What did the recent KY Teacher Pension Protest in Frankfort accomplish?

Page 18 of I think it accomplished plenty for the other side meaning it let the Teachers vent, enjoy spring break, and now get back to work, but I have no idea wh... 318 comments | 6833 Views | Go to page 1 →

  1. #256
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    Quote Originally Posted by UKMustangFan View Post
    We're going to have to disagree that money isn't involved in the decision making process. IMO, it's naive to think that it doesn't factor in, in some manner. IMO, if it didn't pay well enough for teachers to pay bills and get by, no one would go into the field, regardless of how much they loved the kids or wanted to make a difference.

    I got into accounting for the job security. No matter what happens with the economy or the jobs market, everyone is always going to need an accountant.

    If I had decided a career field with no thought to pay or making ends meet, I'd have been a sports broadcasting or journalism major.
    I currently do not nor have I ever needed an accountant. Most of the individuals I know as friends do not need or use an account. Every single person I know though did get an education and was placed in the care of a teacher. Maybe because you are in a profession that deals with finance and I would guess maximizing and minimizing money then money holds a different place for you. I coach. Money only comes into play in the sense of if it creates a financial hardship for me and my family. Talent, staffing, administration support, community support, schedule, expectations, and community itself all come into play and are more important than pay.
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  2. #257
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    Quote Originally Posted by woodsrider View Post
    I can only speak about Henderson but if you notice on the map, Henderson is in white. That means they could survive at least 2 years. Buses still take Johnny to his road games, there may be a fee now for sports but they parents don't have to buy equipment. Can't speak to the shot clock but my guess is if they have to buy one they will get donations. Still have Prom every year. Don't think they offer Driver's Ed. No clue if they charge for a scrimmage but if they do it won't be $10, they don't charge that much to get into regular games. Fact is Henderson is far from a wealthy community. Their teachers make pretty good money and none of the things you list above is true here. If the school system needs more money to operate they need to look costs and revenue. That goes for any and all systems.
    I’m happy for Henderson County (its one of the larger school districts correct?). There are another 119 counties in the state. I am sure your statement wasn’t meant to come across in the following way. It comes across as well it doesn’t effect where I live so who cares. What PP92 is referring to a very much a reality for many schools in the state.

  3. #258
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    Quote Originally Posted by UKMustangFan View Post
    We're going to have to disagree that money isn't involved in the decision making process. IMO, it's naive to think that it doesn't factor in, in some manner. IMO, if it didn't pay well enough for teachers to pay bills and get by, no one would go into the field, regardless of how much they loved the kids or wanted to make a difference.

    I got into accounting for the job security. No matter what happens with the economy or the jobs market, everyone is always going to need an accountant.

    If I had decided a career field with no thought to pay or making ends meet, I'd have been a sports broadcasting or journalism major.
    I think you're trying to split hairs. Yes, money is involved. It is a job...you get paid. However, when most people say they took the job "because of the money", it's because their getting a good amount compared to what they're used to. Now, what they're used to may be based upon their previous job(s), or maybe what their parents earned. A Bill Gates type doesn't give up a multi-million dollar a year salary to take a $200,000 salaried job "because of the money". However, some middle class kid fresh out of school would gladly take the same job, for the same amount, and be 100% correct in saying he/she's taking it "because of the money."

    If you want to boil it down, for me, when someone says they're in it "because of the money", it's a job that they can (at least in their eyes) get rich from. That may be the determining factor in some eyes. Others, such as yourself, may say that having job security is more of a determining factor. While others, such as the sports broadcasters, may say they get to do something that they absolutely love, love, love.

    But, regardless of what your main determining factor may be...there's still going to be a financial threshhold that's going to have to be met. So, that's where the money comes back into play. Your job as an accountant may be 100% secure for the next 50 years, but if the pay went down to minimum wage, that suddenly wouldn't be looked at as an attractive career option for you, would it.

  4. #259
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    Quote Originally Posted by PurplePride92 View Post
    Iím speaking as to what could happen money wise if budgets are cut for a lot of public schools here in the state. Right now, what your post says happens everywhere. If the cuts come a lot of changes will be made when it comes to spending money in the future. My post illustrates some of those possible changes school districts will have to make to do things like purchase new books or supplies so the kids can be educated. Nothing I said is happening now but if budgets are cut there will be some extremely unpopular moves made in the future that will affect parents and students financially.
    Of course those things could happen. Changes happen all the time. When that happens you reevaluate your situation and make changes where needed. My point was there are several counties on that map that would be solvent. Why is that?

  5. #260
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    Quote Originally Posted by barrel View Post
    I currently do not nor have I ever needed an accountant. Most of the individuals I know as friends do not need or use an account. Every single person I know though did get an education and was placed in the care of a teacher. Maybe because you are in a profession that deals with finance and I would guess maximizing and minimizing money then money holds a different place for you. I coach. Money only comes into play in the sense of if it creates a financial hardship for me and my family. Talent, staffing, administration support, community support, schedule, expectations, and community itself all come into play and are more important than pay.
    All businesses need accountants. While true that a lot of individuals don't have a "need" for accountants, lots of individuals that don't use them leave money and deductions and credits on the table when it comes to tax time.

    Money makes the world work. Everything needs money to function. So many people say money doesn't matter. Money matters in everything. You say you coach. For kids to play a sport, they need equipment. That takes money. They need a field or space to play. That takes money to upkeep. They need transportation. That takes money.

    Now not everything has to be about the money, I agree, but let's not downplay it's significance in the world either.

  6. #261
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    I stated earlier that I fully support public schools & funding of public schools, but I also believe that a lot of the funding is improperly funneled.

    Some stats to explain what I mean: From 1950 to 2009, student population in American schools increased 96%. In that same time period, teacher positions increased 252%. Also in that same time period, the non-teaching positions increased 702%.

    There is a lot wrong with that.


    The hidden half: School employees who don't teach | The Thomas B. Fordham Institute

  7. #262
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    Quote Originally Posted by barrel View Post
    Iím happy for Henderson County (its one of the larger school districts correct?). There are another 119 counties in the state. I am sure your statement wasnít meant to come across in the following way. It comes across as well it doesnít effect where I live so who cares. What PP92 is referring to a very much a reality for many schools in the state.
    That wasn't my point. Forget Henderson and look at Ohio Co then. They are also solvent. Henderson County's population is about 45,000. They are probably in the top 30 for size. It's only seems like a larger district because we only have 1 high school (1900-2000 kids). But there are plenty of counties that bigger in terms of population. Maybe Henderson is collecting more local school tax money than most. Who knows. My point is this, if your district is facing cuts from the state you will need to figure out a way to fix it locally. Yes, those things that PP92 listed could happen. My point was there aren't happening today in Henderson and this system is solvent for at least the next 2 years.

  8. #263
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    Quote Originally Posted by UKMustangFan View Post
    All businesses need accountants. While true that a lot of individuals don't have a "need" for accountants, lots of individuals that don't use them leave money and deductions and credits on the table when it comes to tax time.Money makes the world work. Everything needs money to function. So many people say money doesn't matter. Money matters in everything. You say you coach. For kids to play a sport, they need equipment. That takes money. They need a field or space to play. That takes money to upkeep. They need transportation. That takes money. Now not everything has to be about the money, I agree, but let's not downplay it's significance in the world either.
    I would guess more people that I know use an accountant for taxes than don't.

  9. #264
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    Quote Originally Posted by CincySportsFan View Post
    I think you're trying to split hairs. Yes, money is involved. It is a job...you get paid. However, when most people say they took the job "because of the money", it's because their getting a good amount compared to what they're used to. Now, what they're used to may be based upon their previous job(s), or maybe what their parents earned. A Bill Gates type doesn't give up a multi-million dollar a year salary to take a $200,000 salaried job "because of the money". However, some middle class kid fresh out of school would gladly take the same job, for the same amount, and be 100% correct in saying he/she's taking it "because of the money."

    If you want to boil it down, for me, when someone says they're in it "because of the money", it's a job that they can (at least in their eyes) get rich from. That may be the determining factor in some eyes. Others, such as yourself, may say that having job security is more of a determining factor. While others, such as the sports broadcasters, may say they get to do something that they absolutely love, love, love.

    But, regardless of what your main determining factor may be...there's still going to be a financial threshhold that's going to have to be met. So, that's where the money comes back into play. Your job as an accountant may be 100% secure for the next 50 years, but if the pay went down to minimum wage, that suddenly wouldn't be looked at as an attractive career option for you, would it.
    Don't disagree with anything you said here.

    And I'm not trying or meaning to split hairs. Sorry if it's come across that way.

    All I've been trying to point out is that money does matter. It may not be the overwhelming driving force behind a decision, but money is a part of every decision someone makes, including what profession you get into.

  10. #265
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    Quote Originally Posted by woodsrider View Post
    I can only speak about Henderson but if you notice on the map, Henderson is in white. That means they could survive at least 2 years. Buses still take Johnny to his road games, there may be a fee now for sports but they parents don't have to buy equipment. Can't speak to the shot clock but my guess is if they have to buy one they will get donations. Still have Prom every year. Don't think they offer Driver's Ed. No clue if they charge for a scrimmage but if they do it won't be $10, they don't charge that much to get into regular games. Fact is Henderson is far from a wealthy community. Their teachers make pretty good money and none of the things you list above is true here. If the school system needs more money to operate they need to look costs and revenue. That goes for any and all systems.
    Henderson is in the top 20% of Per Capita income in KY, so compared to some counties they are wealthy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by UKMustangFan View Post
    All businesses need accountants. While true that a lot of individuals don't have a "need" for accountants, lots of individuals that don't use them leave money and deductions and credits on the table when it comes to tax time.

    Money makes the world work. Everything needs money to function. So many people say money doesn't matter. Money matters in everything. You say you coach. For kids to play a sport, they need equipment. That takes money. They need a field or space to play. That takes money to upkeep. They need transportation. That takes money.

    Now not everything has to be about the money, I agree, but let's not downplay it's significance in the world either.
    Let's also not downplay teachers, and the important role they play in everyone's life. And that's what seems to be the common theme....the belief that teachers are easily replaceable, or are already overpaid for what they do, and should just drop their protest and get back to work.

  12. #267
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    Quote Originally Posted by woodsrider View Post
    I would guess more people that I know use an accountant for taxes than don't.
    Same here. And most that don't, are asking questions of friends and family that happen to be accountants.

  13. #268
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    When you said everyone I took that as you saying every individual person. Which is incorrect. Businesses do in a majority of cases but to use that to say everyone does need them is extrapolating that out a bit.

    No one is saying there is no need for money. No one is saying that money is not a required to function in society. What people are saying is it is not the deciding factor nor the driving force why people do everything (including profession).

  14. #269
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    Quote Originally Posted by UKMustangFan View Post
    Same here. And most that don't, are asking questions of friends and family that happen to be accountants.
    Or they learn on their own, have someone teach them or through job experience. You learn the same way you go about learning anything else. That does include for some asking people who are experienced and educated in the field. Like an accountant or a teacher.

  15. #270
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    Quote Originally Posted by TAC View Post
    Glad to hear the public schools worked out well for your kids. You can thank me for the contribution. The teachers at the private schools my kids went to make far less than the public school teachers with similar rank and their post work benefits are terrible in comparison. Maybe for some its not all about the money?
    Your tax contribution helped make that private school possible. All those special ed kids go to public schools and private schools don't spend time and resources educating them. All those children from tough economic and family situations who can't afford private schools, the public schools teach them. All those discipline problems, you get to tell them goodbye and wish them good luck in public schools. No need to say thank you for your contribution because your tax dollars are just another part of the cost to get the private school experience you wanted. Without your tax dollars, your private school isn't possible. However, any thanks that you want to say to public schools for making that private school possible are appreciated.

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