Is the defensive shift bad for baseball

Page 2 of Had a discussion with a couple of neighbors last night, and an interesting point was brought up, so I thought I'd get everyone's opinion on here. The d... 29 comments | 642 Views | Go to page 1 →

  1. #16
    sweet16's Avatar
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    The hitters need to adjust just like offenses adjust in other sports.

    It's no different than a zone in other sports compared to man to man.
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  2. #17
    John Anthony's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweet16 View Post
    The hitters need to adjust just like offenses adjust in other sports.

    It's no different than a zone in other sports compared to man to man.
    Ego’s are too big to bunt.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Voice of Reason View Post
    Two points.

    1. The baseball is boring discussion is almost humorous to me. Soccer grows in popularity with 1-0, 2-1 games being almost the norm but baseball is boring. Any time someone makes the baseball is boring comment, ask them what their feelings are on soccer. Granted, many of the people may say they don't like soccer either and are comparing baseball to football or basketball. Nevertheless, the question remains, why is baseball boring and soccer growing in popularity? I contend a lot of it is in the packaging of the event. It really isn't about the game itself. It is about all the stuff surrounding the game. Baseball needs to keep making improvements in their packaging of their games to overcome the "baseball is boring" label.
    I personally put both in the same “boring” camp. I enjoy playing soccer, but other than the World Cup, not watching it. That said, with soccer you know it’s going to be 90 minutes plus stoppage. And while scoring can be low, there is pretty much something happening the whole time. Baseball can (and frequently does) stretch on for 3+ hours. And there are tons of dead spots. Baseball just feels like a much bigger time commitment and it drags so much.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by OlDog75 View Post
    I'm in the camp of if you want to beat the shift, take advantage of where they are not.
    As an old hometown hero used to say - hit ‘em where they ain’t.

  5. #20
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    And as I read this thread, why do the words Joey and Gallo come to mind?

  6. #21
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    It is bad for the Reds.

  7. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Anthony View Post
    Ego’s are too big to bunt.
    It's not about ego. If I put a shift on, and your big basher is bunting the ball, I win that battle, even if he gets on. I'm perfectly fine if he goes 4-4 with 4 bunt singles. You're still effectively taking the bat out of his hands.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by rjs4470 View Post
    It's not about ego. If I put a shift on, and your big basher is bunting the ball, I win that battle, even if he gets on. I'm perfectly fine if he goes 4-4 with 4 bunt singles. You're still effectively taking the bat out of his hands.
    That's one way to look at it especially if the guys behind you can't get you over and get you in.

  9. #24
    Voice of Reason's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rjs4470 View Post
    It's not about ego. If I put a shift on, and your big basher is bunting the ball, I win that battle, even if he gets on. I'm perfectly fine if he goes 4-4 with 4 bunt singles. You're still effectively taking the bat out of his hands.
    How about your big basher bunts? Then the guy behind him bunts. And so on. Isn't on base percentage the key stat now?

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Anthony View Post
    Ego’s are too big to bunt.
    You don't have to bunt. Hit it the other way.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by rjs4470 View Post
    It's not about ego. If I put a shift on, and your big basher is bunting the ball, I win that battle, even if he gets on. I'm perfectly fine if he goes 4-4 with 4 bunt singles. You're still effectively taking the bat out of his hands.
    Even your "big basher" is going to stay in the park more than he's not. Putting him on base every AB certainly isn't winning...

  12. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by Voice of Reason View Post
    How about your big basher bunts? Then the guy behind him bunts. And so on. Isn't on base percentage the key stat now?
    Well the shift usually doesn’t get put on with runners on, so the next guy likely isn’t bunting.

    Think about it this way. There’s no guarantee the bunt will beat the shift to begin with. Not just any bunt will do. It’s got to be a perfectly placed, hard bunt, in order to be successful. Even good bunters won’t be successful all the time, let alone someone who doesn’t bunt well. Pitchers will also be pitching up and in... not an easy pitch to bunt the other way. A Bunt hit even 50% of the time doesn’t hurt as much as an extra base hit or a home run.

  13. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheDeuce View Post
    Even your "big basher" is going to stay in the park more than he's not. Putting him on base every AB certainly isn't winning...

    True. But he isn’t going to be successful bunting all the time either. If he bunts he’s got zero chance of an EBH or HR.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by rjs4470 View Post
    It's not about ego. If I put a shift on, and your big basher is bunting the ball, I win that battle, even if he gets on. I'm perfectly fine if he goes 4-4 with 4 bunt singles. You're still effectively taking the bat out of his hands.
    So how do you deal with a healthy Yankees lineup, putting Sanchez, Stanton, Judge on without recording an out?

  15. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Anthony View Post
    So how do you deal with a healthy Yankees lineup, putting Sanchez, Stanton, Judge on without recording an out?
    I’m not. Again, as I said before, your not putting the shift on with runners on base. And your also assuming that the bunt will be successful every time. That’s not going to happen. Guys who haven’t been asked to bunt their entire lives, will not be successful even 50% of the time. It still will take a really good bunt to get on. So the real question you have to ask is would you rather have Sanchez, Stanton, or Judge bunting for a hit or swinging away. The Yankees certainly don’t want those guys bunting. Bunts have a zero chance of going into a gap for an EBH or over the fence.

    What the shift does is minimize risk for the defensive team. If he bunts, he might fail at the bunt, a bunt single doesn’t hurt you, and he WON’T Hit the ball over the fence or get an EBH. If he swings, you have a chance at taking a hit a way. If you don’t shift, you don’t tilt the odds in your favor in any way. That’s why the occasional bunt single doesn’t bother me, because bunting completely eliminates the worst outcome—-an EBH or Homer.

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