devils advocate

Look Im not from Louisville, a Ballard alum, or a Bender fan. Im a fan of basketball with a realistic view on high school basketball in KY. There are a bunch of overlooked kids every year that dont have the hype of some players that they're better then. Read some of my other posts. I love Ky basketball but until we start changing up things we're leaving out worthy kids. I could play for Caldwell Co. and avg.30 and not get noticed but if I did it for Lex. Catholic I'm all world. Am i really a different player cause of the school name. Sportswriters in the state need to get out and observe the talent and not just write about the same hand full of people. I've seen Hopson play twice jr. and sr. year and he seemed to play harder under the new coach. I'm anxious to see how he does against In because it seems like he plays better against top talent.

Hey I know I'll never forget him. Dont know him personally and his story was kinda sad but he was overrated to me. That's how I'll always remember him. Good but not great! Ky basketball(vertically challenged) made him who he was. Put him in Atlanta and he's an after thought playing for Mercer or Ga. State! Bender is still a national recruit in Chicago, NY, LA, or GA. Nothing personal against VanHoose just calling it like I see it.

Isn't this a high school thread? The state of Kentucky is all about hype. That's the reason IN continues to beat us every summer and the majority of folks don't understand why! Ive read countless articles about how Hopson doesnt play hard and this and that but he had a great sr. year and has huge national reputation! Most folks you ask wouldnt put him on their all-state team based on their personal feelings not his on the court play. Just like Bender! 19 and 12 in a Championship game as a sophmore would have the avg player given Mr. Basketball right then. Had D. Miller done it (19 &12 as a soph) nobody else (Hopson or Mack) would have been mentioned. Had Sparks done it as a Soph. he wins it(probably shoulda got it anyway). Folks in the state have won Mr. Basketball or been all state by accomplishing less then Bender:banana:, I do know that!

Hey I'd take 19 and 12 with a ring! Instead of 36 and 22 in a loss. And Im not talkin about 96 and 98 because the talent was way up Benders jr. and sr. year. 96 was a pretty good year for talent but there were some upsets in regionals that year.

Hey, thats the way the ball bounces. A lot of it probably had to do with Ballard. They had played that year in a Florida tourney i think. Lofton wouldnt have let Ballard do Mason like that. Rick Jones was overrated!

Again my point is hype in all-state voting and Mr. Basketball voting. If VanHoose had won state as a soph, like he and Bender did, but never made it back to state (like Bender did) he still wins Mr. Basketball cause of the hype he had IMO. The powers that be wanted him to win it. Theres never been a player in Benders postion that shined as a underclassman that didn't win Mr. basketball with his level of credentials. Which proves that the voting is a joke! If its truly about on the court performance and talent.

Plus Bender shared the ball with Wilkinson(UofL), Chiles(UK), and Knight(Ill St.) among others. And Bender was the best player on the team. Crushed Scott Co. who was probably nationally ranked too!

Please you havent proving anything. Paintsville doesnt make it outta the 7th region those years man! Look at the roster for Male during those years. Are you serious? That Season (BENDERS sr. year) was one of the greatest for talent in the states history! The Sweet Sixteen is an awesome tourney but if you play against a bunch of six-four kids you'll get those numbers. VanHoose would've dominated this years Sweet Sixteen. But when he was on the court with players his size what did he do. IN killed him!

Oh yeah, VanHooose doesn't make a Pitino team to be kicked off!

And somebody give me some high school numbers please. Remember we're talking about high school. Everybodies running from the issue. Also a rundown of sr. and jr. year schedules of Paintsville and Ballard will tell somethings too. Without looking I know who played better comp night in and night out!

Gregg Doyel has a right to his opinion too! Doyel is a person just like me and you. Caracter is off the team right? So a head case is a head case. Rodrick Rhodes was a high school phenom but he got the boot too, so that hasn't proved anything.

Barber went to a juco! We're focusing on high school play. If mI decide I dont wanna play ball after high school should it diminish what I did? Just showing that All-state voting is a joke.

Yeah I told him if folks are hyping VanHoose the way they are you'll be a lottery pick!!! Run for the money!

We're talkin about high school folks. Stockton and Allen were Mr. Basketball!!! The greatest hype you can receive! Neltner wasnt the best player in his region(Doellman)! Rick Jones had a lot of 7 for 24 shooting nights. Hit big threes that stood out, no handle or D! VanHoose was solid but everyone was in an uproar about his recruitment but he wasn't that great. Bender dominated in state and nationally what else needs to be said. Maybe I need another example cause no one wants to give him his dues. He's not the only overlooked kid from the state by any means.

Not his agent (Bender) just a talent scout focusing on overrated talent in the state . Your boy VanHoose was decent but he wasnt what your making him out to be! Lofton was the last great player hyped in the state that actually deserved it. Walt Allen, VanHoose, Rick Jones, Carrier, Stockton, Hundley, Neltner all hype!

Just by the response about" Who was the last player overlooked" your missing the point. There are kids that come out of the 6th and 7th region every year that are first team all region but dont get a sniff of all-state recognition. Thats overlooked! Night in and night out go to Manuel, PRP, Fairdale,Male,Ballard, Eastern, Fern Creek, Central, J-town. Not nuetral court games actual road games. So many kids from Louisville go to Juco's. Half the folks around the state have never heard of these kids.... it's crazy. I'm not from Louisville but I do recognize that theres more talent there then any where else in the state. It's a numbers game people! 700,000 people in Jefferson Co. Give you an example, this year Iroquois has a kid that I can't think of his name but he was listed in some national magazines as a top player. Went to five-star I beleive and made the All-star team. Headed to Vincennes Juco( one of the best Jucos by the way) but probably was honorable mention all-state at best! Dropped 20 every night in the 6th region.

Man saw Bender in high school like ten times and the man beasted people! Heart is getting the ball in the post and going up strong! Refuse to be stopped, either score or get fouled! Not many big men in Kentucky have that in them. Thats why Bender was a national recruit! Plain and simple. Remember we're talkin about high school here. And folks talk about numbers, there the most over blown thing. I can take 30 shots a game hit 5 and 5 free throws and avg. double figures. I base my view on seeing a player. The way he moves, his footwork, shooting form, aggressiveness and heart(motor).

So what did Bender do for it not to stick for him? Nothing on the court, still dominated great competition!

I know plenty of people that arent blessed athletically that still play with that intangible heart factor. Look at the big boy for Notre Dame, Harangody. Never going to say he's as athletic as UConn's kids but he competes. And he didnt have a tenth of the hype of VanHoose. VanHoose didnt have that intangible an he got exposed in that KY/IN All-star game. And if he's got any type coordination he better be one of the top shot blockers ever, he's six-ten in a vertically challenged region and state. Jared carpenter had more fight to him to me. Kentucky didnt want him cause he was soft, didnt have enough go about him. Bet the boy Harrelson UK is recruiting isnt much of an athlete either but I bet he's got a motor!

Yeah Young and dumb can be a career killer. But that shows you how highly thought of he was on a national level. Most people had him like top 10 as an underclassman. Statements like that made fans dislike him. He told a reporter that there was no other candidate for Mr. Basketball but him as a soph. He always said wild stuff. So say what you want about his choice of quotes but you cant deny he had talent and he produced on the high school level! The whole point of my response is that voting isnt done strictly by on the court production and talent! Name another player that was nationally respected, Won a state championship as a soph, and played superb at state. And his play never dropped off, but he wasnt Mr.Basketball. Rick Jones made his name as a soph. and it stuck. If a bunch of kids did the same it would have went down very different. Put him in the same region as Paintsville and he puts up 25 and 15 nightly. The 7th region that year was loaded and he still put up numbers.

Home and away. Franfort, Louisville, Owensboro, and Bowling Green have hosted at one time or another. Not sure about Lex. Naptown hosts IN's game.

The threads about high school and how post season awards are given right? How players are overrated and the politics involved right? I'm basing things on high school. Still Van Hoose was soft if he avg. 40. Never said he was trash but if he had Benders heart and physical talent he'd have been Tyler Hansbrough before Tyler Hansbrough!

My bad I must have gave him one of Terrence Farleys free throws. OOOPs!!!

Yeah the boy (Lofton) dropped 42 on the Hoosiers!!! Owensboro Sportscenter,summer of '04. One of the most ridiculous performances I ever saw in person. Had heard the stories but I went in real skeptical because he was labeled a shooter! Had visions of Carrier and Rick Jones! (Oh NO) Came out with visions of REX, A. Houston, and Ricky Farmer! The man hit like 9 threes but also showed a very decent handle. Shoulda used it more his Sr. year at UT IMO. Anyway he hit his first three from beyond NBA range and it rained from there. Really was mad at Tubby and Rick after that! Great basketball player.

Miller is averaging double figures too I think. Wabash Valley usually sends their kids to the big times! Wish dude the best.