tigershark

Penn Private schools can play other schools that are not members of the NFHS and do. I'm sure that other NFHS do play them and they are in violation. We could not travel to the National Catholic School Championships because they were sponsored by a school who is not a member of the NFHS.

282 KHSAA Schools 234 Public Schools 48 NonPublic Schools 198 Public Schools that Voted for Prop 20 36 Public Schools that don't suck

Schools can’t just secede because they need to be sanctioned by the NFHS (National Federation of State High School Associations). You must be a member in good standing of your state athletic association to compete against other members of the NFHS. In state like Pennsylvania that has both a Public and Private league, the Private schools can’t legally compete against schools from out of the state, because the NFHS will not recognize their Private School Association.

The Catholic Schools will continue to pay the KHSAA dues to remain a member school so they can compete against schools from other states but will not compete against any Kentucky Public schools.

You are correct, voted to have separate championships. The word on the street is that the Catholic schools of Kentucky will not participate in any KHSAA Championship if the separation goes through, nor will they compete against any public school. Why bring the large crowds and pay for the public schools athletic budget.

The fight is far from over with the Board of Education & State Legislature sure to get involved but for now.... Congratulations to the Public Schools who can now compete for their watered down 'B' State Championships.

the Public Schools got 198 out of 282 votes. They only needed 188 to pass the proposal.

We just got the word, the Public schools did have enough votes and have voted to remove Private schools from the KHSAA. I will find out the voting totals in a couple of minutes. Prop 12 has not voted on as of 3:30

I believe the correct statement would be that for every really good school they made, they also made several bad ones. This was a topic of numerous discussions in my graduate school classes several years ago and has been a problem for educators across the country for years. I also believe the lack of school pride and community is a direct byproduct.

Manual is a terrific school and has a great support system but if you are going to represent the Public School side of this discussion you have to remove your self from the “Manual Scene” and look at the majority of public schools. The pride is not there and Coach Stewart's words are right on the money. Notice that he didn't go into the reason it's no longer there he just stated the observation.

School Pride is often judged by athletic events but it is much more important than that. Pride in ones community and school is reflected in every endeavor that is undertaken. I believe that Coach Stewart’s comments reflect on much more than athletic competition, they reflect directly on the success of the school in every thing that the school takes part in, graduation rates, test scores, athletics, etc. That is the scariest part of this discussion, not if public schools can compete in athletic events but a good number of them are also failing in the most important area, that being education.

His remarks are not just about football. He is talking about the school community as a whole. What he was describing is the change in neighborhood support of these schools and how that carries over into all activities that these schools participate in. Look at all athletic events, not just football. Why do the private schools have such huge following compared to the public schools. Most of the public schools have the same if not a larger student population yet they have a fraction of the support both in the stands and behind the scenes. The idea of pride in these public schools is just not there like it once was.

You might be better saying that you disagree with his view, not that it is incorrect. I don’t believe you or I have the experience of history to compare the public school setting like Coach Stewart has. He has been around high school athletics for close to 50 years and has simply pointed out the changes that he thinks have taken place over those years. I understand and agree with the point you raise about the importance of strong academic leadership that schools like Manual provide for our community, but the majority of public schools don’t come close to having the same since of pride or community that I have been told they once had. I don’t know if the problem started with bussing or with the creation of magnet type schools, but the point both Coach Stewart and I are trying to make is that the JCPS is attempting to blame this on the private schools as well as attempting to fix it by banning the private schools from athletic competition.

You are absolutely correct, thanks for pointing that out.

That is exactly the point. That is what needs to be fixed, that way public school students won’t think twice about leaving the public school system. Also I feel the majority of your reply dealt with the short comings of an individual school not the school system as a whole.

You need to read the article again. Your reply did not even touch on the main point of the Public School observation being made.

I have been very careful and cautious when posting on this thread because it is a topic that I feel very strongly about. I am aware that there are good people in the public school system and that the “powers to be” don’t speak for everyone, but that is often the perception. I couldn’t find a way to put into words what I believe is the problem with the public school athletic landscape until I read the paper today. You can find the following In the Readers’ Corner on page C3 of the Courier Journal. “Open Enrollment Hurt School Pride, Athletics” As I was driving to the Catholic high school at which I teach last week, I saw a group of about 36 young men out for their predawn run. It was our cross country team, and it was 7:20 a.m. This work ethic has nothing to do with financial aid or geographical boundaries. I noticed in the newspaper over the weekend that there were 96 students in the greater Louisville area who have been designated National Merit semifinalists. There were 34 young people from Manual but only 11 other students from the entire Jefferson County Public Schools system. When the school board made the decision to go to basically an “open enrollment” policy, it created a few select schools but really diminished the neighborhood school concept and took away a lot of the pride that used to exist in the various neighborhoods. I believe this concept has also diminished the quality of athletics throughout most of the JCPS system. When I was coaching in the 1970s and ‘80’s at the school where I now teach, we always knew we were going to be in a tough contest against most of the public schools we faced. There was a pride in their community that showed up in their performance and in their crowd support. The private schools did not take this pride away from the individual communities. We should not try to cut off the legs of the giant to be as tall. Maybe JCPS needs to look from within and work to get better, which used to be the American way of doing things. I am happy to see that someone has finally introduced the elephant in the room.

I am still of the opinion that the majority of public schools don’t lack the means to compete but rather lack the desire to compete and are using this issue as a means to make the KHSAA a B Level or watered down athletic association so they can compete for championships. It’s not that public schools don’t have the talent or the coaching but most schools lack the long term vision and drive to establish a winning program. Just look at Davies County cross country, Woodford County wrestling, PRP baseball, Male football just to name a few, the people involved with these programs put in the extra hours and the do the little things that it takes to be the best. You get the right people involved you can have these types of programs at Eastern and even Manual, just look at the success of their football program over the last couple of years. They might not have the title of being in the “Big 3” but they have one hell of a program and are only getting better. Why are we, both public and private school followers, going to stand by and let these “higher powers” make all public schools look as if they are taking the easy road to success, kick the top programs out and bring the rest of the field down to their level. That is exactly what they are doing and those that don’t speak up are just as guilty as Sexton and the others

Those “out of the know” people sure do have a lot of cheer leaders here in Jefferson County, Sexton from Eastern for example, leading the cheers.

I completely understand and agree that it is not right for a student to be given a break on tuition because he or she is an athlete. That being said I have still not heard or read a legitimate explanation by the public schools as to why a young person who attends a public grade school can’t choose to pursue a different path in their academic endeavors and continue to participate in clubs and activities such as athletics. If the only public school argument is tuition assistance, than we need to sit down and fix that problem. Why punish those in compliance by removing them for competition. It is obvious to me that it is perfectly fine for a catholic grade school student to attend a public high school and participate in athletics but not the other way around. So, what is the real complaint of the public schools?

I was not alluding to anything, I believe young men today should be able to go to any school they choose, public or private, play any sport they choose and work to be the very best they can be.

With the game fast approaching and the public / private debate heating up I thought I would throw this out there. I’m not 100% positive, and I am still looking for the exact numbers, but I have heard from several sources around town that the Manual varsity team has more players form catholic grade schools than the St. X varsity team has from public grade schools. I thought that was very interesting. I will let you know what I find.