Strongest Players

[IronCat]

Are you asking what a judge is? Its kind of like a referee in the reguards that he helps regulate the rules.

 

Who are the judges? Any "Judge" from Prestonsburg sounds a little shady to me.

[Chant_50]

I agree that athletics is critical to the morale of a school. No argument there. But I'll stick by my belief that weights are better left for after school and these kids need to be getting better educated for an economy that is becoming more and more sophisticated and technical. I'd love to know the percentage of driving age kids at the rural schools that don't drive or couldn't get a ride home after weights. What do they do after football practice? Walk home? What do they do on the M, W and F that they currently lift after school? Walk home? I'm sorry, but while I understand the value of athletics, I just cannot buy the argument that we need to lift during school because of transportation issues. Heck, you should have football practice during school also if transportation issues are your justification.

 

 

 

Here is a great argument...PE classes in general are a joke...Most weight-lifting classes in order to exist are required to accept any student that registers for it. I will not de-value math, english, or any other such "traditional" course, but most high schools have a certain number of electives included in their curriculum therefore it is perfectly reasonable to say that weight-lifting is acceptable for all the same reasons as study skills, teen parenting, home ec., auto shop, or any other "elective" class one takes. Anoter positive is the fact that exercise is on the decline...especially among teens...obesity is a major killer and health problem in this country, and this state in particular. So any extra physical activity young people are offered should be relished not disdained!

[Chant_50]

 

Personally, I don't think any part of the school day should be spent on PE to be honest with you unless and until our schools start doing a better job turning out kids academically ready for college, not withstanding what Aristotle or Socrates may have written (forgive me Dr. Matheny) or what 60 Minutes may air (any other source would have had more credibility with me). I realize the PE teachers (my sister who a retired PE teacher in particular) aren't going to like that idea however. But most of the teachers I know complain that there just is not enough time available in the classroom to adequately instruct the subjects. Topics are becoming more complex and impossible to handle in the same amount of time that they used to require. CATS testing instruction takes up too much time. History classes are not even getting to current history, or if they are, they are shortchanging important segments of history. With our math, science and reading scores dropping, I just believe any emphasis placed on fluff school activities is a mistake and we'd be serving our kids better if we took that time and dedicated to more important academic issues.

 

 

 

 

 

 

The history courses need to be split in two, also the "free electives" should be cut in half to make room for classes that are two-part courses...they are trying to cram a vast amount of material into an inadequate amount of time. Cats testing has turned out to be a bad idea as well; the fact is that teachers are teaching a test toward the end of the year. I also have some inside access to a gentleman that is in the Corbin School System, and he tells me that the CATS is designed to show progress no matter what. He said the test progressively gets easier year after year or stays the same based on what the district has done in order to keep vital funding coming in. Essentially a dumbing down in the name of keeping financing. What does that benefit a student? They will memorize what they can for the test, take it, and life will go on. Learning the material is not the emphasis anymore...it is simply memorize, test, forget...repeat. Most teachers also aren't stimulating their students to think on their own either...every upper-level/AP course I had in high school wound up being a regurgatation factory. The teacher would spout his/her version of history or opinions on literature and expect the student to repeat this on tests and assignments. I guess there is no room in high school for objective education and free-thinking students, they may draw a conclusion that is not on the CATS!!!!!!!!!!!

 

 

I also played at a division-1aa college, and we got after it in the weight room. We had many 400lb. benchers, 500lb. squatters, and of course 300lb. cleaners...We also had a rare 600lb. squat, and 350+ clean, but I'll tell ya some of these numbers are a little high. In my experience a squat is thigh parallel to the ground, not hamstring...I could be from a different school but I am not so sure. Also I would love to see these cleans...are they getting a good pull, then squatting to the pull under and rack...then standing. If these numbers are acurate,and they are combined with good form these strength coaches need to move them on to more advanced power building lifts such as the snatch the clean and jerk etc. Also the future looks bright if all is on the up and up on this thread. One other coment on the 600lb. squat. I saw someone post that the kid was 310+; this sheds light on the subject doubling one's body weight on the squat is not hard to believe, but this high a weight at a H.S. age is a surprise to a lay-person. I remember when I was @ Corbin my Sr. year (2002) a good friend of mine,Bram Hoover, weiged about 170-175 his numbers were very high...squat-515,bench was somewhere in the low 3's, and clean was around 260. We used the electronic beepers on top of the thighs...thus the thigh was parallel. We also had 7-300lb. benchers, 8-400lb. and 4-500lb. squatters, and several clean #'s just under 300lb. (270-290 range) with probably a 20-25 players over the 200lb. mark. It is also worth mentioning that the heaviest of the linemen was 275...thus all the percentages were very high on the weight to strength ratio. Oh well that is all past and this post is too long...if you read it all thanks.

[Tall Trees]

The history courses need to be split in two, also the "free electives" should be cut in half to make room for classes that are two-part courses...they are trying to cram a vast amount of material into an inadequate amount of time. Cats testing has turned out to be a bad idea as well; the fact is that teachers are teaching a test toward the end of the year. I also have some inside access to a gentleman that is in the Corbin School System, and he tells me that the CATS is designed to show progress no matter what. He said the test progressively gets easier year after year or stays the same based on what the district has done in order to keep vital funding coming in. Essentially a dumbing down in the name of keeping financing. What does that benefit a student? They will memorize what they can for the test, take it, and life will go on. Learning the material is not the emphasis anymore...it is simply memorize, test, forget...repeat. Most teachers also aren't stimulating their students to think on their own either...every upper-level/AP course I had in high school wound up being a regurgatation factory. The teacher would spout his/her version of history or opinions on literature and expect the student to repeat this on tests and assignments. I guess there is no room in high school for objective education and free-thinking students, they may draw a conclusion that is not on the CATS!!!!!!!!!!!

 

 

I also played at a division-1aa college, and we got after it in the weight room. We had many 400lb. benchers, 500lb. squatters, and of course 300lb. cleaners...We also had a rare 600lb. squat, and 350+ clean, but I'll tell ya some of these numbers are a little high. In my experience a squat is thigh parallel to the ground, not hamstring...I could be from a different school but I am not so sure. Also I would love to see these cleans...are they getting a good pull, then squatting to the pull under and rack...then standing. If these numbers are acurate,and they are combined with good form these strength coaches need to move them on to more advanced power building lifts such as the snatch the clean and jerk etc. Also the future looks bright if all is on the up and up on this thread. One other coment on the 600lb. squat. I saw someone post that the kid was 310+; this sheds light on the subject doubling one's body weight on the squat is not hard to believe, but this high a weight at a H.S. age is a surprise to a lay-person. I remember when I was @ Corbin my Sr. year (2002) a good friend of mine,Bram Hoover, weiged about 170-175 his numbers were very high...squat-515,bench was somewhere in the low 3's, and clean was around 260. We used the electronic beepers on top of the thighs...thus the thigh was parallel. We also had 7-300lb. benchers, 8-400lb. and 4-500lb. squatters, and several clean #'s just under 300lb. (270-290 range) with probably a 20-25 players over the 200lb. mark. It is also worth mentioning that the heaviest of the linemen was 275...thus all the percentages were very high on the weight to strength ratio. Oh well that is all past and this post is too long...if you read it all thanks.

 

 

This is a very good post!!

 

I went to the University of Tennessee coaches clinic last weekend and listen to Johnny Long (Head Strength Coach for UT). Johnny discussed how coaches are getting carried away with the numbers that they can but up on the board. He said they do not score a TD and then call up the box to see how much he benches before they count the TD. Of the football players that are in my class, I am trying to build football players not powerlifters. How many times does a football player use a wide/normal grip bench in a game, only when he is pushing someone off him while he is getting up off the ground.

 

These numbers are really getting bigger and bigger, and times are faster and faster? Makes you wonder how legit they are.

 

These competions are good for motivation, but they need to work on other things such as plyo, Parallel squats, clean/snatch/jerk, form running, agilities,and hip work. Competations are one problem I am facing at my school as this is my first year here. The coach before only trained for wide grip bench and straddle deadlift (competation lifts) so now it is hard to get them to parallel squat and work any type of explosive hip work.

[WoodyJr]

This is a very good post!!

 

I went to the University of Tennessee coaches clinic last weekend and listen to Johnny Long (Head Strength Coach for UT). Johnny discussed how coaches are getting carried away with the numbers that they can but up on the board. He said they do not score a TD and then call up the box to see how much he benches before they count the TD. Of the football players that are in my class, I am trying to build football players not powerlifters. How many times does a football player use a wide/normal grip bench in a game, only when he is pushing someone off him while he is getting up off the ground.

 

These numbers are really getting bigger and bigger, and times are faster and faster? Makes you wonder how legit they are.

 

These competions are good for motivation, but they need to work on other things such as plyo, Parallel squats, clean/snatch/jerk, form running, agilities,and hip work. Competations are one problem I am facing at my school as this is my first year here. The coach before only trained for wide grip bench and straddle deadlift (competation lifts) so now it is hard to get them to parallel squat and work any type of explosive hip work.

 

 

OK, now we're getting to the part I like - How it applies to being a FOOTBALL PLAYER.

I've known guys whose focus is competitive power lifting and thats great. I would not at all argue that totals put up at competitions needing 2 out of 3 judges approval are usually less than what one coach @ the school gives the OK on. It's no rap on the coach or the lifter - it's just a whole different environment & situation. Actually I'd encourage players to grab a couple friends & go register for a competition somewhere just to have the experience - I think it may help your focus in daily lifting.

 

I congratulate all the high numbers listed here, but I also congratulate all the youngsters working hard to achieve "their" best number. As a fan of Ashland I'm very confident that the coaches there have an allaround first class program in place. Football is much more than total dead weight you can move - I've never seen 300lbs in dead weight lined up across from anyone. OK, well I've seen some guys who "looked" like dead weight.

Explosiveness & speed are important also and hopefully youngsters out there are working as hard at those drills their coaches have them working on.

 

I'm very happy that Ashland has rejuvenated their wrestling program [Kudos to coach Love - also strength coach extraordinare:ylsuper: ]

If it were me Id make every football player wrestle, at least recreationally, to better understand the component of football that "might" be more important than weightlifting (I'll pause while the crowd gathered collects their breath:lol: ) - it's Leverage !!!!

...invariably a wing T coach can give you a nice tutorial about leverage;)

 

Thanks to all for the great discussion on this thread. :ylsuper:

 

Cheers, Woody Jr

 

P.S. keep working Cats - remember it's not just the top lifter thats important, a team is only as strong as it's weakest link [i absolutely don't want anyone to think that means the lowest total among our linemen is a weak link, I just used the saying as a team motivator] :thumb: :thumb: :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:

[CoachJ]

Great points being made in this thread as of late as to how off-season programs really need to include MOVEMENT-STRENGTH, competitiveness, toughness, quickness, etc.

 

It all points to how truly difficult it is to construct a great off-season program. You can't try to be JUST great at the 'strength' component...you must also create APPLICATION to allow players to use that strength with COMBATIVE situations, as happen in football.

 

Then, you have to overcome the 'hurdles' to doing this...

 

1) You can't do actual "football-specific" training while doing it (leading you to wrestling and boxing...and if no wrestling program at school, you must create something yourself during weights, etc.)

 

2) you're going to have several players unable to make it to after school weights due to other sports/work/etc. (thus, the need for advanced-PE...which, in a 7-period day still only afford you barely enough time to fully get the strength component done)

 

It's tough. In some ways, it requires more creativity and expertise from a coach than IN-SEASON coaching to really get it all done and get it done in the most EFFICIENT, PRODUCTIVE way possible.

 

The great programs have a COMPREHENSIVE program in place and don't let the "competitions" they go to drive what gets done in the weight room daily. It does happen though; and I know some schools that are KNOWN for their prowess at weight competitions (and 7on7's for that matter) that somehow don't seem to be able to mimic that same success on the field.

[stifler]

My son went to Pikeville and graduated with honors. He took every AP class that the school had to offer. His "PE/Bodybuilding" class was his only "escape" of the day. Had it not been for that who knows? There is an argument for both sides of the coin. The class is good for those honor students as well, that just need to "get out some frustrations" or to break up a grueling day of classes. Just thought I'd throw in my two cents!

[Chant_50]

My son went to Pikeville and graduated with honors. He took every AP class that the school had to offer. His "PE/Bodybuilding" class was his only "escape" of the day. Had it not been for that who knows? There is an argument for both sides of the coin. The class is good for those honor students as well, that just need to "get out some frustrations" or to break up a grueling day of classes. Just thought I'd throw in my two cents!

 

 

:thumb: :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:

 

 

Well I don't really have 4 thumbs, but if I did they'd all be up to this post.

[RussellRedDevil09]

I think one of Prestonsburgs strongest players is the kicker Seth Moore. 455lb deadlift at a body weight of around 165lbs. New USPF state record for his age. I think they may want to try this kid at a few other postions this year.

 

Russells kicker dewaine evans weighs around 155 and deadlift 485 at Racelands weight meet

[leatherneck]

My son went to Pikeville and graduated with honors. He took every AP class that the school had to offer. His "PE/Bodybuilding" class was his only "escape" of the day. Had it not been for that who knows? There is an argument for both sides of the coin. The class is good for those honor students as well, that just need to "get out some frustrations" or to break up a grueling day of classes. Just thought I'd throw in my two cents!

 

That's fantastic. You have a lot to be proud of.

[CraftCreeker]

Jordan Howard for Magoffin is going to be an absoulte animal. and Curtis Bradley these guys are really strong.

[Get Off The Track]

While I was sitting here thinking of what to write I turned to see my 8 year old cousin Squat 750 pounds and bench 505 at the same time. I just thought that was impressive enough to write about so i Did. (LOL)

[Graybeard]

While I was sitting here thinking of what to write I turned to see my 8 year old cousin Squat 750 pounds and bench 505 at the same time. I just thought that was impressive enough to write about so i Did. (LOL)

 

 

Off Track - that's a good name for you. You chose well.

[Kick]

While I was sitting here thinking of what to write I turned to see my 8 year old cousin Squat 750 pounds and bench 505 at the same time. I just thought that was impressive enough to write about so i Did. (LOL)

 

 

 

That's a good one there! :sleep:

[RussellRedDevil09]

There you go! All of those weights listed on here that weren't done at one of these meets were not done properly and therefore don't count.

on Squat we used to give a little slack on how far u needed to go down but this yr our weightlifting coach is really cracking down on how ur form and everything is.