nkybball1

Based on all information I have, Lloyd, Ludlow, and Villa will continue to vote against seeding the district in the near future.

 

Personally, I think the 34th and 36th will continue to draw until the state tells them they can't anymore.

Lloyd votes to seed every year!

I would disagree. Sort of dreary and a bit dirty not to mention the worse student section in NKY.

Dirty? Are you being serious? I completely disagree with that. And you always have to mention the student section, and how it is the worst in NKY. We are not talking about the kids, we are talking about their facilities. So whatever grudge you hold with the Lloyd kids shouldn't be brought out in this discussion.

What about Scheben Gym at Lloyd High School? Plenty of seating, good concessions, good parking, good floor.

Very much a supporter of the Lloyd program and wish them all the success in the world. many friends and even some family have attended Lloyd in the past so you would be way off the mark with that comment.

Lloyds cheering section IMO is crude, vugar and offensive and what is even worse is that their administration sits there and lets them do and say the things they do and in the times I have witnessed them in action I'm not even sure anyone in charge from Lloyd is present. Lloyds cheering section is considered by many other schools to be little more then thugs and punks as you have suggested. CCH is original and fun and they have an administrator standing right in front of them if they do get off tract. Lloyds cheering section is really a rather pathetic group of about 20 or so who stay for part of the game and seem to lose interest as their team starts to lose. The cheering section is bad but what makes it worse is the Lloyd administration allowing it to happen.

 

As for your Dan Penick argument which I'm not even sure what you are talking about that whole topic has run its course. He averaged 16 pts 14 rebounds and 4 assist. He played on the Ky Allstar team against Ohio and was invited to tryout for the Ky Allstar Team to play against the Indiana team. He parlayed his outstanding high school career into a Div. I Scholarship to Morehead. Penick long ago answered some of his critics with his excellent play and I doubt that he has much concern over what 2 or 3 naysayers have to say about his play.

I was speaking about Dan Penick because you stated that the Lloyd program needs some discipline. I did not say the kids wasn't good, and deserving of a DI scholarship. What is said was is that he played 17 feet from the basket and we were talking about discipline. His coach's should have made him get in the post, since this is the 9th Region and he should have scored 20+ every night. Instead his coach's let him do what he wanted to do shooting 15 foot fadeaways, and not dominating the post. They hovered around 500 playing a DIII schedule. They should have been far better than that. Kind of talking about discipline, not the player himslef. I think he will do ok at Morehead.

You seem to enjoy getting on the Lloyd administration about the way kids act at these games. If it bothers you that much contact the school board or the high school and express your concern. You would rather get on this site and let the whole state of KY. know how you feel except for the people who can do anything about it. It is unfortunate that more fans don't come out, but that is the way things are sometimes. Kids are fickle when it comes to sports and if their team isn't so hot, they aren't coming. Hopefully that will change soon.

You may very well be right and certainly are probably closer to the situation then I but having watched them play a number of times over the past few years I would say IMO they were very undesciplined and the coach seemed to have no control whatsoever and the players seemed to respond more to their student cheering section (If that is what you want to call it) then to anything their coach may have been telling them.

 

Anyway I do hope the new coach can get the Lloyd program turned around.

In reading many of your posts you seem not to be a big Lloyd fan, which is ok. You talk about the players not being disciplined, but you are a Ludlow guy and you had a 6'9" guy playing 17 feet from the basket half speed. That seems to be ok in many peoples eyes, but I don't understand it. Seems like the coach could have better control over his player and made him get in the post and actually play hard.

As far as the student section goes, they are kids and they chant things sometimes that are inappropriate. If it were the Cov Cath kids chanting some of those things it would be ok. Those kids chant about beer and some other things that shouldn't be at high school games. But if Lloyd kids chanted about Beer and counted down to 420 then they would be thugs and punks. Figure that one out let me know.

I've not heard of Scott in the mix, but I mentioned him over Mike because Mike went to Walton. I was just bouncing Lloyd Alums off the wall to see what he thought... :thumb:

I think both the Code's are terrific! I didn't mention either one of them because they are probably pleased with their current situation. Maybe not Scott as much as Mike, but I think he will get his day, he just may not want it to be at Lloyd.

I didn't see them too many times, but did they overacheive, because when I saw the Juggs JV they seemed overmatched in a lot of areas... (not being mean, but just saying what I observed...)

What you said isn't mean at all. They were overmatched in all areas. That is why I think he did a nice job, because they had no business being in some of those games. Due to the house cleaning that took place with kids who didn't want to be there, they literally moved the whole Freshman team up to play JV. I hope it is a move that 2-3 years down the line it will pay off for that freshman group. They may not be world beaters, but will have that toughness to compete, and grind some wins out.

He did a nice job with the JV team, no doubt. Ashley is a great guy and obviously knows the lay of the land in Erlanger. I'm sure you remember his playing career, and not giving up at a young age allowed him to become a nice player in time. If he gets it, he'll have my 100% support...

If he puts the effort in coaching as he did as a player, The Juggs will be in pretty good shape:thumb:

Do you really think Lutz is the right person for the job? I've heard no para-professionals, so that eliminates Bundy. What other Lloyd Alums are out there to take the job? Tyler? Scott Code? I'm interested in your thoughts on this one...

From what I have seen, yes I do. Let's put it this way. Did you see any of the JV games this year? He didn't have a JV team he had an average Freshman team playing JV. Some of the games I saw they were somewhat competitive, and the most important thing, they didn't quit. When I say quit, i mean leaving the team. Considering the circumstances, I think he and Brauch held things together for those younger kids. Lutz has a good rapport with the kids, and they respect what he is trying to do for them. It says a lot for him as a coach wanting to take this job and try and make things right, considering he sees that the cupboard is empty for a few years. It's how things work when a person is loyal to a program. He has paid his dues as the JV coach, and he deserves the opportunity to get the whole program to become successful. Everyone knows that as the JV coach you don't have the final say on how things are going to run. The administration has to evaluate him during the interview, and how he conducts himself in the classroom to determine if he has the leadership skills to get this job done. You've got to give the guy a chance or they may lose him altogether.

I've got a better chance if they hire outside the "family"... :lol:

OOOOHHHH!!! Well if you put it that way, there may not be any coach that can help you with that:laugh:

Trent Grayson was a very strong inside player when motivated, which he played more motivated in his JR. season than he did in his senior season... thats who I was referring to...

 

I will say I exaggerated when I said one of the best in the region, but they should have at least been there and competed in the regional tournament...

 

How would I have used Charles Kinney? I would have not made him handle the ball so much, no matter who I had to get to be the PG... He tried to make to much happen with the ball, instead of worrying about what he was best at, scoring and slashing to the basket. I would have let him move without the ball a whole lot more, ran plays for him coming off screens, cuttin' to the basket, with only the occasional pull up J, becuase even though he could hit the pull up J, his strength was his athleticism which would have been best utilized cutting to the basket...

I agree with Grayson, he had a few more people in his Junior season than his senior season. With Kinney I think that happened more for him as a Senior because they had another kid who could handle the ball. He tried to do too much in certain situations, but with Evans and Grayson he tried to do what he was supposed to do and get those guys the ball. In regards to them under achieving, how many close games did they lose because of turnovers down the stretch. That team should've played in the region no question, but Michael Romes had something to do with them not getting there. If I'm not mistaken, Beechwood played CCH in the 1st round of the Region that year. So the Juggs Dream run probably ends there.

Maybe I'll coach 7th grade next year and get things back on track...

 

 

Isn't every coach in the system a Lloyd grad now that Brauch is gone???

Everyone except 1 middle school coach. Maybe if they hire within, they can make a spot for you:thumb:

Hopkins, Voght, Bradford, Webb, Lovett, Kinney, Grayson, the boys and girls CC and track teams and so on. The talent is still there, and is still doing quite well across the board. What you don't have in hoops that was there 10 years ago is Mike Code, Kevin Bundy, Rick Tyler, Jeff Jump, Chris Hook and others that developed the basketball program at the middle school, frosh and JV levels like Lloyd had in that period. It's easy to point to that small window in basketball, and wonder what went wrong. But look right before the Sheffield/Brake/Lee era and you'll see the basketball program was in as bad (if not worse) shape 13 years ago. That's when the names I mentioned took over the youth programs and got the players on the court as a team far before Varsity hoops was a concern. Coach Lucas has done a nice job with the football program, but to compare them to the big boys and say Lloyd was there with them a decade ago is also false. NCC and Beechwood owned Lloyd when they were in Class A, so it's not like this is breaking news now...

I agree with the football thing. But they also weren't losing by 60 points in the 90's, simply because they were more talented. They were competitive with those other teams. I remember that era as well, and boy it kind of goes back to the talent thing the 3 guys you mentioned were pretty good players. They made 1 run their Senior year. But to compare the recent talent to those guys, simply isn't fair. Grayson and Kinney couldn't guard Sheffied together. The coaches you mentioned, a couple have gone on to have good careers. Also 4 of those 5 are Lloyd alumni, if I'm not mistaken. They wanted to build up the program that they played for. I mentioed in a previous post that the last 3 coaches weren't Lloyd people. How long did they last? 3 years 2 and 3. then got out. That could happen again if they get someone who isn't familiar with the program and who understands that it is going to be a process to make it successful again.

The middle school program is in a league that they shouldn't be in. They compete with all the Boone and Kenton County schools, and those schools just have more to choose from. There has been a lot of growth in both counties giving those schools many more students and that has carried over in athletics. Every few years Tichenor has a team that competes in that league. The other years they get drilled. If I won 10 games over a 3 year middle school career I probably wouldn't want to play in high school either.

IMO the Lloyd program and for that matter the school itself has started to develop something of a thug reputation deservedly or not. They need a strong injection of new blood and a new attitude and an administration that will step up and say this how we are going to things and not let the inmates run the asylum. With all due respect Mr Sanders for your taking the lead on Prop 20 proposal but b4 you lead the charge on that issue you need to clean up some issues at your school that are quite apparent.

Unfortunately that reputation has been tagged to Lloyd, but I don't think it just has to do with basketball. That type of thing starts in the community and at home. If they need a stong injection of new blood, that would mean they need it at all levels in all sports wouldn't it? LHS isn't what it used to be and it hoops they need one of their own to restore that Juggernaut pride!

Apparently Gametime didn't completely agree with what was said earlier, care to elaborate?

ESPNGUY, who else beside Charles Kinney on that team could have been considered a top player in the region? I agree they under achieved to an extent, but they weren't a threat for a real strong region. They should've have been in the region tournament at least. How would you have used Charles Kinney?

:thumb:

The middle school area of Erlanger has produced some very good athletes. The problem has been for quite some time now for a good system on the high school level to attract kids to play ball there.

 

Its not only kids going to other schools, but kids who are in the halls who just don't play. Everyone knows there are athletes there due to the football teams success, they need a good personality or someone passoinate about basketball in that school.

 

I don't think they have a team that was considered for the regional title since 96 and that is a shame.

They have a had 1 legit contender in football since the 1996 team. Everyone gives them credit for being good in football, but look at the district they play in. When they play Beechwood, Dixie, NCC they get throttled. The fact of the matter is the talent level at Lloyd has just diminished. Baseball, Football, and Basketball haven't been very good. I wouldn't say it has been the basketball coach's fault that the other sports can't win. The administration needs to evaluate the overall picture before saying a coach from within the program can't succeed here. It's going to be the right guy who can make it work at Lloyd. It doesn't matter if it is someone from within or from the outside. An individual has to understand what they are dealing with here in regards to talent, then play to those kids strengths!

Didn't Shea attend Lloyd?

Possibly, but I thought he did not!

Not to step on toes, but I don't think Mr. Lutz is ready to become a Varsity Head Coach yet. Good guy, just my opinion.

 

Could be a great job for someone who could control his program and kids. There are some athletic kids at Lloyd, but getting them to come out will be the task.

I agree that this job is daunting task, but I have to disagree and say that Mr. Lutz is the right man for this job. He has a wealth of knowledge, he has been the JV coach for 3 years and from what I have seen the kids respect him. He has something over the last 3 coaches at Lloyd (Gillis, Shea, Brauch) he is a Lloyd guy! I think that carries a lot of weight. He not only wants to be successful as a coach, but he wants to succeed as an alumni. Similar to a Schlarman at Highlands, and even Brannen at NCC. If given the opportunity, I believe he will be the coach for a long time. Not someone who is there for a few years and is ready to move on. Lloyd hasn't had that stability since Bill Code. The feeder system is starting to get some young coaches involved who have a basketball background, not just someone to fill a spot. Lloyd could lose someone very loyal and very good if they aren't careful.

The problem with some parents is that their child is not even close as good as they think that they are and they seem to know more than the coaches even though they do not see their kids in practice or the others kids on the team. I have coached youth sports in the past and have seen it first hand. I do agree that the good parents far out number the bad ones.

Well Said:thumb:

Wrong on so many levels. Care to elaborate?

NO!!!

I am from Park Hills and I have heard from a few people about Lloyd's cheering section being vulgar. Now you have 3 schools including espnguy and myself.

If you haven't been to a game yourself how can you have an opinion on how they act. Once again I am not saying they are angels, but we have people on here bashing that have not been to a game :confused: I also completely agree that administration should be at these games.

I will not disagree that inappropriate behavior should be addressed. I don't know what the Lloyd administration is doing that they can't go on the road to games. You are comparing Lloyd to Cov Cath and Highlands kids, not a fair comparision. Like I said I am not an advocate of people being foolish, but this post has turned into flat out bashing on Lloyd people. The generalization of a whole school and community is classless based on what about 30 students are chanting. I'm sure the parents of these student athletes who travel all over NKY to watch their kids would love the be considered classless. I forgot Ludlow was Mayberry and is full of angels!!! Pot calling the kettle!!! We have lost focus on the terrific ballgame that happened last night. Taking away from the recognition these players deserve from both sides.

:thumb: That is the second time now this year atleast when Ludlow has played them that Lloyd student section acted like that. I would have thought that maybe that problem would have been addresed by now, but I guess not.[/QUOTe

 

I haven't heard any other schools on here get upset about the Lloyd student section. Maybe the Ludlow faithful are more sensitive that everyone else.

The juggs played a heck of a ballgame last night just came up a little short. King really hurt them in the first half and Pennick got his as everyone knew he would. Lloyd just didn't hit any shots in the second half, which is a credit to the Panthers and fatigue on Lloyd's part. I thought it was a hard fought game and wished the outcome was different. As for the officiating it they weren't bad for the most part, mid-way through the 4th it seemed Ludlow got the close ones and Lloyd didn't. It wasn't a determining factor, but you like to see consistency. I think lloyd was playing on fumes in the 4th, and johnson played hurt the whole game getting injured ealry in the 1st. My hats off to Lloyd for over coming a lot of adversity that faced that group this season. Irresponsible kids quitting and getting kicked off the team really made this a tough year for that group. Hats off to the coaching staff as well for doing the best they could under those circumstances. Congratulations on a hard fought game, and look forward to next season.

As for the student section, that was the biggest group I have seen for Lloyd all season. I am not an advocate of obscene gestures or anything of that nature, but if you don't like what they are saying don't pay attention. Watch the game. When you atart focusing on what they are saying then you might get upset. They were chearing back and forth with the Ludlow students and seem to be into the game. No one mentions the fact that the Ludlow cheerleaders were basically in Lloyd's huddle during the Girls and Boys games. The coaches had to go tell the officials to keep them away from the huddles. Sometimes kids will be kids and they are having a good time. THey shouldn't curse or make obscene gestures. Maybe Lloyd administrators weren't there, so the host school has to keep that in check.

You know, I thought long and hard about the juggs upsetting Ludlow. Even typed Lloyd behind the 2) spot. Then reality set it for me. I would love to see Lloyd win and have probably the worst record in 9th Region Tourny History making the final eight. But who do they have. Grayson: Nice player, really is and could play at any 9th Region school. Craddock: Going to be the next charles kinney. A lightning quick guard who can score inside the paint. Other than that I don't see any Juggs that can cause problems for the Ludlow Panthers. They will be too busy trying to stop Penick and King. Ludlow will win this game by a slim margin, IMO.

I agree it's slim pickins for the Juggs. However you didn't mention Charles Johnson. He can be the X factor for Lloyd. He rebounds well, and can get to the rim. I believe I saw a stat line from a game where he had 19 boards. If Grayson, Johnson, and Craddock can play well and they rebound the ball defensively, and don't turn it over they will be ok. Ludlow is awfully dangerous with the two big boys and King on the perimeter.

33rd - 1)Boone 2)St Henry

34th - 1)Dixie 2)Lloyd

35th - 1)CovCath 2) Holmes

36th - 1)Highlands 2)NewCath

It's about time the Juggs got some love from somebody coming out of the 34th