Mojocat

I don't think it's any more complicated than a new school opened and the talent base for the school was eroded.  And often when this happens, it seems it's not as simple as half of the county now goes to a new school so you're losing half of what you might have had - rather, kids who are still districted to the old school want to be part of the new, so in the end you lose even more than what's expected.  See Shelby County when Collins opened, North Hardin when John Hardin opened.  I'm sure there are a bunch of others.  Oldham County seems to have for the most part avoided this scenario, but I think that's because the new schools opened (South Oldham in '89, North Oldham in 2003) during a period of intense growth in the county, so the talent drain was offset by new folks moving in........

3 hours ago, Hoopstars said:

Slippery slope reporting unsourced gossip about issues with a  specific teammate and the root cause.  Whether intentional or not, and despite trying to be subtle, some of your Oldham posts seem very personal and agenda driven as it relates to  Max. 

I'll be more careful then, cause that ain't cool.  (And no, nothing personal at all, just repeating what I've heard - but as you say, that's a dangerous slope.)

13 hours ago, Falcon Pride said:

Not taking anything away from Max Green but he takes some VERY questionable shots.

He also passes up some easier ones in order to make the tougher play…

That said I would love him on my team if you had to get a shot up late!

All true.  And the things in the first part of your post have caused issues with teammates.  How big?  Not sure.  Max takes a ton of shots, and that includes some bad shots.  You might look at that and say, well, he needs to be doing that on this particular team.  And you might say, well, could they be better if he were a more constructive teammate and shared the ball more?

Regarding Dynes and whether he belongs on that  list of best players in the 8th Region.....on one hand, I like the idea of not simply looking at points per game (which we all do to an extent, understandably), and acknowledging that you can impact the game in a big way doing other things besides scoring.  And he definitely impacts the game.  On the other hand, that said, I wouldn't rank him on that list, or at least not above Green and Roberts (I can't comment on Johnson, haven't seen him yet this year).

That’s hard to believe, honestly.

1 hour ago, Basketball Jones said:

Wow. That's a fairly huge deal. Just off the top, I can't even think of a McDonald's All-American from Kentucky since Scotty Hopson from University Heights, and that had to be more than 10 years ago. Surely there's been once since then other than Sheppard.

Pretty cool.  I can’t find a listing by state. Just eyeballing rosters through the years, the last guy listed from a Kentucky high school was Chane Behanen from Bowling Green.  That was in 2011 (Hobson was in 2008)….

Yep, that would make sense (so they’ll no doubt do something else!)……

It's seemed to me that Christian Academy is the obvious candidate to move to the 29th district.  But if they were to do so, it would only leave 3 teams (KCD, Eastern, Ballard) in the 28th, which wouldn't solve anything.  Shelby County, Collins or Spencer from the 30th might make geographic sense, but I suspect none of them would want to leave where they've been - rivalries, etc.

Impact at the high school level vs college potential.  Interesting topic, always.  I am guessing in this region these are the guys who most would rank highest (not in any order):

Teagan Moore

Dallas Roberts 

Max Green

Jasper Johnson

Dylan Hammonds

There are a couple of others that come to mind,  but this is likely a near consensus view of the top 5.  After all this time (didn't he start varsity in the 2nd grade? heh), I still haven't seen Moore play.  Saw Johnson last year a couple of times, and to be honest he did not stand out to me, certainly not a kid I looked at and thought "nationally ranked".  But I hear he improves almost daily, and is a different player now.  In terms of high school vs college, Hammonds stands out.  Wonderful high school player, but at 6'4 and nearly exclusively an interior player, doesn't figure to translate to college.  You can never measure things like heart, ambition, etc., tho.  There may well be a kid out there who goes the other way - wouldn't appear on anyone's best player list in high school, but translates well to the college game.

In another thread, Runcible Owl made reference to the Massey Ratings - a name I'd not heard in years and had forgotten about, honestly.  I just looked up the KY High School Boys ratings - here:

https://masseyratings.com/hsbb/ky/ratings

Some surprising results for 8th region teams, relative to the typical "non-metric" view:

1.  Collins (#5 in the state)

2.  North Oldham (#7)

3.  Simon Kenton (#20)

4.  Grant County (#33)

5. Woodford County (#35)

6.  Oldham County (#46)

7.  Spencer County (#61)

8.  South Oldham (#72)

9.  Owen County (#74)

10.  Anderson County (#89)

Woodford County, Owen County and Anderson County stick out as the contrarian picks.  in each case strength of schedule looks to factor heavily.  Woodford's is, per these metrics anyway, the #11 schedule in the state.  Owen is at #115, and Anderson at #165.

Boy.  That’s a hard one to figure.  In the span of 6 days, Lexington Christian loses to CAL by 30 and beats OC by 25.

Ah, I see - if he made it to the Sweet 16 last year, then he very much got off to a good start, and I suspect the folks there will be patient while he rebuilds.

I remember being very surprised probably 20 years ago to read that the two largest public schools in Kentucky were in Hardin County - North and Central.  Which is why it was necessary to build JH presumably.  Not sure if the lines are drawn weirdly just because that's the way the county and demographics dictate, or if there's something else going on.  We have a similar situation in Oldham:  North is 3A, South is 5A and OC is 6A (I think that's right).

I'm pretty sure they were both in foul trouble.  I remember thinking at the end of regulation they had between them 2 points and 8 fouls.  A key point to the game - and maybe the key in my mind - was how things would go on the interior.  Amburgey is an athletic kid who fights and scraps for everything, really like him.  But, he's maybe 6'4, and there's only one of him.  Higdon and Anderson are 6'5 and 6'6, both long and athletic, and I really thought they'd make life hard for Amburgey, who is pretty much strictly an inside player.  And the exact opposite happened - he got both of them in foul trouble, he produced and they largely did not, and now you're trying to settle things on the perimeter - and that's a game where the odds are much more balanced.  I say "he" got them in foul trouble - that's not really it, it's not like he just took them both on and they kept fouling.  Rather, as I said above the defense collapsed to a good deal into the paint, and neither of Higdon or Anderson could find room to operate.  So they ran through and jumped over - and both got in foul trouble....

Is this the first year, or second, for John Hardin's coach?  I'm used to them being among the region favorites.  He's not off to a great start!

The thing I noticed about Simon Kenton that made them a little unique is the big kid in the middle takes up so much ground in the back of that zone that it allows the guards out front to extend the defense to an unusual degree.  Meaning, the other team is starting its offense closer to half court than is typical.  That does leave some room in the gap around the free throw line, but not as much as you'd think.  

I, too, think the Region is North's to lose.  But the game Friday against OC makes me less certain about that than I was previously.  Scales extends the defense - with him out, the opponent can simply crowd the paint.  North's 2 bigs - Higdon and Anderson - had 2 points between them in regulation.  Levitch has time to figure things out.  But not too much......

Yes, they do, and he must be a pretty fair coach.  At one point I thought he might get the Ballard job in the spring.  Out of curiosity I just looked up the Goodin kid’s stats, and honestly he’s putting together a really impressive season.  20 points a game, 58% from the field, 54% from 3 and 82% from the free throw line. That’s as impressive to me as a kid averaging 25 or 30 and putting up a ton of shots and shooting a lower percentage.  Still, I don’t think of him as a kid who’ll get you 5 or 6 buckets in a row during crunch time to settle the thing.  Again, not that he couldn’t……

1 hour ago, Hoopstars said:

Fair take. Three differences between south and OC in my mind. First- schedules. South is way easier. Multiple gimmees.  Records similar but how they got there not.  Secondly- I’ve said a number of times regarding OC- new coach, new system, almost all new players. Huge learning curve and tremendous opportunity to improve. Most of this doesn’t apply to south or if it does to a lesser degree.  Same coach. Same system. Lots of returners. Cake baked to a degree.  Third- impact player who can take game over. OC has it. North has it. Collins. Grant. Owen etc. and south doesn’t.  All the leads to OC getting a much greater benefit of doubt for me fwiw.   That being said- I have to admit I was wrong and south is not as bad as I thought they would be. Regarding Doss- coincidentally almost everything I said about Oldham applies to Doss!  Doss had Lex cat beat when they were winless and I think they just had desales down big and blew both games. New coach. New scheme. New players. Player who can take over. Oddly similar story to OC 

All of that is a reasonable basis to form an opinion, won’t argue with it. Regarding having someone to take over a game, of course Green, Roberts, Hammonds and  Moore can do that, and in fact have pretty often.  The kid at Collins is a good athlete and fine player, but has never struck me as the kind of offensive force (and  Collins is arguably as good or better than any of those teams).  Is that a function of his personality?  The head coach’s philosophy?  Not sure.  Splitting hairs here…..

1 hour ago, 4 Quarters said:

I was there and watched all four games yesterday, I had not seen South this year.  In my opinion Grant will beat neither of these two teams if they were to play this week.  I think also that South and Oldham County are pretty darn equal.

I’ve not seen a box score yet, but South hit a bunch of threes yesterday, and naturally they’ll look a lot better when that happens.  Henry County, God love ‘em, is pretty bad, and yet it was a 10 point game in the 3rd.  South’s point guard was out, and when he’s out they sometimes have trouble getting into their offense.  But then the 3s parade started, and it went from 10 to 30 in no time.  

All reasonable responses…..

16 hours ago, 4 Quarters said:

Darn, can Grant County really beat a decent team?

15 hours ago, Adrian Woj Burner said:

Though they have some good wins, they are yet to beat a “good” team in the 8th other than Oldham County, however they are a different monster now than when the Braves blew them out by 30+. 

 

Point 1:  watching Grant County yesterday, these two scores stood out in my mind, under the heading of "how in the world"?

Grant County 85

South Oldham 62

and 

Grant County 88

Oldham County 53

I saw the South game, and the brief explanation is, South came out looking good and was up I think 7 after a quarter.  Grant overtook them to lead by half, and was up 8-12 most of the 3rd quarter.  At some point (my interpretation) the coach was a bit ticked off by the, umm, action, and benched most of his starters for the 4th - and Grant ballooned the lead to 23 by game's end.  For the OC game, I recall hearing Hammonds (wonderful player, but was shooting 17% on threes entering the game, on very few attempts) made something like 6 of 7 treys.  

Point 2:   I'm a little surprised at the way South Oldham is viewed on this board relative to OC.  Meaning, I'm not surprised at the lack of respect for South - two bad seasons and this one is mediocre and you get respect when you earn it.  More so I'm surprised at the respect given Oldham County.  South is 10-9, Oldham County is 10-8.  They played - at Oldham - to a two point game.  Oldham lost to an 0-10 Doss team, lost to Grant by 35.  Again, not complaining about South being slighted, just surprised at the benefit of the doubt given our rival in Buckner......

1 minute ago, 4 Quarters said:

Coach Reed and his two sons are just about uncontrollable by the refs.  Now it appears the fans are joining in.  The coach was out for this and I believe the next game for technicals.

 Well, that's a sad tale.  Didn't these boys used to play for Augusta?  One of them is in my kid's grade (a junior now), so I remember him.  Good player, but not worth all of that.  I presume the coach and his kids arrived as a package deal (maybe totally erroneous assumption), so reigning them in may be difficult.  Promises made, etc.....

2 hours ago, 4 Quarters said:

I really believe that it's time that the Super of the Bracken school system addresses this issue.  It might just be getting out of control.

Not familiar with this story - what’s the nutshell summary?

I assume it’s been a while since Reed Sheppard finished a game with 4 points on 1/9 shooting.

The two younger refs are - I’ve thought this for several years - the best and most consistent officials in this region.  But I thought in both the South/OC game and the North/OC game they had poor nights.  

I haven’t seen a box score yet, and while both Anderson and Higdon scored in the extra period, I’m pretty sure at the end of regulation they had 2 points and 8 fouls between them.  Is that simply a matter of Scales not being on the perimeter, allowing OC to collapse things and crowd the paint?  That’s probably part of it.  

57 minutes ago, Hoopstars said:

This is why you should never analyze and predict with your heart….

Well, that’s sound advice - but I didn’t do anything with my heart.  That was just a big old miss.  We know plenty of kids and parents at both schools. I know both head coaches personally.  I didn’t think North would win big because I wanted them to win or wanted OC to lose.  I have thought this North team is the best team I’ve seen in the 8th Region in several years, and this is not a vintage OC team (losing to 0-10 Doss affirmed that).  Plus I just thought this was a bad matchup for OC.  Now, the team I saw tonight is not one anyone would call “the best 8th region team in several years.”  Contra, say, the Lyon County game.  Does Scales make that much difference?  Did they just have a bad night?  Just a rivalry thing?  Don’t know.  But it wasn’t the same team….