I don't think, in most cases, that it is the kids that are actually in the justice system already. It seems like most of them are troubled, but they are quietly troubled. Does this make sense?

I think in the VT incident, he was in the mental health system, and someone obviously dropped the ball. he was deemed a threat to himself and others, but was allowed to return. There were many warning signs, and they were ignored by the people who make the decisions.

In most of the high school cases, they seem to be kids that are teased relentlessly and just keep holding it in. It builds up until they can't take it anymore. I don't think you can only blame parents. School officials need to take notice of all the bullying that goes on. The parents aren't with them at school and can't know everything that goes on.

I blame the parents more than the system.

 

 

The thing is as a parent all you can legally do is give them time-out. If I am caught as a parent spanking, which I think is MUCH more effective than time-out, my child. I AM THE ONE GOING TO JAIL!!!!!

 

So don't neccessarily blame the parents as our hands are tied allot of times by people who just can't seem to mind their business.:mad: :mad:

 

Please don't get me wrong, I think the penalties for making threats should be much more sever than they are.

And the system that prevents me from disiplining my children, is the same system that wouldn't let Cho be removed from school for being a threat. So I say yes blame the system!!!!!!!:madman: :madman:

I don't think, in most cases, that it is the kids that are actually in the justice system already. It seems like most of them are troubled, but they are quietly troubled. Does this make sense?

I think in the VT incident, he was in the mental health system, and someone obviously dropped the ball. he was deemed a threat to himself and others, but was allowed to return. There were many warning signs, and they were ignored by the people who make the decisions.

In most of the high school cases, they seem to be kids that are teased relentlessly and just keep holding it in. It builds up until they can't take it anymore. I don't think you can only blame parents. School officials need to take notice of all the bullying that goes on. The parents aren't with them at school and can't know everything that goes on.

 

Which of the school shootings does the bolded part apply to?

The thing is as a parent all you can legally do is give them time-out. If I am caught as a parent spanking, which I think is MUCH more effective than time-out, my child. I AM THE ONE GOING TO JAIL!!!!!

 

So don't neccessarily blame the parents as our hands are tied allot of times by people who just can't seem to mind their business.:mad: :mad:

 

Please don't get me wrong, I think the penalties for making threats should be much more sever than they are.

And the system that prevents me from disiplining my children, is the same system that wouldn't let Cho be removed from school for being a threat. So I say yes blame the system!!!!!!!:madman: :madman:

And it is the same system that daily removes children from homes where they are being physically and sexually abused.

Court systems do nothing to juveniles!! They can do whatever they like...

When I was younger and if I did something wrong, the school or the courts was the LAST one I was concerned about. It was my father.

 

Of course today, we are told by society that kids don't even need a father and unfortunately the males have bought into that and washed their hands of their responsibility as a father.

And it is the same system that daily removes children from homes where they are being physically and sexually abused.

 

 

I don't disagree with that at all. But where is the fine line? I am giving a true example that happened to me 6 months ago. My 13 year old son snuck out of the house, middle of the night after I had went to sleep. He got into a car with a 15 year old that was drinking and got pulled over by the police. When I went to pick him up, my son wasn't drinking but the driver was, I was suprised at what I was told by the police officer.

 

I of course was furious with my son and threatened to take a belt to his butt when we got home. The police officer said that I couldn't do that and also told me that I was to control my child at all times. So I ask if when I went to sleep what was I supposed to do ? Chain my son to his bed? This is also child abuse, obviously. So I had to give him TIME-OUT. Boy is that ever effective!!!!:madman: :madman:

So I haven't slept in 2 years since that is the only way I can control my children and not abuse them!!!!!

I don't disagree with that at all. But where is the fine line? I am giving a true example that happened to me 6 months ago. My 13 year old son snuck out of the house, middle of the night after I had went to sleep. He got into a car with a 15 year old that was drinking and got pulled over by the police. When I went to pick him up, my son wasn't drinking but the driver was, I was suprised at what I was told by the police officer.

 

I of course was furious with my son and threatened to take a belt to his butt when we got home. The police officer said that I couldn't do that and also told me that I was to control my child at all times. So I ask if when I went to sleep what was I supposed to do ? Chain my son to his bed? This is also child abuse, obviously. So I had to give him TIME-OUT. Boy is that ever effective!!!!:madman: :madman:

So I haven't slept in 2 years since that is the only way I can control my children and not abuse them!!!!!

I understand your point and wonder where that fine line is too.

 

As a teacher my hands are tied at times. I have had a student make a claim that I thought was 100% false. Didn't believe a word of it. STILL, I don't turn it in and I lose my job. Is my ability to provide for my child worth not telling even though I believe it is false?

 

I think the belt was the comment that made the police have to handle as they did.

 

The most effective punishment my dad ever did with me did not include a spanking. I was five minutes late for curfew, got in at 12:05. Of course, he was up and sent me to bed. Thought I had gotten by with it. The rest of the week including school mornings, I was up when his alarm went off for him to get ready for work, at 4:00 AM doing chores including digging ditches for a drainage system we were putting in. I would work until he left at 6:00 AM and then I would begin to get ready for school.

 

I was NEVER late for my curfew again.

I understand your point and wonder where that fine line is too.

 

As a teacher my hands are tied at times. I have had a student make a claim that I thought was 100% false. Didn't believe a word of it. STILL, I don't turn it in and I lose my job. Is my ability to provide for my child worth not telling even though I believe it is false?

 

I think the belt was the comment that made the police have to handle as they did.

 

The most effective punishment my dad ever did with me did not include a spanking. I was five minutes late for curfew, got in at 12:05. Of course, he was up and sent me to bed. Thought I had gotten by with it. The rest of the week including school mornings, I was up when his alarm went off for him to get ready for work, at 4:00 AM doing chores including digging ditches for a drainage system we were putting in. I would work until he left at 6:00 AM and then I would begin to get ready for school.

 

I was NEVER late for my curfew again.

 

 

What would your Dad have done if you had refused???

What would your Dad have done if you had refused???

When I was growing up there were enough old fashion spankings that I was not going to refuse. I had been taught when I was younger that when dad spoke refusal was not an issue. That foundation had been lain long before I was a teenager.

 

Never got hit with anything but an open hand on the buttocks but that hand could light you up.

When I was growing up there were enough old fashion spankings that I was not going to refuse. I had been taught when I was younger that when dad spoke refusal was not an issue. That foundation had been lain long before I was a teenager.

 

Never got hit with anything but an open hand on the buttocks but that hand could light you up.

 

 

That is the same way I was brought up to. I have been raising my boys, as a single Father, since they were 5 and 9 respectively. It has been a challenge at times with the threat of action from the ex-wife when I want to discipline.

That is the same way I was brought up to. I have been raising my boys, as a single Father, since they were 5 and 9 respectively. It has been a challenge at times with the threat of action from the ex-wife when I want to discipline.

I feel for you and it is really hard. Especially when you don't have support of the other parent and their nicey-nice routine undermines the discipline that you are trying to instill in them.

 

My sister was in a similar role, so I appreciate all that you are going through.

I understand your point and wonder where that fine line is too.

 

As a teacher my hands are tied at times. I have had a student make a claim that I thought was 100% false. Didn't believe a word of it. STILL, I don't turn it in and I lose my job. Is my ability to provide for my child worth not telling even though I believe it is false?

 

I think the belt was the comment that made the police have to handle as they did.

 

The most effective punishment my dad ever did with me did not include a spanking. I was five minutes late for curfew, got in at 12:05. Of course, he was up and sent me to bed. Thought I had gotten by with it. The rest of the week including school mornings, I was up when his alarm went off for him to get ready for work, at 4:00 AM doing chores including digging ditches for a drainage system we were putting in. I would work until he left at 6:00 AM and then I would begin to get ready for school.

 

I was NEVER late for my curfew again.

 

You bring up a good point, as usual, LBBC. Add to that how, as teachers, our hands are tied when it comes to discipline. Some posters are putting a lot of the blame on teachers. Yes, some of it does fall on us. However, what are our disciplinary options? We cannot use corporal punishment - abuse, again, just as for a parent. If we suspend them, then our scores go down (students are missing content, in addition to this being figured into our non-cognitive data for CATS scores). Do we give them detention? What do we do if they don't come? Do we put them in an alternative school setting? What if they still act up? The best part of it all is when the parents continue to allow the kid a vehicle (better ones than I drive), have a cell phone, internet access, etc.

You bring up a good point, as usual, LBBC. Add to that how, as teachers, our hands are tied when it comes to discipline. Some posters are putting a lot of the blame on teachers. Yes, some of it does fall on us. However, what are our disciplinary options? We cannot use corporal punishment - abuse, again, just as for a parent. If we suspend them, then our scores go down (students are missing content, in addition to this being figured into our non-cognitive data for CATS scores). Do we give them detention? What do we do if they don't come? Do we put them in an alternative school setting? What if they still act up? The best part of it all is when the parents continue to allow the kid a vehicle (better ones than I drive), have a cell phone, internet access, etc.

In the state of KY, school districts decide for themselves if they want to use corporal punishment or not.

 

And you are right on the others. Parents come in and say they can't do anything with little johnny and I ask why they still have their cellphone, talk about the parties they went to this weekend and wear their nice clothing.

 

I LOVE THE FOLLOWING.

 

Good friend of mine was having a problem with his son appreciating things he had. So he went out and bought 5 white crewneck Hanes tshirts and 5 pair of Wranglers. That was his school outfit for awhile. Son got the message.

 

I told one of my students recently, she pulled that crap on me as a parent and she would come home to a mattress and a sheet in her room. Her car would be sold. Her cellphone turned off. I would be driving her too and fro and if I didn't have time to take her to and fro, then she wouldn't be going.

 

She would have everything she needed to survive and be a student. ANY luxury, GONE.

I got a parent and student furious at me once. They said they couldn't stay for detention because of work. I went to HS with their employer. I called the employer and told him that the student couldn't go to detention because of work. He told her that she couldn't go to work until she served the detention.

 

They were not happy with me. But I can play that game with the best of them.

The court system needs to make examples out of students that make these threats. After several of these students get about 5 -10 years in jail. This non sense will stop.

:thumb: You are 100% correct.