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High School Football in Kentucky - Playoff Structure


ThrowItDeep

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Thought I would throw my two cents in on the playoff structure....

This isn't a shot at KHSAA by any means. I consider Julian a good friend and he wants the best interest of football in our state. I really believe that. Not saying their hands are tied, but in a way they are...

 

I coached for 12 years as head coach at Edmonson County from 2004-2015. I'm just an AD now, but I still want high school football in our state to be the best it can be.

 

Traditionally, our school hasn't had tremendous success in the playoffs. Before the move to six classes, our school had only won 6 playoff wins (all coming in a 3 year stretch 96-97-98). There were just a handful of years where we made the playoffs. Since the move to 6 classes, we've won 5 playoff games).

 

When the talk of going to six classes was talked about, it gave schools like ours a "false" hope. It was "big" for schools like ours to MAKE the playoffs back then. So the thought of a greater possibility of making the playoffs was very, very enticing. In 2007, we even made "Playoff T-shirts" :no:... We did win a playoff game that year (infamous same district match-ups), but still... I wouldn't make shirts for it now unless I was at a place that never has made it and was building...

 

After 10 years in the 6 class system, schools like ours have seen ups and downs. We had a good playoff run in 2008, had a 10-0 year in 2011, hosted a few playoff games, won a few playoff games, had a couple years that we didn't make the playoffs. In the last few playoff trips, I can honestly say those experiences have not helped make our football program any better. After going 11-1 in 2011, we went 3-7 in 2012 and missed the playoffs (thank goodness)... We struggled through 2013 & 2014 record wise (4-6, 4-6) but still made the playoffs. We were defeated as the #3 seed both years pretty convincingly. In 2015, our team had a winning record (6-4) for the first time since 2011. We were happy with our kids efforts. But the reward was to travel to #2 seed Paducah Tilghman and get running clocked. Granted we did battle them for a little while (down 28-3 at the half). I've had many other coaching friends in similar situations as us, who told me (and I didn't agree with them then) that they wished they could have just ended the year. One school had their first winning record in over decade. They got in as #4 seed and got running clocked in the first half... He said it just killed any momentum they had going into the off-season.

 

That doesn't help football as a whole. I don't even know if it really helps the teams that win (other than adds one more win to their win column)... maybe a boost of confidence for them. But I can tell you that it totally demoralizes a team to get beat like some teams these past two weeks have been beat. I know.. I know... we should have worked harder. Well, I wished you could have been around to see our kids work. They worked HARD. Our coaches coached HARD. It didn't matter how many parallel sqauts, power cleans, plyometrics, and glute ham raises we did or how many fudge rounds and chocolate milks I gave our line... I just couldn't get my skill guys to be faster than theirs or our linemen to grow like theirs...lol

 

Football is unlike other sports. In basketball, you can hold the ball (no shot clock). Can't do that in football. In basketball, you can spread the floor and if you get in trouble, you can call a timeout. Can't do that in football. I know every other sport lets everybody in. But football never was about that. That was one of the things I always loved about it. Now, we can have 0-10 teams travel 3+ hours to get beat 50 points in the first half. Geez, we've got #3 seeds getting beat that way!!!

 

I don't know what the best answer is, but there HAS TO BE A BETTER ANSWER than what we've got going. The same teams will be successful regardless of how many classes you have. If you want to pick the 6 state champions, you can do that with a list of about 15 schools in the entire state (that number may be too high).

 

Some of me hates this. It's like taking every competitive bone out of my body. I loved competing & still do. But, there is a reason that the NFL, Division I college football, etc. don't let EVERYBODY in (I know there a few high schools teams that don't)... This isn't all about exciting games in the first round or about blowouts... That's part of it. It should be about what's best for football in our state, not just at OUR school. I can't speak for all rural schools, but there are many locally that believe the current structure is killing their football program. Maybe it's because of who they HAVE TO PLAY. Their kids know going into the season. The best we can be is a 3 seed or a 4 seed...

 

Can we get rid of districts? Allow everyone to make their own schedule. Play who your school needs to play. Let each school make the choice of declaring if they want to play in the playoffs before week 10. Can we have a playoff ranking system? Could rank the declared teams by a formula made public before scheduling begins...

 

Can we take the top two teams in each district and then let everybody else play an 11th game as a "bowl" game? Shortens the football season a week. Can either push football back a week out of the heat or end a week earlier. Win-win.

 

Any combination of any of these. There are many good suggestions that I've read on here before.

 

I don't know what it would look like but I can tell you from my standpoint, it would look MUCH better than Edmonson County vs. Paducah Tilghman.

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That doesn't help football as a whole. I don't even know if it really helps the teams that win (other than adds one more win to their win column)... maybe a boost of confidence for them. But I can tell you that it totally demoralizes a team to get beat like some teams these past two weeks have been beat. I know.. I know... we should have worked harder. Well, I wished you could have been around to see our kids work. They worked HARD. Our coaches coached HARD. It didn't matter how many parallel sqauts, power cleans, plyometrics, and glute ham raises we did or how many fudge rounds and chocolate milks I gave our line... I just couldn't get my skill guys to be faster than theirs or our linemen to grow like theirs...lol

 

Football is unlike other sports. In basketball, you can hold the ball (no shot clock). Can't do that in football. In basketball, you can spread the floor and if you get in trouble, you can call a timeout. Can't do that in football. I know every other sport lets everybody in. But football never was about that. That was one of the things I always loved about it. Now, we can have 0-10 teams travel 3+ hours to get beat 50 points in the first half. Geez, we've got #3 seeds getting beat that way!!!

 

Great post. This is the part I really wish everyone would look at.

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Thank you to ThrowItDeep for your clear and in-the-trenches perspective. Agree with you 100% and hope the KHSAA addresses it with a multi-step polling process. First step: Would you consider a Change versus No Change, with clarity in advance that the follow-up polls will give multiple options should change appear to be desired. There might be multiple polls to follow as you offer and eliminate the vaious change options until a consensus is reached as to the most desirable change. Once the desirable change is reached a final vote is taken: No change to present system VS. Desirable change proposed. Majority decides and the decision implementd.

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I've always thought that a reasonable compromise would be to eliminate the #4 (and lower) district seeds from the post-season, have the 2-3 matchup comprise the first round with the #1s getting a first-round bye.

 

You know what you say, MCPapa makes a lot of sense. I am curious if most #1 seeds would prefer the Bye, or just the two team foremat and shorten the season a full week?

In theory the Bye week gives a team a week to get healthy; but, the routine the high schoolers is completely disrupted. Always seem to hear about the rustiness of the NFL teams after their Bye week.

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You know what you say, MCPapa makes a lot of sense. I am curious if most #1 seeds would prefer the Bye, or just the two team foremat and shorten the season a full week?

In theory the Bye week gives a team a week to get healthy; but, the routine the high schoolers is completely disrupted. Always seem to hear about the rustiness of the NFL teams after their Bye week.

 

Tell that to the Parker brat.

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If schools were allowed to opt out of the playoffs, how many would choose to opt out? No penalties or repercussions for opting out. Very simply, if you don't want to participate in the playoffs, you just say you are opting out. Your season ends at game 10.

 

id say 40% or more.

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If schools were allowed to opt out of the playoffs, how many would choose to opt out? No penalties or repercussions for opting out. Very simply, if you don't want to participate in the playoffs, you just say you are opting out. Your season ends at game 10.

 

Maybe that should be an option, but a lot of coaches would get mad having to play a game week one while someone else got a bye because their opponent opted out...looking at you Brian Weinrich.

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If schools were allowed to opt out of the playoffs, how many would choose to opt out? No penalties or repercussions for opting out. Very simply, if you don't want to participate in the playoffs, you just say you are opting out. Your season ends at game 10.

 

id say 40% or more.

 

I'm suspect of this. I could see some districts opt out because of $$$$.

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I actually like the "and 1" game for teams that don't make playoffs.

 

I have been a strong advocate for getting all the schools into the playoffs and not leave any of them out. This would be so that all kids could experience a post season.

 

The original post certainly challenges that view.

 

But a more limited 'championship tournament' (playoffs) and the use of bowl-like 'and 1' games against similar strength competition would make a lot of sense.

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I have been a strong advocate for getting all the schools into the playoffs and not leave any of them out. This would be so that all kids could experience a post season.

 

The original post certainly challenges that view.

 

But a more limited 'championship tournament' (playoffs) and the use of bowl-like 'and 1' games against similar strength competition would make a lot of sense.

 

I don’t have a real issue with limiting playoff participants. I’d rather see 3 get in than just two.

 

But I’m not a fan of a “plus 1” game at the end of the year. If you’re going to do that, just keep the system the way it is.

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