to be convinced first. But, to date anyways, I still think you have to say there have been some marked improvements and some cause to be hopeful looking forward. We really haven't even had that in the past few years.

I agree. I don't know that you can toss this loss in Brown's lap. The Bengals certainly seem headed in the right direction. What worries me is how Brown handles the mandate next year to spend up to the salary cap max.

Kilpatrick's comments were typical pre-game bravado and bluster. Not smart to say - only adds corkboard fodder and motivation for opponent - but hardly qualfies as suspendable language/conduct.

Well it's not really as though they had an option not to do something. The "something" that they did do was underwhleming, to say the least.

Did they really just give up 300 yards passing to the incomparable TJ Yates????

So is the alleged Frease post-game incident determined to have been inaccurate?

Both teams sold out. Both afraid to hand out just suspensions to their "superstars." Win/loss record trumps right/wrong.

I'm not overwhelmed. Public apologies and community service seem a disingenuous way to enable UC to lessen the number of games they (specifically, Gates) sit out. That was going to happen no matter what the suspension was. Mick can imply they still won't come back after the suspension until he's convinced they've fully learned from their mistake and the value of playing at UC, but let's be realistic - they are coming back after six games. Whether this was more Cronin's doing or someone with the administration, UC screwed this one up after doing and saying all the right things yesterday.

The thing about being on camera is important. It doesn't make the actions any worse, but does mean they are wholly verifiable and you don't have to solely use statements and interpretations of sometimes-unreliable and biased witnesses. Trust me, go into court sometime with eyewitness testimony only. While still compelling, you show a jury videotape and they see it for their own eyes and it's huge. Are Ellis' punches on tape? The problem I have with Gates is that he has been a problem child in the past. Just like a defendent's past criminal history affects his sentencing, I think this should have been factored in and that alone should have elevated Gate's discipline above the others.

Did he want stronger suspensions?

GT, based on your opinion or what you have heard, who at UC had the most input into the final decision? I find it hard to believe it would breakdown 33/33/33 between Cronin, AD, and President. The world's just not that perfect. An old law enforcement adage is to "follow the money." Doing so makes you think Cronin had the most to lose here financially, as a Gates-less season would pretty much guarantee an awful record and put his job at jeopardy. For those of us very impressed with Cronin's press conference, the suspension of Gates simply doesn't mesh. Unless you are a huge UC fan (and even then), this action would make just about anyone write off UC.

I don't have any problem with anyone "getting an edge." Just do it legally and within the rules of the game. Steroids without a prescription are illegal. Certain supplements, although legal, have been deemed impermissible by baseball (and other sports). If you are going to play in the league, you have a responsibilty to know the rules and to abide by them. If you don't, you're cheating. If you cheat, you harm the game. To me, at least, it's that simple. And I am absolutely tired to no end of these guys that "accidentally" or "inadvertently" or "unknowingly" took something they shouldn't have. For Cripe's sake, man up and just admit you knowingly took something you shouldn't have and accept the consequences. This "Rafael Pameiro" attitude is so tiresome......

All part of the screw up......

Mbodj's 6-game suspension is reasonable. Like it or not, that's a fairly stiff penalty. Could it have been 8 or 10 games? Sure. Probably should have. But 6 is acceptable, at least to me. Gates' suspension is hard to justify or defend. So I won't.

I think 6 games for Mbodj is on the low end for being reasonable, but still reasonable. I assume Ellis is the Tazmanian Devil? Also reasonable for him. Ridiculous for Gates. And very disappointing. I'll be curious to hear comments from Cronin on this, but hard to match this up with statements he made in his post-game presser. We went from "some guys might not even be on this team" to a very weak suspension for the biggest culprit. Now XU's turn to screw it up......

Which is exactly what Cronin said.