While we're on the subject of Kentucky HS track, what do folks think about the "one false start and you're done" rule? Seems to me that this as much as anything keeps elite sprinters out of the state meet. What;s wrong with charging the first FS in a race to the field?

 

Excellent point!!! I have never liked that rule. It has been like that as long as I can remember and it has cost many sprinters their chance. I saw it happen in 1983 and cost 2 of the top 5 sprinters in the state that year a shot at state in the regionals. One false started causing another one to jump. They immediately disqualified both. Yet the first sprinter went the judge and told him it was his fault and the other sprinter shouldn't be disqualified. They weren't even on the same team. The plea fell on deaf ears. Both were devastated as that season, they each had beaten every sprinter in the state at least once (except the eventual state champ).

 

If a sprinter false starts, IMHO, he/she should get a warning and only be disqualified if he does it again. I think the one and done is ridiculous and should have been done away with years ago.

I agree with MT.. Track used to be considered a sport the winter and fall athletes would participate in to maintain or improve speed/endurance. But many, such as MT, find a home and sometimes ends up being their best or favorite sport. If you look at most state qualifying athletes in sprinting and jumping events, many of them play football in the fall. But how many basketball players do you see? How many soccer players do you see? These are the sports which ask them to "specialize". They are playing club soccer and AAU or open gym basketball. The only sport track should be losing athletes to is baseball, not club leagues...

 

You are right. Actually, football was still my favorite sport, but after an injury curtailed my football future (still had scholly's but had to sit out one year due to recovery from 2 surgeries, but could run track so stuck with that and loved it.

 

I agree that I don't see as many basketball players participating anymore. The 400m school record when I was in HS was broken my sophomore or junior season by a basketball star who went on to play in college and until the school consolidated, I believe was still the record. He only ran for a year or two, but could have been a real standout 400m runner if he had chosen to pursue that at the next level. I also remember Todd Bearup (younger brother of Brett) high jump for part of a HS track season and actually look very good, then walked away to focus on hoops. He had some real hops. There were several girls basketball players who were also solid track performers at that time, and this is the basketball team that is still tied for the most number of state titles in KHSAA history.

 

North Laurel's best track athlete is freshman, Ashley Woolum. She is also a varsity basketball standout for her school, but has been qualifying and participating in the state track tournament since 6th grade and has been one of the state's top hurdlers since middle school. Good athletes are good athletes, and track and field will do nothing but help them get better. I just wish more coaches saw it like this and I think it could also reduce the number of kids who stop playing their sport because of burnout from playing one sport pretty much year round. Let them be kids and try it all!

A few years back I saw a runner DQd for a false start at the state CROSS-COUNTRY race. She was nudged by a teammate just before the gun and her foot crossed the line.

 

DQd for that in a 3.1 mile race. I thought I'd seen it all.

A few years back I saw a runner DQd for a false start at the state CROSS-COUNTRY race. She was nudged by a teammate just before the gun and her foot crossed the line.

 

DQd for that in a 3.1 mile race. I thought I'd seen it all.

 

Wow, that would have to really hurt. That is why the rule should be changed. I have yet to talk to anyone who is in favor of this rule as it is.

However, looking at the times in Kentucky, they haven't improved over the years. In fact, I saw times that some participants had that won their meets and qualified them for the state that would not have have made it out of many of the regionals, much less the sectionals at that time. The format then was 1. regionals, 2. sectionals, then 3. state. There were kids running in the 11's in the 100 meter dash and winning their meets and qualifying for state. I can't believe it.

 

Here are a few records that I looked at:

 

Boys 100m record set in 1990. That is 19 years.

 

Boys 4 x 100 meter record is Lafayette in 1985, ... 24 years.

Girls 4 x 100 meter record is Bryan Station, 1982, 27 years

 

Boys & Girls 400 meter records were set in 1983, ... 26 years

 

Boys 110 m hurdles, 1975

 

Boys 200 meter record is very recent, ... 8 years by Ben Kittleson

Girls 200 meter record, 1986, ... 23 years

 

State long jump record: 1985 for the boys, .. 1975 for the girls

 

I know it isn't just about when the records were set, .. but the times that get some to the state level are simply not what they used to be. I think it is ashame, but often this is due to many of the better athletes, not participating in track and field like they used to

 

A couple of thoughts on why the sprint times aren't as good as they used to be. I agree that fewer top notch athletes run track than did in previous generations. Also, at that time, all times were hand held which tends to produce better times than the electronic timing devices. It is more difficult to overcome this fraction of a second timing advantage in the events that you have noted (except long jump). While many of the sprint records are older, how old are the middle and long distance records?

A couple of thoughts on why the sprint times aren't as good as they used to be. I agree that fewer top notch athletes run track than did in previous generations. Also, at that time, all times were hand held which tends to produce better times than the electronic timing devices. It is more difficult to overcome this fraction of a second timing advantage in the events that you have noted (except long jump). While many of the sprint records are older, how old are the middle and long distance records?

 

A mixed bag on the middle and long distance records. Some older, some within the last 10 years. But the long distance records especially, don't tend to stand as long as there is much more room to improve as opposed to the sprints where tenths, hundreths and thousandths of a second make a difference.

 

I agree that many of the times that were handheld can be better. But I am seeing handtimed invitational meets with times around the same as the qualifiers. I agree that this can play a factor, and state records in KY have to be set at the state meet so that the potential 'fudge' factor is gone and laser timing is used.

 

The state shotput record is Jesse Stuart from 1969 at 67', but he was an unbelievable talent. The closest throw at state since that time was 2003, Andy Fryman from Mason County at just over 65'. The boys long jump record is 24' & 1/2" from William White at Shelby County in 1985.

I'm pretty sure that the adjustment that is added to hand-timed results (to "equate" them to fully automated times) is 0.24 seconds.

And by the way, it's nice to have a meaningful discussion here on BGP related to track and field. :thumb: I know way too may people who think that the only thing more boring than track is field.

And by the way, it's nice to have a meaningful discussion here on BGP related to track and field. :thumb: I know way too may people who think that the only thing more boring than track is field.

 

 

I think many of those have never been to a track meet. Granted they can be long, especially the bigger meets, but there is normally something going on nearly the entire day. A good chance to see a lot of athletes compete. I don't get to them very much anymore, but try to keep up with some of the times posted and results of meets. I loved the time I spent on the track and have a lot of fond memories (and some bad ones) from high school and college. I always like to tell people that in college, I was able to qualify and participate in the national collegiate championships and get smoked by some of the best in the world at that time. It gave me the chance to meet Hershel Walker and numerous olympic & future professional athletes that I never would have had the chance to meet any other way. Some of those guys had a gear or two that not only did I not possess, but didn't know existed!

I think many of those have never been to a track meet. Granted they can be long, especially the bigger meets, but there is normally something going on nearly the entire day. A good chance to see a lot of athletes compete. I don't get to them very much anymore, but try to keep up with some of the times posted and results of meets. I loved the time I spent on the track and have a lot of fond memories (and some bad ones) from high school and college. I always like to tell people that in college, I was able to qualify and participate in the national collegiate championships and get smoked by some of the best in the world at that time. It gave me the chance to meet Hershel Walker and numerous olympic & future professional athletes that I never would have had the chance to meet any other way. Some of those guys had a gear or two that not only did I not possess, but didn't know existed!

 

I guess I'm biased, but I agree. There's something happening at all times; and there's almost never a meet that doesn't have a few dramatic finishes.

 

I never was any good, but I grew up around the sport. My dad was a high school track (as well as football amd wrestling) coach in the late 1950s and early 1960s when I was a kid growing up in Maryland.

 

And you never know who you're going to run into. I was at a college meet at EKU a few weeks ago and happened to be sitting next to the Tennessee State women's team. Talked some with the coach, to find out that she is Olympic multiple gold medalist Chandra Cheeseborough.

A mixed bag on the middle and long distance records. Some older, some within the last 10 years. But the long distance records especially, don't tend to stand as long as there is much more room to improve as opposed to the sprints where tenths, hundreths and thousandths of a second make a difference.

 

I agree that many of the times that were handheld can be better. But I am seeing handtimed invitational meets with times around the same as the qualifiers. I agree that this can play a factor, and state records in KY have to be set at the state meet so that the potential 'fudge' factor is gone and laser timing is used.

 

The state shotput record is Jesse Stuart from 1969 at 67', but he was an unbelievable talent. The closest throw at state since that time was 2003, Andy Fryman from Mason County at just over 65'. The boys long jump record is 24' & 1/2" from William White at Shelby County in 1985.

 

Here's an example of why track and field doesn't attract the caliber of athlete it once did on a consistent basis.

 

I know Andy reasonably well - not bosom buddies or anything, but my daughter was starting on Mason County's team as Andy was finishing.

 

He demolished the state competition (regardless of class) his senior year in the shot and discus. He won NATIONAL titles, indoor and outdoor in the shot his senior year.

 

And I may be mistaken, but I believe that he recieved a HALF scholarship to throw at UK.

Here's an example of why track and field doesn't attract the caliber of athlete it once did on a consistent basis.

 

I know Andy reasonably well - not bosom buddies or anything, but my daughter was starting on Mason County's team as Andy was finishing.

 

He demolished the state competition (regardless of class) his senior year in the shot and discus. He won NATIONAL titles, indoor and outdoor in the shot his senior year.

 

And I may be mistaken, but I believe that he recieved a HALF scholarship to throw at UK.

 

Excellent point. The scholarship numbers for track and field are not what they used to be. But the again, this has been the case for several years. When I was in high school, UK and UL didn't even have track teams, just track clubs with no schollys at all.

I have a great deal of respect for these kids. They start practice in really cold weather and end often in blazing hot weather. In the middle, they get some rain. But they keep working their butts off.

I agree with MT.. Track used to be considered a sport the winter and fall athletes would participate in to maintain or improve speed/endurance. But many, such as MT, find a home and sometimes ends up being their best or favorite sport. If you look at most state qualifying athletes in sprinting and jumping events, many of them play football in the fall. But how many basketball players do you see? How many soccer players do you see? These are the sports which ask them to "specialize". They are playing club soccer and AAU or open gym basketball. The only sport track should be losing athletes to is baseball, not club leagues...

 

That's an interesting point. When at a meet, I'm always looking at the rosters of different teams to see what familiar names/faces I will see from other sports. Football players are a far more common sight than hoopsters.

 

One of the reasons Bardstown does so well year-in and year-out is that pretty much everybody on the basketball team also runs track. I guess it's an easy sell to the kids when you're winning state championships at a regular clip.

That's an interesting point. When at a meet, I'm always looking at the rosters of different teams to see what familiar names/faces I will see from other sports. Football players are a far more common sight than hoopsters.

 

One of the reasons Bardstown does so well year-in and year-out is that pretty much everybody on the basketball team also runs track. I guess it's an easy sell to the kids when you're winning state championships at a regular clip.

 

:thumb: I wish more coaches would encourage their kids to run track if they don't play a spring sport. It will help them in their other sports AND possibly keep them from burning out on another sport.

 

We always had several football players on our track roster, ... but our better overall track teams were when we also picked up some hoopsters as well. To have a good track team you MUST have several good athletes, even if they don't win their events, to place and pick up points for the team is crucial.