dinoradja

Age or grade OJ's about 23 now isn't he?

LOVE IT!!!! :jump: :ylsuper: :thumb: :banana: :dancingpa

They do apply to everyone and your name, nor anyone else were mentioned.

 

The personal comments jabs, back and forth are for the pm's. This thread is opinion based and let's keep it on the topic, off each other.

Sounds fine to me, based on my short history here I had to check though.

Then I ask that rule apply to everyone, not just when I say something but when they say things to me as well.

Flagett over Monticello in '60 and Ashland over Dunbar '61.

Like I said, I apologize for the incorrect post.

Yes, I guess you would have to be surprised about what I have watched. Movies and tapes were abudantly available even in the 1960's, not just during the "O.J." era that we live in now. Pick your players, pick your teams but please check your attitude and remarks, they are boring and bring nothing relevant to the discussion.

This is a good one dino :thumb: :lol: .

Thank you very much.

I think Ashland won the state in 1961.

I thought Ashland won in 1960 and was runner up in 1961, I apologize if I was incorrect.

Tubby: "So, what you're saying is, you ask the really good ones to come to your school and YOU do it instead of getting your assistants to do it?"

Billy Clyde: "Yep, works for me."

With all due respect, there is no confusion on the part of The Kingfish. You said your opinion was based upon "personal knowledge" which means that you saw him play. Now, if others told you about Conley or if you read something or if you just have certain loyalties/prejuduces, that is not "personal knowledge".

 

Nonetheless, you are entitled to your analysis regardless of any lack of real personal knowledge. There is no need for us to spilit hairs and no one has more regard for the accomplishments of Larry Conley than do I. However, I believe most would agree (many reluctantly) that Mayo was better. You, for whatever reason, see otherwise which is absolutely fine with me.

Yes, you must be confused because I never once said that I saw Conley play in person. However, maybe someone could see tape and make a decision, there are many ways to have "personal knowledge". I never saw Babe Ruth play in person but I can make an educated decision of how I would rank him among the baseball greats. Do not go on about "lack of real personal knowledge" when you don't know me, it makes you look like you know very little of which you speak. I am not trying to make this personal, but I would like for you to not misquote my posts and make it sound like I said things that I obviously did not. I don't think that is asking too much of the "Kingfish".

15th Region

 

King Kelly (Wayland)

Todd May (Virgie)

JR Vanhoose (Painstville)

Irvin Stepp (Phelps)

John Pelphrey (Paintsville)

 

Jeremy Hall (Allen Central)

Jody Thompson (Feds Creek)

Todd Conley (Elkhorn City)

Rodney Rowe (Virgie)

Howard Lockhart (Pikeville)

Todd Tackett (Paintsville)

 

 

This is just real fast off the top of my head Im sure Im leaving some out. I THINK the first 5 are all Mr. Basketballs......

Ervin Stepp alone lit up many a net, the rest of these guys were incredible in their own right as well. Put all of these guys on the court at the same time and the nets may have lasted 10 minutes, if they were lucky! :ylsuper:

Sounds good to me. Each person is entitled to establish his own criteria and you have certainly done so. I'm just happy to read that you got to see Conley play in person during his high school days. Not too many on BGP can say that.

I did not say that I saw Conley play in person, I said I was going on personal knowledge. Please read my post again if there is any confusion.

I certainly respect your opinion. Is it based upon personal knowledge or on word of mouth from others?

 

Larry Conley is the second best to ever play in the region. You can discount his accomplishments during the 1960-1961 season because he had six other exceptionally capable teammates on that team who would have likely won the state tournament without him. However, in the 1961-1962 season, he carried Ashland to the championship game because he had a clearly inferior supporting cast. It was his finest effort.

 

Nonetheless, I feel sure that unbiased observers who are familiar with both players will, by a large margin, tell you that Mayo, even as a middle schooler, was superior to Conley. That is no knock on Conley. The player of the 1960s was just not nearly as strong and athletic as the player of the 2000s. It was a different and less intense game.

 

 

Conley in his prime was a delight as was Harold Sergent. However, neither compares to Mayo and I'll bet both of them would quickly agree. The others you name are somewhere down the line but not near these three.

I am going on personal knowledge, yes. And as far as discounting Conley's contributions on the championship team, I would say that his fellow players may have a different opinion about discounting his importance. Players today may be more athletic and stronger but does that mean they shoot the ball better, pass better, handle the ball better or in general play the game better?

You have your criteria, I have mine and that is fine. I have no doubt your mind will not change on this as I am sure that mine opinion is still the same for the same reasons as I stated in my earlier post.

Hey.... hes not just a basketball coach. He is someone that wants to make you a great person who just happens to play basketball.

You are right, I forgot all about that. :laugh:

Sosa was hurt for a month for a sneeze and just last year Bonds played under 30 games because his knee, not a major injury.

You are 100 percent correct.

These 16th Region selections are hilarious. The best basketball player to ever wear the uniform of a school in that region is clearly O.J. Mayo. Most of those named ahead of him are not remotely in his class. Being partisans is fine. Being blind is something else.

 

The best to play in that region, in my opinion, are:

 

O.J. Mayo (Rose Hill)

Larry Conley (Ashland)

Jerry Ravenscraft (Breckenridge)

Harold Sergent (Ashland)

Mickey Sydenstricker (Russell)

Linville Puckett (Clark County)

Bert Greene (Olive Hill)

George Carroll (Ashland)

Jeff Hall (Fairview)

Earl Adkins (Ashland)

 

If Bill walker had made more than a cameo appearance, he would have to be in the top group.

 

These are in no particular order other than for the first two with Mayo over Conley.

Mayo had a great career while at Rose Hill but when he left after his 8th grade year that completed his "body of work" there. Based on that time period and the player that he was when he left, not after, I would put Conley and Hall ahead for their total works. Conley won a state championship and was a runner up the next year and Jeff Hall finished with a great career as well. I am not going to go over the rest of the players because I know more about these two than probably most of the others. But just basing it on body of work within the 16th Region and not in other states I have to say that while he had a great two years here I personally would not put him among the all time players because of what they did over a longer period and O.J. when he left was not the player that Hall and Conley were when they left high school. And I am not being partisan, just using criteria that I believe to be valid and fair.

Maybe it would be a more rational argument and settle the IQ debate if you listed all the Russell players who have made first team all state and received

a d-1 scholarship. Seems like that criteria would eliminate most of the "personal" opinion

I don't think its a long list

Just one more example of how that going D1, while being something to be proud of, still does not always equate being a better player than someone who did not go to a D1 school and I am very sure that you know this local player. Ty Barnes did not go to a NCAA school but I think that you would have to admit that he is a better player than the players that you felt I have slighted. And I guess I am not currently a "paid expert" but at one time I did make my living in the spectrum of sports media so I do feel that I know more than a little about what I am talking about.

The Ashland Tomcat team that won the State Championship, I believe it was in 1960. Best team ever from the 16th Region.

Over the years Duke and Coach K have got break after break, on and off the court, and the media is usually so pro-Duke and Coach K it is bordering on idol worship. He can get over it and himself. I remember very well the whinning over playing Indiana in Rupp and the way Davis handled it from IU was the best thing that Coach K could have and should have done. Davis joked about it, saying that if he had ever said anything bad about UK or their fans he was sorry, just playing it up and having a good time. And I for probably the only time I can ever remember rooted for IU.

Clemens is much larger than '86. While some of that is natural progression, a lot of it isn't. The one positive he has going for him is that in a book where Canseco threw everyone under the bus, Clemens received only compliments. I think that that is a tell. However, let's look at Clemens last few years at Boston and then when he was traded to Toronto.

Here is the link: http://www.baseball-reference.com/c/clemero02.shtml.

I'm not going to put all of the stats side-by-side, but I think that a case can definitely be made either way.

Yes, he had a great two year run in Toronto going a combined 41-13 but when he went to New York his first two years there he went a total of 27-18,

not even close to the numbers he had with the Blue Jays. Truth is he was out to prove something to the Red Sox when he went to the Blue Jays and he did that. And like I said earlier with Bonds numbers being so distinctly different it was to very different DECADES, first 10 years averaged around 29 home runs per year then the next ten years averaged over 40. Now that is soemthing that is very distinct and Bonds did not just put on some weight as he got older, his head is bigger along with the rest of his body. I cannot say 100 percent that Clemens never did anything or that Bonds did but if I had to bet on one I would lay my money on Barry being the cheater.

Raceland: Bob Braden for sure. Not even 6"3 and averaged double figure rebounds his junior and senior year.

16th Region based on players I have seen play ( in no order )

Jeff Hall

Steve Skaggs

Rocky Adkins

Don Rigsby

Mark Watkins

Marty Thomas

Chuck Cantrell

Jeff Tipton

Mike Scott

Jeff Tipton had one of the most incredible state tournament games his senior year. In the double overtime loss to Covington Holmes lead by Dicky Beal, Jeff had 41 points and 19 rebounds. And Mike Scott had a great state tourney too although Greenup as a team was over matched I remember Mike having some stats almost as good as what Jeff Tipton had.

Your proving my point, which was a players overall ability is best determined by paid professionals who make a living off of evaluating talent for their teams

and get fired if they don't pick the right kids. d-1 isn't the overiding factor, although a big one, but there are a lot of great players who couldnt cut it academically or had other issues. Bottom line, your example of Rodman and Payton is true, but their abilities were "validated" by someone who got paid to make those decisions and they got college scholarships and played professionally. I'm not that familiar with the players on your list, but did they play anywhere after High school? I'm sure none of them played professionally or I would have known that, but just curious as to what they did with basketball after high school?

Rick Hensley played at TCU and was a key player that beat the #1 team in the state in the finals of the regional in 1972. If I was making a list for Russell, I would have to have him on it

You being from the area makes it hard to believe that you are not familiar with my players but I will inform you about them the best that I can. Chris Jones went to the University of Kentucky as a walk on. Mark Watkins went to a college in Tennessee, Milligan I believe where he played for Ron Reed. Roberts, Synstricker and Ryan Watkins I am not sure what they did after high school as far as playing sports is concerned. And yes, Rick Hensley was a very good player and if you want to start your own Russell list with him then that is wonderful, I have finished making my list and am very happy with it.

Wow. Makes one wonder what was going on behind the scenes. Looks like she did not need too much time off.

Maybe it would be a more rational argument and settle the IQ debate if you listed all the Russell players who have made first team all state and received

a d-1 scholarship. Seems like that criteria would eliminate most of the "personal" opinion

I don't think its a long list

I don't believe that because one is going to play D1 that automatically means that they are better than someone who did not play D1. I would humbly submit that Dennis Rodman and Walter Payton did not play D1 and I would take them over Walter Berry ( who was NCAA player of the year ) and Archie Griffin ( who won two Heisman Trophies ). And as far as all state goes there are several all state teams, some that said player made and some that he did not. You obviously have personal reasons for how you feel, mine are non-biased like I said so I am very comfortable with my reasons for the picks I made and I feel that I would not replace any of my picks with Vanhoose, Hensley or Howell because they were not as good as the players I picked. Nothing personal.

Hibbert will go before the ten pick, that is almost a given. A lot of size and he has improved each year.